Why don't Dominicans manage?

Fred

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It was posted that their are plenty of opportunities in the DR. Then my question was, how come Dominicans in their own country cannot manage?

The reply was that that is something for another post. So does anyone have any comments or answers?
 

Redscot

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Dec 10, 2004
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Loaded topic

First off I see many Dominican's manageing just fine, so it's a dangerous topic if we are going to paint it with a broad stroke. In the spirit of conversation though one attitude I have witnessed that impede's some Dominican's from manageing is a lack of faith that they can get ahead here.

For instance, my wife has a young woman who she helped raise in Cotui. She sacrificed much for her providing her with a basic education, food, shelter etc. She also paid for her to train in Hair care, beauty salon work. Now, this young woman has clientele all over Cotui but has not taken the steps to improve her work environment. She has a ramshakle little hut with no air flow, uncomfortable chairs, no real equipment etc., but she still manages to eat and pay rent etc. However she spends all of her time trying to find a way out of the country, whether to Europe to work in "hair care", ;) , or in Yola to Puerto Rico. So, a month ago she find's enough people to lend her money (we were notone of them) and comes up with $40,000 peso's to get onto a "reliable" Yola and off she goes. 3 day's later after running out of gas in the Mona passage and nearly dieing they are picked up and returned to the Dominican Republic. She was quite traumatized, however she is ready to go with the experience again. Now, IF she had taken that $40,000 and invested it in her business she would be set for life here. She has a commodity that is in high demand and she does a good job at it. It is the furthest thing from her mind though... she just cannot visualize bettering her situation in her home country.


Ian
 

Dragonfly32837

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For every story of someone not managing there is one of someone managing. That is why I'm just going to stay out of this thread.
 

palmiche

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Fred said:
It was posted that their are plenty of opportunities in the DR. Then my question was, how come Dominicans in their own country cannot manage?

The reply was that that is something for another post. So does anyone have any comments or answers?
You'll have to explain the meaning of "manage" and compared to what.

If we see "dominicans" with our 1st world eyes and believe that they shall have our standards then we'll see that they're are not "managing". Not everyone buys into the "consume society" or believes that "quality of life is measured by how much you make or the size of your mortgage and monthly payments"

I remember a client telling me "how poor the dominicans were" and then told me that his credit cards were max and unable to pay the monthly rent. Who is poorer? I see people posting on this forum pretending to be affluent and feeling sorry for the dominicans because they come from a rich, 1st world country. 1st world, rich countries are full of poor people, espiritually, obese,drugaddicts and having a negative "net worth". Aren't we attracted to the Dominican way of life because of the "quality of life" found here?
 

heldengebroed

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I want to put a personal point off vue here. I found out that the majority of Dominicans that i've met have 2 things in common . First off all their spirit and "joie de vivre" and second their lack off problemsolving skills for those problems that involve medium or long term planning.

Greetings


Johan
 

Ken

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I think it is common for poor people, whether Dominican or some other nationality, to be so focused on getting through today that they are unable to worry about the long term. Just getting enough food, medical attention, etc., to meet their immediate needs is enough for many.
 
L

LarrySpencer

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palmiche said:
I remember a client telling me "how poor the dominicans were" and then told me that his credit cards were max and unable to pay the monthly rent. Who is poorer? I see people posting on this forum pretending to be affluent and feeling sorry for the dominicans because they come from a rich, 1st world country. 1st world, rich countries are full of poor people, espiritually, obese,drugaddicts and having a negative "net worth". Aren't we attracted to the Dominican way of life because of the "quality of life" found here?
Hence the reason I will move there in five weeks. My way of life here is extremely hectic...

At the moment I am nearly killing myself for nearly no reward. I work my regular job in the day time, get off from the and go to another and then at two in the morning, I get for yet another. While this is certainly not the norm here, it is practically necessary for one who is saving for a wedding, and to there, and to live for awhile. Although I know I will have to work while I am there, I am happy to know that I will have a decent job for four days per week and together with my wife will make plenty to have a decent roof over our heads, food in our stomachs, for the utilities, etc. So in this aspect, yes managing is easy....However, I must agree that many also view leaving, rather than trying to make things better, as to best option. My wife is one of them. While here for two years, it was her dream to return home and make changes....until she saw the contrast of home and the U.S.

Isn't it funny that first coming her, people don't realize how good it is, but when they arrive somewhere else, they realize very quickly.....how easy it is to run to WalMart, the supermarket (a real one) or taco bell and pay less than an hours wage for a meal. This isn't the case in the Dominican Republic. If you want to go and eat at Burger King, you better work for the entire day before you can afford one hanburger. No wonder why they give up. Now I have to work each day to try and get my wife to keep looking toward her goal of making her country a little better.
 
L

LarrySpencer

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heldengebroed said:
I want to put a personal point off vue here. I found out that the majority of Dominicans that i've met have 2 things in common . First off all their spirit and "joie de vivre" and second their lack off problemsolving skills for those problems that involve medium or long term planning.

Greetings


Johan
Exactly...like actually planning something and getting it to start on time! I dont' know how many dinners and functions I have been to that were supposed to start at a certain time only to start an hour or two later....just because. If you ask, no one has a true explanation....that's just the way it is.
 

trina

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Fred said:
It was posted that their are plenty of opportunities in the DR. Then my question was, how come Dominicans in their own country cannot manage?

The reply was that that is something for another post. So does anyone have any comments or answers?

You.just.don't.get.it. When you walk a mile in their shoes, you may be better equipped to try to understand, but until you attempt to see where they are coming from, you're never going to get it. You always criticize Dominicans, yet have no idea what it's like to be in their shoes. You compare all Dominicans to the experience you've had with your wife's family, and that's not fair. You also cannot compare them to the story of your father, because we all know that was many years ago, and everyone around him all over the world was going through the same trials he was. Education for our fathers was never as important as it was for us, the ability to survive, however, was. Compare Dominicans with other third-world countries, and compare apples to apples, not to us, because a whole lot has to change in the country before they ever come close to living as we do. With the lack of education, resources, and overwhelming poverty Dominicans face, it's tough for any of us to understand why they cannot evolve from the vicious circle they are in. When parents force children to work instead of going to school because putting food on the table is more important at the time than thinking about the future, how well-equipped is your average Dominican going to be able to "manage", as you call it? Who has taught them what to do with the resources they have? The vast majority are not University-educated. Even University-educated teachers and nurses only make around $10,000 RD/month. Now you go down there, and you try and live and support a family of 4 on $10,000 RD/month, and let's see how well you "manage".
 

miguel

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Jul 2, 2003
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Explain!!!

Fred said:
It was posted that their are plenty of opportunities in the DR. Then my question was, how come Dominicans in their own country cannot manage?

The reply was that that is something for another post. So does anyone have any comments or answers?
Before I go and post one of my looooong post, please explaing to me what do you mean by "MANAGE". Manage what?. Is it manage to survive?. It is manage a business?. What?.

BTW, since you did not say "some Dominicans", I am taking it that you meant "all Dominicans".
 

crm

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To the OP I think that the people of this side of Hispianola manage just fine.

Drive around SFM, Santiago and SD can you tell me that YOU could afford the cars that you see every where ? Even if you take away the top 10-15 % of this country economically there are lots of Dominicans who "MANAGE"
I am constantly amazed at the resiliancy of the majority of Dominicans. I am always impressed with how families pool income to give the appearance of a lower middle class life style, even though at times no one in the house hold makes more than 10 k a month. I am amazed at the effort that many young students make to go to university even though the job market is admittedly difficult. I am amazed at how moms in poor barrios "manage" to keep their kids fed and dressed well while working and having to deal with deadbeat drunk husbands. I am not impressed by your comments.

I have seen been in other parts of the world that are far poorer and feel that this country has a lot going for it. And please if you are so much better why dont you come here and try and work for a living in this country I'd love to see how you would manage
 

Fred

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You are so quick to vilify

First of all I ran a business for more that two years in the DR. Called La Paloma. So buy you saying Go Down there are see you make out is an empty statement.


Secondly, my partner was electrocuted and my father was pronounced terminally ill. Also, I would not start a family unless I was financially stable. Period!! I wouldnt want my kids to suffer. So now you can walk a mile in my shoes!!


I started this post not to put down Dominicans but to get a better understanding of their mentalilty. My father used to work shift work, 3 different shifts. Plus, went to college in between. All the while supporting 3 children.

How many Dominican men make that kind of sacrifice?


Last long weekend we went to New York and visited Washington Heights, a prodominantly Dominican enclave in New York.

I was amazed at 3.00pm in the afternoon the amount of young able Dominicans both male and female hanging around either the bodega street corner or beauty parlor.

When was the last time you saw Chinese, or East Indians doing this?
 

trina

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Fred said:
First of all I ran a business for more that two years in the DR. Called La Paloma. So buy you saying Go Down there are see you make out is an empty statement.

Again, Fred, you are not comparing apples to apples. You did not grow up in poor conditions without education like most Dominicans, and even IF you were Canadian poor, you were not Dominican poor. Period. You were able to "manage" because you had resources, like education. Simply comparing yourself to Dominicans does nothing for trying to understand where they are coming from.
 

DominicanWife

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Ignorance

:lick: Sheer ignorance seems to be the issue!!! I have been married to a Dominican for several years and have read several threads over the years. I never respond but to this I must!!!!

You cannot compare Dominicans to Americans or Canadians on an equal. That is just plain wrong. Perhaps you compare Dominicans to say Cubans... It's all in the latin world people. Relax and "take er easy". Sure they don't have a pot to **** in but do you ever take note of their spirits? Happy as a pig in $#!t... Sure the majority don't have the bling, they don't have the cars or the glam, or for that matter the brand name clothes, but they do have what most of us North Americans lack.... a sense of calm, a sense of family... and most of all "NO STRESS". If I could say the most valuable lesson learned from my husband... that is to relax.. don't get so uptight.. tomorrow is another day. For those Dominicans that do have money (they got out or have family in another country to help) guess what.. they still are the same old Dominicans.. !!!! It's the culture people, the culture!!! YOU CAN'T CHANGE THAT NOR DO I UNDERSTAND WHY YOU WOULD WANT TO!!!!

Now I must admit, I have it all. A home in Canada, 2 homes in the Dominican, and well 1 home (family home) in the heart of Dominican, and do you know where I enjoy the most? My home in Salcedo Dominican Republic.. a tiny 2 bedroom home, with no running water.. why do you ask? Because I can relax here, the neighbours aren't gonna steal whatever I have there, heck they'd be more apt to come on in and help me out..

Until you really experience the Dominican lifestyle 100% straight up in the heart of it all the ever so intimidating to tourist "CAMPO" I would suggest you just count your blessings and keep on doing that.

I would love for each and everyone of you to go backpacking across Dominican.. through the mountains etc.. just to get the real view.
 

trina

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Secondly, my partner was electrocuted and my father was pronounced terminally ill. Also, I would not start a family unless I was financially stable. Period!! I wouldnt want my kids to suffer. So now you can walk a mile in my shoes!!
Good for you, you can afford birth control, medical procedures, and can get past any act of God he decides to throw at you, I guess.


I started this post not to put down Dominicans but to get a better understanding of their mentalilty. My father used to work shift work, 3 different shifts. Plus, went to college in between. All the while supporting 3 children.

How many Dominican men make that kind of sacrifice?
Making Canadian wages, I presume? A little better than $350-$400 Cdn/month, for a 40-hour week, I'd say. People in these jobs many times work more than a 40-hour week, because they HAVE to, if they are lucky enough to find a job, they have to do everything in their power to keep it. It is an Employer's market there (in the DR), definitely not the Employee's market we enjoy.


Last long weekend we went to New York and visited Washington Heights, a prodominantly Dominican enclave in New York.

I was amazed at 3.00pm in the afternoon the amount of young able Dominicans both male and female hanging around either the bodega street corner or beauty parlor.

When was the last time you saw Chinese, or East Indians doing this?
So during the weekend, at 3:00 in the afternoon, what did you expect them to be doing? Is it a crime to get your hair done on the weekend? Are they bad people for doing so? Why does this have to be a cultural thing? I also know many Chinese and East Indians, and the ones that I know also spend time with their families "hanging out" and at their family's businesses. I don't get your point...
 
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Fred

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Where is there an employees market here? Maybe you should try looking for a job and see how much competition there is.

What I meant by people hanging around the street corner in the middle of the afternoon is that most people that have responsiblities at that time are working! they dont have time to hang around.

" Because I can relax here, the neighbours aren't gonna steal whatever I have there, heck they'd be more apt to come on in and help me out.. "


Had a rented house in Santo Domingo, the neighbours stole my shoes and even my garden hose. The woman I was living with got upset that I lent the hose to the neighbour say: They have more than we do"

Relax and "take er easy". Just wait until you have a some kind of emergency ie fire or accident. I myself saw and entire block burnt down by the time the fire department responded. Those poor families lost their entire belongings.


Furthermore, you cannot compare Cubans to Dominicans. They may share some of the Carribean culture ie food and family, however, you sit down with the average Cuban you can have a more intelligent conversation on a wide variety of topics than you can with the average American.

For those Dominicans with money, they treat the rest of the population very badly.
 

trina

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Fred said:
Where is there an employees market here? Maybe you should try looking for a job and see how much competition there is.

What I meant by people hanging around the street corner in the middle of the afternoon is that most people that have responsiblities at that time are working! they dont have time to hang around.

Come to Calgary, you see a "help wanted" sign in almost every window. Unemployment rate is 3.4%. Definitely an Employees Market. Since you're Canadian, I'm assuming you're talking about Canada, and I believe everywhere in Canada with the exception of the Maritimes has an Employee Market. Canada's National Unemployment rate as of September is 6.7%, which supports my opinion.

As for Dominicans hanging around the street on the weekend, not working??? Call me lazy, I only have one full-time job, one part-time job, 3 children, as well as being Volunteer Treasurer of a local foundation, but the LAST thing on my mind on the weekend at 3 in the afternoon, especially a LONG weekend, is WORK.
 

trina

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As for looking for a job, I was on mat leave and decided to go back to work in June. I had the luxury of being able to pick and choose jobs because I could have decided to take a full year for mat leave. I saw a job description that I liked, and I applied for it. The first and only position I applied for, was offered to me, and I accepted it. While I was extremely lucky because I love my job, this story is often heard where I live.

People in the DR often have to work for at least a month, unpaid training, because it's the only thing that they can get. I think that would be borderline illegal here, so again, don't compare apples to oranges.
 

Fred

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My mistake

That was on a Monday, not the weekend. My mistake. Try to find a job in Toronto that pays half decent. You will be in for a big surprise.

The competition is very tough.


Also, I used to work for an airline. I dealt with the Dominican Republic on a daily basis. The companies name was Swiss Port Dominicano. Let me tell you those Dominicans that were in business did not have the manana or take it easy attitude. They were diligent astute business people.