Why the DR is showing preference to its foreigners with residency

John Boyter

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Although I may sound like a disagree.... I understand the expat contribution

I just don't feel it is as significant as others do.... not insignificant , but not that large.

The AI's have all that employment... all that food (what? 30-35% of the production?)....
Liquor sales..... excursions ....
Huge spinoffs.

Long reaching tentacles and numbers that expats do not have.

Yes, I favor an easier residency process - and hope to see some ideas from Abinader et al.

Nonetheless, the current programs are aimed at the tourism industry - not Migracion
That in itself indicates where the numbers are.

Here - we are all guessing - I doubt the gov't is guessing as much as we are
They have a better book of numbers.... hopefully
They should both make the residency process easier and permit tourists to stay up to a year like the digital nomad visas being offered in many countries now.
 

John Boyter

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Yes, I agree that there seems to be "Part Two" and I wonder what is her motivation? Why the urgency? Like buying a "hot" stock? LOL
Its not a hot stock at all. Wait. And this idea that expats are not important is stupid. They all came first as tourists and that is considered important but not when they stay longer then. I don’t know how someone can say its not important to make people feel comfortable and want to stay longer.
 

johne

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Its not a hot stock at all. Wait. And this idea that expats are not important is stupid. They all came first as tourists and that is considered important but not when they stay longer then. I don’t know how someone can say its not important to make people feel comfortable and want to stay longer.
My remarks were stated as such because she is a promoter. Checkout the status picture in the upper left corner of the OP. Then go to the web site. You'll understand what I mean. The OP is self serving, albeit good advise, but a solicitation non-the-less IMHO.
 

MikeFisher

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as for the video, that's a advertising of a immigations lawyer office.
it's nice done, it show's the mostly english speaking future expats that they find here in DR perfectly english speaking lawyer assistance for such things.

as for the comparison of real settled-in Expats/legal Residents to a tourist,well, such epat bring's the DR for sure at least the $$ as minimum 100 Tourists could.
but the expat is bringing that $$ steadily, always.

I spend for monthly expenses here with my small family for the basics like school, maintaining a car, rent, grocery shopping, clothes etc etc around $30KUS per year.
that's me, one Expat, the only one in the family who make's money, as my wife is the house wife and kids are in school.
a tourist comes for a week or two, very most northamerican tourists visiting PC come for only 4-6 nights per Year, summing 6 millions of such tourists per year for the DR.
such tourist spend's to the DR(NOT to their touroperator or hotel managing/owning corporation abroad etc) what, $300-maximum $500.-US per guest reaching the DR due taxes, excursions, drinking and eating outside the AI Resort etc etc?
so we need 100 tourists to bring the DR the same money as the fishing expat does, but I do so guaranteed all year long, constantly.
I bet if some smart guy does a real professional in dept reserach on the impact of such Epxat dollars, that I do also assure the DR the same number of Employment than those 100 tourists do.

we have 60.000 legal residentsin DR, each contribute's to the DR Economy the same amount as i do per family, valid the contribution of 100 tourists,
means the 60.000 residents equal the contribution of 6.000.0000 Tourists.

this is just a vague comparison, not every expat spend's with his small family 30K$ per year for a living, some spend well less but others also sped waaaay more, i know some who spend solely for their rental more than I spend every year for everything, so i would guess i am not that far away from an average resident level.
what i did not sum in my resident/expat yearly expenses is the every year done extras to spend, like every few years buying an new(less old used) vehicle, a new fridge, TV, all that extra stuff not counted in the normal monthly expenses, while the tourist speds just those few hundreds per head and ya, thats it.
and i did not take into count that i run a business and have employees, but solely due the constant spending money all year long a 60.000 residents will asure a similar amount of employment in the DR as Tourim does with 6.000.000 tourists visiting.

I personally think that the Resident community is indeed a significant power within the huge DR economy, Including during hard times like this Pandemic, hence the moneys send into the DR are rising numbers, a booming sector during low economy times.

abolutely without any doubt from my side,
the DR has to push back up Tourim as quick as possible, doen't matter how much moneys have to be invested from the government's side, all the employment and production of so many sectors like agriculture, construction, service sectors etc etc etc are urgently needed to be back and running, as that large number of actually unemployed citizens then will be an other additional Significant force to spend money on daily bases on the DR economy.
 

John Boyter

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I would argue tourism and the expats who come and stay longer as a result of it has a huge impact on the economy. And you can’t really separate one group from the other. There is that grey area we keep arguing about where visitors go from tourists to being expats.
 
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cavok

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Although I may sound like a disagree.... I understand the expat contribution

I just don't feel it is as significant as others do.... not insignificant , but not that large.

The AI's have all that employment... all that food (what? 30-35% of the production?)....
Liquor sales..... excursions ....
Huge spinoffs.

Long reaching tentacles and numbers that expats do not have.

Yes, I favor an easier residency process - and hope to see some ideas from Abinader et al.

Nonetheless, the current programs are aimed at the tourism industry - not Migracion
That in itself indicates where the numbers are.

Here - we are all guessing - I doubt the gov't is guessing as much as we are
They have a better book of numbers.... hopefully
I think you're missing the forest for the trees. Over $800 million dollars/yr is nothing to snivel at. Money from both tourists and expats goes into the economy. Think of all the food and liquor expats buy. Gas stations, restaurants, clothing, appliances, mechanics, pharmacies, medical care, on and on.

All that money is going into the economy and to many places that money from the AI's never reaches. Also, a good portion of the money from tourism goes into the pockets of the corporations and shareholders of the hotels. Money from expats all goes directly into the economy.
 
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william webster

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Well, I think I'm right in the food at 30-35% of the production....was posted early on in this thread, I think
That plus the alcohol ( my guess is an AI visitor out drinks a resident regularly)
All the internal hotel jobs.... airport staff handling the arrivals...

It's a big infrastructure that forest..... massive

The trickle down from that volume is what I'm talking about - $$ that stay here and don't go back a foreign owner.

Anyway- we all agree that a 'kick start' is needed here..... pretty soon
 
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cavok

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Well, I think I'm right in the food at 30-35% of the production....was posted early on in this thread, I think
That plus the alcohol ( my guess is an AI visitor out drinks a resident regularly)
All the internal hotel jobs.... airport staff handling the arrivals...

It's a big infrastructure that forest..... massive

The trickle down from that volume is what I'm talking about - $$ that stay here and don't go back a foreign owner.

Anyway- we all agree that a 'kick start' is needed here..... pretty soon
I disagree. The "AI Forest" is a fairly small "woods", although a large amount of money does go there. Money from expats goes into a much broader spectrum of the economy.
 

MikeFisher

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I would say that the money of both, Residents and Tourism, goes into the full whole wide spectrum of the forest.
both consume, paid for here direct in DR and both create employment which give local citizens money at hand to be spent in the DR direct.
both sides asist every mecanic place, rice plantation, chicken farm, tarnsportation sector, hospital sector, ANY sector existing in the country get's benefits from Both groups.
 
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windeguy

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What is being missed here is how much money the government gets in revenue. A foreign resident pays hardly any taxes except for any consumption taxes they pay at the same regressive rates that Dominicans pay.

The government takes in about $40 US for each tourist that enters and then leave the DR. That is what the government has a focus on getting busines back up into the millions of AI tourists. That is why the tens of thousands of residents don't get the focus of the millions of AI tourists.
 

william webster

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No, that has been pointed out...

What is missing here is the support system/infrastructure for the hotel sector

That system supports a population of 6-7M people
It cannot equate to the expat 60,000 mentioned here.... much less support needed

The 6-7M tourist population is almost equal to the entire country's population.
Practically doubles the support requirements

60,000 expats !!???
Don't need much
 

MikeFisher

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What is being missed here is how much money the government gets in revenue. A foreign resident pays hardly any taxes except for any consumption taxes they pay at the same regressive rates that Dominicans pay.

The government takes in about $40 US for each tourist that enters and then leave the DR. That is what the government has a focus on getting busines back up into the millions of AI tourists. That is why the tens of thousands of residents don't get the focus of the millions of AI tourists.
a entering tourist pays $10.- total, of which at the private airports like PC and La Romana half get's to the airport owners, not ot the DR Government.
the a similar "sharing"goes for the $20.- airport taxes paid on Exit.

as a Resident, almost all money I spend on daily bases, is also producing tax income for the DR government, because most of my expenses include the usual DR Taxes on those products.
AND, as a Resident, I earn 100% of my income in the DR, so aside of spending my money for Taxed products, I first pay full taxes when I make the money, before i can use the rest to spend it on again Tax producing purchases.
tourist money did never produce any tax for the DR goovernment, that money been earned and taxes paid for abroad.
 

MikeFisher

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No, that has been pointed out...

What is missing here is the support system/infrastructure for the hotel sector

That system supports a population of 6-7M people
It cannot equate to the expat 60,000 mentioned here.... much less support needed

The 6-7M tourist population is almost equal to the entire country's population.
Practically doubles the support requirements

60,000 expats !!???
Don't need much
the 60K Residents are supporting the system even right now during the Pandemic,
while the Hotel Sector costs millions as a support during those times.
 

MikeFisher

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they are not contributing at all, in case of income for the government, at short/mid term.
they are extempt from many tax stuff/payments etc and right now feeding their people costs the government good money,
with zero income from the resorts in return.

don't get me wrong,I am absolutely Pro to this assistance.
but we've been talking/comparing a small but steadily contributing group of 60K Residents to a actually near zero running number of tourists nd a completely zero running contribution towards teh DR Government/Taxes or towards the DR Economy at all by the resorts/tourism industry.

I have our personal monthly expenses cut down to aorund 50% of our normal spending, as I am since end february with zero income, along with monthly running expenses like salaries and running costs for vehicles and boats etc, but that half is still contributed, spend on the DR Economy including the taxes for the government included in the prices of my purchases.
No Hotel nor any tourism related company, which sent their employees home without pay(solely the must pay minimum help, which by 70% is paid by the Government without getting a cent of taxes out of that one), does produce/pay a single cent of Taxes, they do not produce anything that goes towards the DR Economy at this moment, since over half a year already.
 

etolw

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No question the hotels are contributing very little now
And that was the message I got from the OP, it is easier to detect and understand during this period what the expat’s contribute.
The money coming in from abroad and spent by expats (or never returning «tourists» ) should be more visible to the government money counters in their systems, when not drowning in the AI statistics.

We can only hope that this is significant enough to make an iniative to simplify the process and attract more residents.
Should be a low hanging fruit.

Although not paying much taxes I do pay the overstay fee ;) The transfer tax when I bought my property should equal more than 370 AI tourists paying airport taxes. Sorry an unimportant digression and I have no idea how many expats choose to buy property.
 

cavok

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Jun 16, 2014
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No, that has been pointed out...

What is missing here is the support system/infrastructure for the hotel sector

That system supports a population of 6-7M people
It cannot equate to the expat 60,000 mentioned here.... much less support needed

The 6-7M tourist population is almost equal to the entire country's population.
Practically doubles the support requirements

60,000 expats !!???
Don't need much
That's one of my points. It takes relatively very little time, effort, and money from the government to get essentially "free money" from an expat - other than pushing papers by low paid paid government workers in granting residency. I can't think of another way the government can bring money into the economy so easily - other than raising taxes.
 

william webster

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I think we talking about 2 different things...

My comments relate to jobs supported or created by tourism....
Other comments talk about 'top line' dollars = income

All those PUJ airport employees rely on a stream of tourists...
all those employees get paid and drop it back into the economy

The support network is gigantic... from farm workers to bartenders/maids
Food prep.... start counting
 

John Boyter

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That's one of my points. It takes relatively very little time, effort, and money from the government to get essentially "free money" from an expat - other than pushing papers by low paid paid government workers in granting residency. I can't think of another way the government can bring money into the economy so easily - other than raising taxes.
and with Dominicans a population of 11-12 million they are not in danger of loosing their culture. They have a strong sense of national identity. Expats just contribute to the economy but I don’t think Dominicans have ever lost anything from it like you see in smaller islands.
 

CristoRey

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I did not watch the video... But imo, after November 3rd a lot of people will be wanting to leave America, especially the high tax cities. If the DR made it extremely easy and advertised it, I think they could get serious numbers.
I know a few people who fall into this category.