where do you see D.R. in 10 years and further

be4unvme · May 12, 2010

hey dr1, i've been thinking of leaving NY to open up a business in DR. looking at how things have been improving, progressing and becoming a tourism powerhouse looks like things have been heading to a positive position. but as i've been doing some research on things i see the real DR. the DR that politicians want you to see for theyre interest. i've been seeing how the improvements in DR is just funded by foreigners and global banks, but if you study history many countries have gotten swiping happy and defaulting on payments. resulting in lose of sovereignty and lost of public land to big corporations. example look at what happen with the IMF and brazil. if you google dominican republic all you will see is drugs this and that and loan approved this and that

I really want to leave this country. i'm REALLY getting sick and tired of how things are doing and see my country progressing, but im worried if there will be any political or economic stability. where do you see DR in 10 years? what posotion would it be?

pedrochemical · May 12, 2010

If you cannot make it in NYC then you should only seriously think about moving here as a loss-leader to contentedness......

suarezn · May 12, 2010

Well it depends...In less than a week we'll have elections for a congress that will last 6 years. According to current surveys PLD is supposed to win a huge percentage of these seats, so they will control both houses for the next six years at least. This means they could change the law to allow Leonel to run again in 2012 if he wishes. If he runs again he would probably win which would continue the current policies of borrowing and spending, but with a somewhat stable economy. At which point this policy will make The DR default on its debt is anybody's guess...

If on the other hand The PRD wins in 2012 all bets are off...If history is any indication Four years later we'll be in deep doodle and the peso will be worth at least 1/2 of what it is now.

harry2010 · May 12, 2010

pedrochemical said:
If you cannot make it in NYC then you should only seriously think about moving here as a loss-leader to contentedness......

As used to think that about NYC but it is not necessarly true. I think if you've been poor in NYC and get jammed in to the rat race or the hamster?s wheel you are likely to stay there. As you will keep working and unable to save any real money. Sometimes one may need to venture outside to a smaller city or even outside the country to open your eyes to certain opportunities

donP · May 12, 2010

MM Currency

suarezn said:
Four years later we'll be in deep doodle and the peso will be worth at least 1/2 of what it is now.

Even at present the peso is not worth anything outside its home country.
Try to buy a chewing gum with a 100 Peso note in Europe or the States (OK, outside the Bronx... ). :bunny:
This Mickey-Mouse currency draws its strength from the drug trade and money laundering. And this will go on no matter which party wins the elections this time or in the future.

So, don't worry.... :cheeky:

donP

be4unvme · May 12, 2010

pedrochemical said:
If you cannot make it in NYC then you should only seriously think about moving here as a loss-leader to contentedness......

actually if you cant make it in the rest of the world you cant make it in NYC, ive been living here for 17 years. me and my mother run a restaurant and live good but the problem is that the future of the US will be devastating. the economic meltdown isnt even the problem but the dollar problem. inflation is what will kill this country and sink the rest of the world. the US will face hyper style inflation just like what we've seen in weimer republic and zimbabwe due to the fact of reckless spending and printing. the US is becominig heavily a socialist state, not because the piliticians want it but because the people are demanding it.

i know many dominicans who left the DR because they feel the same way im feeling. they have opened business and bought land and are living real good. this country isnt mines i just dont feel complete.

suarezn · May 12, 2010

You're exaggerating a lot. I don't believe you'll ever get anything close to Zimbabwe in The US, because there are checks and balances here. We would never have a Robert Mugabe run this country. The president here doesn't have enough power to dictate economic policies.

BTW if the US ever gets into that much trouble then The DR will be way worse, as The Dominican economy pretty much depends on The US, so when The US gets a cold The DR gets the flu...

If the reason for wanting to move to The DR is that you're paranoid the The US economy will collapse then I think you're definitely doing for the wrong reasons...

be4unvme · May 12, 2010

@ suarezn, look into the derrivative bubble. its based on trillion and trillions of dollars. when we have inflation and at the same time socialism the people will want the gov in doing more resulting in more printing.

and your right we can't be compared to Zimbabwe, after all this money isn't physical but digital. when the fed loans money they don't even print it they just magicaly add zeros into accounts. now you know how devastating things will be

be4unvme · May 14, 2010

no one has any idea?

greydread · May 14, 2010

Wow! You guys make me want to horde gold or something.

Before we all go and slit our wrists I'd like to offer that the economic bounces that we've seen the past 4-5 years as compared to the previous 50 appear as a series of corrections. When inflation was running mad in the 70's the "end-of-worlders" were talking the same gloom and doom scenarios and we all made it through that okay (who remembers Gerald Ford's "Whip Inflation Now" campaign?). When I bought my 1st house in 1979 the interest rate on a VA loan was 14%. Some benefit, huh? Now you can buy at closer to 4.25%. Back then I made $15K a year, owned a 4BR home and had 2 new cars in the driveway. $100 in groceries filled the pantry and fridge and gas was 45 cents a gallon (before the 2nd embargo). My point is that if you look at salaries vs. prices then and now, everything pretty much follows a linear curve.

We're losing jobs now...we were losing jobs then. They're laying off teachers now, they were laying off teachers then. The upside will swing around as it always does and teachers will be hired and emerging technologies will produce new jobs (like computers did in the 80's and 90's) and we'll all work for the time when we can take our vacations to the DR and the economy there will rebound as the US economy does and life will be good again so please put down that razor.

NALs · May 14, 2010

be4unvme said:
im worried if there will be any political or economic stability. where do you see DR in 10 years? what posotion would it be?

I don't know why you are worried of political/economic instability. Politically the DR is as stable as any country can be. Elections are clean, no accusations of fraud from any side. Even the citizenry is quite calm. Elections used to include quite a few death from people getting into political discussions and then one killing the other due to a disagreement, hardly hear anything like that anymore.

Economically the country is also quite strong and stable. There are many people (Dominican and expats alike) that have a hard time believing this, but the 'thing' about reality is that it doesn't depend on what people think it is, it simply is. The DR has developed a very large internal economy due to its expanding middle class that produces roughly $26 billion. Add to that the $3 billion that enters the economy via remittances, and the estimated $1 to $2 billion through illicit means; and you got quite a consuming force. The purchasing power of the middle classes and the size of the classes themselves will continue to increase during the next decade.

If you are serious about moving to the DR with the intention of starting a business, you must do the following:

1. Decide if your business will be focused on the internal consuming economy or on the external. If the former, study and get your hands on professional market studies of the Dominican consuming market. If the latter, now is the time given that the global economy is in a slump and timidly rising again.

2. There are many consulting and market research firms in Santo Domingo that will do investigate your particular niche market in the DR. They will find everything from the size of the market, where its mostly concentrated, who your competition will be, what are their strength and weaknesses, what dissatisfaction the Dominican consumer have with the current service/product offerings, current profit margins, etc. They will even give you suggestions on the best way to successfully penetrate the market. This type of information is not cheap, but it does pays for it self.

3. Don't judge the Dominican market/society by the impressions you receive via the media. All of these companies have one goal in mind, profits; and they do sensationalize their stories to a degree you don't see in the USA. Even programs like Nuria and Alicia Ortega's are heavily sensationalized, meant to appeal to your emotions which will keep you engage. Much of this is clearly noticeable with the type of music used in their stories, the colors, the insinuations they leave in your mind due to the way the stories are edited, etc. Judge the Dominican market/society by professional studies and research. Don't be surprised when you noticed that their results more often than not contradicts the perception the media sources project into the population.

Also, be weary when asking the average Dominican about the situation. The average Dominican is filled with all sorts of inferiority complexes that produces a fatalistic and pessimistic attitude towards the country, the future, and their ability to change their situation. You will notice that Dominicans have a hard time accepting a positive reason for why something occurs (ie. the economy grows due to well management from the authorities - many Dominicans used to say blatantly that those figures were lies), but blindly accept negative explanations for the same occurrences (ie. today most Dominicans don't deny the economic growth figures, they now have drugs to explain it and it fits well with their fatalistic and pessimistic outlook on Dominican society).

Critical thinking is almost completely absent, especially when it comes to judging the veracity of news stories presented in television/newspapers. The typical Dominican assumes everything the media presents to them is the truth, and that the media sources are on their side, representing the interests of the people. At the only levels of Dominican society that you will notice the use of critical thinking and the awareness of the profit-motivating factor from the news sources, their political biases, and the overt manipulation via sensationalism is among the upper, better educated classes. Also, having a chat with an owner of one of these media sources will open your eyes to how they manipulate public opinion. The rest of Dominican society believes almost everything the media sources suggest to them.

4. Take your time and get to know the DR very well. Don't go by hearsay or rumors or what 'most people think.' In order to know the DR well and be able to profit from this, you have to step outside the box.

To conclude, my message to you is to make the effort the know the real Dominican market, study it, and then make your decision with factual information at hand.

If you would like to start a business specializing in bicycles. If you ask an expat or a typical Dominican in the streets if this is a good business, don't be surprised if most tell you no, there is no market for this, blah blah blah. In the mean time, Dominicans spend over US$4 million on new bicycles every year.

If have in mind a toy store, if you ask everyday Dominicans about this they will tell you Dominicans don't care about this or that Dominicans don't spend much in this type of merchandise. This may be true for Dominicans at their social level, but little do they know that every year Dominicans buy over US$33 million in toys.

Maybe your affection is books and would like to start a bookstore or what will eventually become a bookstore franchise, if you ask many expats or Dominicans they will tell you it will be a failure because Dominicans 'don't read.' Little do they know that every year Dominicans buy new books to the tune of over US$75 million.

Or let's say you are more into laptops. Ask the typical Dominican on the street and the answer will most likely be that it's not a good business because Dominicans don't have the money to buy that. Yet, Dominicans spend over US$23 million on new laptops every year.

Know your market, know your competitor, set your goals of how much your market segment you want to control, develop a viable market penetration plan, and go to work.

But most importantly, value factual information; which by its very nature is expensive, scarce, and only a few people possess.

RacerX · May 14, 2010

greydread said:
Wow! You guys make me want to horde gold or something.

Before we all go and slit our wrists I'd like to offer that the economic bounces that we've seen the past 4-5 years as compared to the previous 50 appear as a series of corrections. When inflation was running mad in the 70's the "end-of-worlders" were talking the same gloom and doom scenarios and we all made it through that okay (who remembers Gerald Ford's "Whip Inflation Now" campaign?). When I bought my 1st house in 1979 the interest rate on a VA loan was 14%. Some benefit, huh? Now you can buy at closer to 4.25%. Back then I made $15K a year, owned a 4BR home and had 2 new cars in the driveway. $100 in groceries filled the pantry and fridge and gas was 45 cents a gallon (before the 2nd embargo). My point is that if you look at salaries vs. prices then and now, everything pretty much follows a linear curve.

We're losing jobs now...we were losing jobs then. They're laying off teachers now, they were laying off teachers then. The upside will swing around as it always does and teachers will be hired and emerging technologies will produce new jobs (like computers did in the 80's and 90's) and we'll all work for the time when we can take our vacations to the DR and the economy there will rebound as the US economy does and life will be good again so please put down that razor.

Except that present day salaries are increasing but have remained stagant since 1970 and the prices for goods and services are increasing.
We are laying off teachers, closing schools and hospitals, raising utility rates on all sides. Cutting or diminishing unemployment and public assistance and instead of a stimulus package for job creation(at a time when the infrastructure needs it) we d rather bail out the banks for losses they created.
Joe Schmoe cant get a bailout to keep his house or health insurance or send his kids to college but Goldman Sach and Chase Manhattan and Citibank can use the US Treasury to secure their losses due to greed. Kids cant perform in school well because they are taught anything but lies as history or world events and the teachers are required to teach to the test. So what happens is when these kids do go to higher education they fail, because they never learn any comprehension skills or how to assess the information they received. You tell people they dont deserve to be sane, safe and healthy by denying them adequate or competent medical care. You tell people that education is a necessity for advancement in life but April Fools' you learn that it is a luxury only for those can afford it. Kids come out of school with so much debt they cant even pretend to be altruistic. They have to hunt for a dollar. And for those who you never wanted to go to college you have 2 options, to go to prison or to work at the prison. Or join the military.

I ll have you know that if you are an enlisted man in the military with a wife AND children, you DO qualify for welfare, no one wants to mention it but its the dirty truth. Plenty of money for military contractors and defense suppliers but not for the men. $1700/month doesnt do much. It goes up as your rank goes up, but until you hit E-5, you re family is in dire straits. And those reservists and Guardsmen who get injured "serving their country" economic interests? Well when they touch down they no longer are eligible for that 24 hour medical care at the VA(if you still have a local one in your region). Hip hip hooray! Here's hoping you have a job(or were you downsized)? And a house(or are you living partly in your car and a storage unit)? And that your kids werent affected emotionally by your absence, injury or financial condition. But I bet that executives at BP and ExxonMobil and Halliburton and Lockheed Martin never have these problems. And a million dollar bonus to boot. God Bless America....and no place else!

And for be4unvme, socialism isnt what is doing the US in. The rampant borrowing, spending and printing of money that doesnt exist isnt from "fairy imbalance of trade" premise they would want you to believe. The massive borrowing and spending is from the unnecessary expansion of global hegemony by the US military. Thats your problem and there is your downfall.

When China find outs what to do with that money or they decide they dont want any more then you ll see a constriction in the US economy(unless Crazy Horse decides to provoke a war with China in order to prevent repayment of the debt).

The DR in 10 years? Will be in the same place it was 10 years ago, and the same place as 10 years before that.

be4unvme · May 14, 2010

greydread said:
Wow! You guys make me want to horde gold or something.

Before we all go and slit our wrists I'd like to offer that the economic bounces that we've seen the past 4-5 years as compared to the previous 50 appear as a series of corrections. When inflation was running mad in the 70's the "end-of-worlders" were talking the same gloom and doom scenarios and we all made it through that okay (who remembers Gerald Ford's "Whip Inflation Now" campaign?). When I bought my 1st house in 1979 the interest rate on a VA loan was 14%. Some benefit, huh? Now you can buy at closer to 4.25%. Back then I made $15K a year, owned a 4BR home and had 2 new cars in the driveway. $100 in groceries filled the pantry and fridge and gas was 45 cents a gallon (before the 2nd embargo). My point is that if you look at salaries vs. prices then and now, everything pretty much follows a linear curve.

We're losing jobs now...we were losing jobs then. They're laying off teachers now, they were laying off teachers then. The upside will swing around as it always does and teachers will be hired and emerging technologies will produce new jobs (like computers did in the 80's and 90's) and we'll all work for the time when we can take our vacations to the DR and the economy there will rebound as the US economy does and life will be good again so please put down that razor.

things are very different this time, our empire has remain alive because of a strong dollar that still was the only global currency and was still in demand. this time we're hearing multiple countries talkin about dumping it. out national debt if at OVER 50 trillion dollars including future promises. back then there were jobs and factories to go back to work in but now theyre gone. about emerging technologies i doubt there will be anything like we seen with computers, phones or T.V.'s green energy is nothing but a transfer it isn't solution. every century a empire falls and new one emerges, 1800s was England, 1900s was the US and for the 2000s its China

be4unvme · May 14, 2010

NALs said:
I don't know why you are worried of political/economic instability. Politically the DR is as stable as any country can be. Elections are clean, no accusations of fraud from any side. Even the citizenry is quite calm. Elections used to include quite a few death from people getting into political discussions and then one killing the other due to a disagreement, hardly hear anything like that anymore.

Economically the country is also quite strong and stable. There are many people (Dominican and expats alike) that have a hard time believing this, but the 'thing' about reality is that it doesn't depend on what people think it is, it simply is. The DR has developed a very large internal economy due to its expanding middle class that produces roughly $26 billion. Add to that the $3 billion that enters the economy via remittances, and the estimated $1 to $2 billion through illicit means; and you got quite a consuming force. The purchasing power of the middle classes and the size of the classes themselves will continue to increase during the next decade.

If you are serious about moving to the DR with the intention of starting a business, you must do the following:

1. Decide if your business will be focused on the internal consuming economy or on the external. If the former, study and get your hands on professional market studies of the Dominican consuming market. If the latter, now is the time given that the global economy is in a slump and timidly rising again.

2. There are many consulting and market research firms in Santo Domingo that will do investigate your particular niche market in the DR. They will find everything from the size of the market, where its mostly concentrated, who your competition will be, what are their strength and weaknesses, what dissatisfaction the Dominican consumer have with the current service/product offerings, current profit margins, etc. They will even give you suggestions on the best way to successfully penetrate the market. This type of information is not cheap, but it does pays for it self.

3. Don't judge the Dominican market/society by the impressions you receive via the media. All of these companies have one goal in mind, profits; and they do sensationalize their stories to a degree you don't see in the USA. Even programs like Nuria and Alicia Ortega's are heavily sensationalized, meant to appeal to your emotions which will keep you engage. Much of this is clearly noticeable with the type of music used in their stories, the colors, the insinuations they leave in your mind due to the way the stories are edited, etc. Judge the Dominican market/society by professional studies and research. Don't be surprised when you noticed that their results more often than not contradicts the perception the media sources project into the population.

Also, be weary when asking the average Dominican about the situation. The average Dominican is filled with all sorts of inferiority complexes that produces a fatalistic and pessimistic attitude towards the country, the future, and their ability to change their situation. You will notice that Dominicans have a hard time accepting a positive reason for why something occurs (ie. the economy grows due to well management from the authorities - many Dominicans used to say blatantly that those figures were lies), but blindly accept negative explanations for the same occurrences (ie. today most Dominicans don't deny the economic growth figures, they now have drugs to explain it and it fits well with their fatalistic and pessimistic outlook on Dominican society).

Critical thinking is almost completely absent, especially when it comes to judging the veracity of news stories presented in television/newspapers. The typical Dominican assumes everything the media presents to them is the truth, and that the media sources are on their side, representing the interests of the people. At the only levels of Dominican society that you will notice the use of critical thinking and the awareness of the profit-motivating factor from the news sources, their political biases, and the overt manipulation via sensationalism is among the upper, better educated classes. Also, having a chat with an owner of one of these media sources will open your eyes to how they manipulate public opinion. The rest of Dominican society believes almost everything the media sources suggest to them.

4. Take your time and get to know the DR very well. Don't go by hearsay or rumors or what 'most people think.' In order to know the DR well and be able to profit from this, you have to step outside the box.

To conclude, my message to you is to make the effort the know the real Dominican market, study it, and then make your decision with factual information at hand.

If you would like to start a business specializing in bicycles. If you ask an expat or a typical Dominican in the streets if this is a good business, don't be surprised if most tell you no, there is no market for this, blah blah blah. In the mean time, Dominicans spend over US$4 million on new bicycles every year.

If have in mind a toy store, if you ask everyday Dominicans about this they will tell you Dominicans don't care about this or that Dominicans don't spend much in this type of merchandise. This may be true for Dominicans at their social level, but little do they know that every year Dominicans buy over US$33 million in toys.

Maybe your affection is books and would like to start a bookstore or what will eventually become a bookstore franchise, if you ask many expats or Dominicans they will tell you it will be a failure because Dominicans 'don't read.' Little do they know that every year Dominicans buy new books to the tune of over US$75 million.

Or let's say you are more into laptops. Ask the typical Dominican on the street and the answer will most likely be that it's not a good business because Dominicans don't have the money to buy that. Yet, Dominicans spend over US$23 million on new laptops every year.

Know your market, know your competitor, set your goals of how much your market segment you want to control, develop a viable market penetration plan, and go to work.

But most importantly, value factual information; which by its very nature is expensive, scarce, and only a few people possess.

very well spoken and orderly made, thanks man now i know who to ask for advice. i see you know business fundamental.

engineerfg · May 15, 2010

be4unvme said:
things are very different this time, our empire has remain alive because of a strong dollar that still was the only global currency and was still in demand. this time we're hearing multiple countries talkin about dumping it. out national debt if at OVER 50 trillion dollars including future promises. back then there were jobs and factories to go back to work in but now theyre gone. about emerging technologies i doubt there will be anything like we seen with computers, phones or T.V.'s green energy is nothing but a transfer it isn't solution. every century a empire falls and new one emerges, 1800s was England, 1900s was the US and for the 2000s its China

I think all this hyperbole and sabre rattling by china that gets amplified in the press is just...well silly. How exactly is China going to 'dump' it's ownership of US Debt? 80+% of China's balance sheet is US Debt. China's not buying this debt because it 'wants' to, it's just a net resultant of China->USA exports (primary and secondary) and a consequence of the devalued Chinese currency. Eventually all those US Dollars end up in the Central Bank and have to be spent somehow, and the only option for the central bank is US Debt.

Devaluing US Debt also devalues China's balance sheet, so that's like the arm cancer threatening to cut the whole arm off if it doesn't shape up -> this would hurt the cancer too.

There has always been a risk of some of that money seeping from the central bank into a sovereign wealth fund and being used to buy domestic industry leaders, but the protectionist measures on SWF's are being legislated and will stop this leakage of assets eventually...

engineerfg · May 15, 2010

Staying in DR in the next 10 years

My biggest fear about staying here in the DR for the long term would be...

The country appears to be a 'failed state' by all practical measurements that we in the West would consider a country to be a failure:

1. You're being robbed, can you call the police? Will they give a crap? Are they in on it? If they catch the robber, could they be bribed? Is there real justice and enforcement of laws by the police?

2. Your house is on fire - same question. Do you trust the fire hall down the street?

3. You have 3 kids. Would you ever put them in public school?

4. Your house gets hit by rats. The pest control guy comes and spreads rat poison everywhere. Do you think the state has an EPA type body that regulates how much poison pest control can use? Or does the operator care? Are your kids gonna wake up with nose bleeds with your pets half dead the next day?

5. The electrical company is putting new power lines through your block. Do you think they're within 'safe' standards to be near your kids bedroom? is your kid gonna have a tumor in 15 years? If so, will there be someone to hold to account? Someone to sue? Even if you do sue, do you think you would get justice and a financial reward?

6. The guy in front of you is drunk, almost hits you, and is swerving all over the road. The police pull him over. Are you confident that he will get taken off the road at least for the night? Or is his penalty just 500 pesos curb side?

The list goes on.

For all the above reasons, my risk tolerance is -- I'm happy to come here, I'm happy to make cash here, I'm happy to hustle here and make some dough off shore, but over the long term, not so sure it's a great or safe place to settle with a family.

And if you're comparing NYC to SDQ, it's not even a comparison! You may think that America is going to 'hell + hand basket' because of the economy and bad politicians, but c'mon, everybody here in SDQ pretty much accepts that every politician is involved in some form of graft or kick back scheme for self enrichment. There isn't a SINGLE honest politician is there? Maybe Sergio Vargas??

Chip · May 15, 2010

engineerfg said:
The country appears to be a 'failed state' by all practical measurements that we in the West would consider a country to be a failure:

Give the Democrats some time to make the US a bankrupt state and see what happens.

engineerfg said:
1. You're being robbed, can you call the police? Will they give a crap? Are they in on it? If they catch the robber, could they be bribed? Is there real justice and enforcement of laws by the police?

Don't be in the wrong place at the wrong time and have your house well protected.

engineerfg said:
2. Your house is on fire - same question. Do you trust the fire hall down the street?

Unlikely, houses are mostly made of concrete. Leave your propane tank outside and you shouldn't have problems.

engineerfg said:
3. You have 3 kids. Would you ever put them in public school?

Private school is cheap, it will run you US125 a month for a decent one for all three. More for the renowned ones and less for others.

engineerfg said:
4. Your house gets hit by rats. The pest control guy comes and spreads rat poison everywhere. Do you think the state has an EPA type body that regulates how much poison pest control can use? Or does the operator care? Are your kids gonna wake up with nose bleeds with your pets half dead the next day?

You like dreaming a lot don't you? This won't happen in the Dr. Please actually visit us.

engineerfg said:
5. The electrical company is putting new power lines through your block. Do you think they're within 'safe' standards to be near your kids bedroom? is your kid gonna have a tumor in 15 years? If so, will there be someone to hold to account? Someone to sue? Even if you do sue, do you think you would get justice and a financial reward?

Again, you like to suppose a lot don't you? What about people that live next to high power lines in the States. I recommend showing some evidence before just assuming this is just so. This is just pure sensationalism - and for what purpose????

engineerfg said:
6. The guy in front of you is drunk, almost hits you, and is swerving all over the road. The police pull him over. Are you confident that he will get taken off the road at least for the night? Or is his penalty just 500 pesos curb side?

Like the US isn't full of drunk drivers every night of the week? Don't drive at night and drive slow. Even the drunks do that here.

engineerfg said:
I'm happy to hustle here

I think that says a lot about your attitude. What goes around comes around.

engineerfg said:
And if you're comparing NYC to SDQ, it's not even a comparison! You may think that America is going to 'hell + hand basket' because of the economy and bad politicians, but c'mon, everybody here in SDQ pretty much accepts that every politician is involved in some form of graft or kick back scheme for self enrichment. There isn't a SINGLE honest politician is there? Maybe Sergio Vargas??

What does that really have to do with us who live here?

pedrochemical · May 15, 2010

engineerfg said:
My biggest fear about staying here in the DR for the long term would be...

The country appears to be a 'failed state' by all practical measurements that we in the West would consider a country to be a failure:

1. You're being robbed, can you call the police? Will they give a crap? Are they in on it? If they catch the robber, could they be bribed? Is there real justice and enforcement of laws by the police?

2. Your house is on fire - same question. Do you trust the fire hall down the street?

3. You have 3 kids. Would you ever put them in public school?

4. Your house gets hit by rats. The pest control guy comes and spreads rat poison everywhere. Do you think the state has an EPA type body that regulates how much poison pest control can use? Or does the operator care? Are your kids gonna wake up with nose bleeds with your pets half dead the next day?

5. The electrical company is putting new power lines through your block. Do you think they're within 'safe' standards to be near your kids bedroom? is your kid gonna have a tumor in 15 years? If so, will there be someone to hold to account? Someone to sue? Even if you do sue, do you think you would get justice and a financial reward?

6. The guy in front of you is drunk, almost hits you, and is swerving all over the road. The police pull him over. Are you confident that he will get taken off the road at least for the night? Or is his penalty just 500 pesos curb side?

The list goes on.

For all the above reasons, my risk tolerance is -- I'm happy to come here, I'm happy to make cash here, I'm happy to hustle here and make some dough off shore, but over the long term, not so sure it's a great or safe place to settle with a family.

And if you're comparing NYC to SDQ, it's not even a comparison! You may think that America is going to 'hell + hand basket' because of the economy and bad politicians, but c'mon, everybody here in SDQ pretty much accepts that every politician is involved in some form of graft or kick back scheme for self enrichment. There isn't a SINGLE honest politician is there? Maybe Sergio Vargas??

These are all problems that are a pleasure to solve - the very reason one comes and eventually stays here.

Engineerfg.. you know you love it....

You can do what you want here....as long as you want to do good stuff...

engineerfg · May 15, 2010

pedrochemical said:
These are all problems that are a pleasure to solve - the very reason one comes and eventually stays here.

Engineerfg.. you know you love it....

You can do what you want here....as long as you want to do good stuff...

haha yes. I know I know. I used to ask my rich Filipino friends why if they had so much money, they didn't move to the USA? Their army of cleaners, maids, bribe receiving police officers were just hard to give up!

Vacara · May 15, 2010

Chip said:
Give the Democrats some time to make the US a bankrupt state and see what happens.

Too late, the Republicans did that already.

I'm on with the rest of your post.

where do you see D.R. in 10 years and further

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