Black in a Foreign Land: In Defense of Dominican Identity

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Virgo

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Interesting article about how some try to impose their race-centric (in fact RACIST) worldview on Dominicans.

Black in a Foreign Land: In Defense of Dominican Identity
by C?sar Vargas
Writer/Director, advocate, founder of UPLIFTT (United People for Latinos in Film, TV, and Theater) and named one of 40 under 40: Latinos in American Politics. His Op-eds & quotes can be found on the Huffington Post,Latino Rebels, Fox News, NBC, Salon, and the Guardian.

"I wasn't always concerned with race or color as much until I moved to the States. In fact, I didn't even think of race or saw myself as a minority--which comes with an innumerable amount of issues that influence the thinking patterns, health (mental, physical, and financial), and worldview of a newly racially and ethnically "maligned" people that rarely escape the "other" box. Perhaps because (and even though) we are an array of colors, Dominicans see themselves as a monolithic people and are more apt to separate each other based on region and class than color."
 
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pauleast

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Yet another skin pigment article promulgated by the biased rag "Huffington ComPost
 
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Virgo

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pauleast said:
Yet another skin pigment article promulgated by the biased rag "Huffington ComPost
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I didn't get much out of your comment. The publication outlet is irrelevant, since this is an opinion piece. What in specific do you see as wrong (if any) with the points made by the author (his opinion)?
 
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pauleast

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I didn't get much out of your article selection either. If I move to Japan, one of the most homogeneous societies on the planet , I will be viewed as different and stereotyped. The same old tired cultural finger pointing debate. Ain't nothing new.
 
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pauleast

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P.S the publication is relavent as the Huffington compost is the equivalent to Entertainment Tonight magazine posting stories about the Kardashians
 
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the gorgon

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pauleast said:
P.S the publication is relavent as the Huffington compost is the equivalent to Entertainment Tonight magazine posting stories about the Kardashians
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so, pauleast, since the opinions of this particular author are also aired on other outlets like Fox News, maybe you would care to tell us if they are relevant then-
 
bob saunders

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Quote from the article:
" In here, I will embrace the Black or Afro-Latino identity because I have been treated like I am Black. But if Dominicans want to call me mixed, trigue?o, or mulato, I have no problem with that either for neither identifier is greater or better than the other. And even though I'll continue to tell Dominicans to embrace their negritude (I have yet to meet one Dominican who says they have no African ancestry) and call myself a Black man in front of them in the States and in the Dominican Republic, I'll be damned if I try to force American concepts of race down their throats in their own land and enclaves. They can think and elevate themselves without my American savior complex. For imperialism is still imperialism even if it comes in the form of social justice and thought." end Quote

This statement is quite different than the conclusion of the various black American race researchers have come up with when commenting on Dominican culture.
 
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Virgo

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Derfish said:
I find any article trying to divide people by race to be racist. We are all humans and any attempt to divide people into classifications is only looking to cause problems, nothing more.
Der Fish
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You and others may have misunderstood the author. He is PRECISELY attacking those who try to impose a racial divide on Dominicans, and/or to impose the so-called "one drop rule" on them (anyone with any trace of black ancestry is "black"). The quoted text in my OP makes that clear.
 
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the gorgon

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Virgo said:
You and others may have misunderstood the author. He is PRECISELY attacking those who try to impose a racial divide on Dominicans, and/or to impose the so-called "one drop rule" on them (anyone with any trace of black ancestry is "black"). The quoted text in my OP makes that clear.
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what the author says is exactly what most immigrant people from racially mixed societies always say. they state that until they moved to the USA, race was not a part of their daily consciousness. it is only when they got there that they experienced first hand what racism really is.
 
AlterEgo

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I enjoyed the article, found it concise and very well written. We're limited here, as racial threads are no-nos, but I will leave this open for the time being.

Please keep your posts DR related, and discuss the OP only. Mamma is watching you.
 
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Virgo

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Derfish said:
Don't look like it to me!
"There are also derogatory terms reserved for white Dominicans and foreigners, too. Something hardly spoken about in popular discourse when discussing race and ethnicity in the Dominican Republic, just the same as the lack of mention of classism and the exaltation of Black beauty. Terms such as "pan blanco" (white bread) and "gringo de mierda" (****ing gringo) are often used to either make fun of or denounce American and European influence. And, like most Latin American countries, the Dominican Republic looks at white "invaders" (American and European tourists, expats, businessmen, etc,) and Dominican-born, with suspicion."
Der Fish
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No, you are misunderstanding. His point is that just as you may hear some pejorative expressions directed to a black or dark-skinned person, you may also hear similar stuff directed to a white or light skin person. That is, it is not only black/dark people who may suffer from such things, under certain circumstances. It depends on who is talking and against whom.

That is why he starts with "There are ALSO derogatory terms..."...emphasis on ALSO...
 
AlterEgo

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JDJones said:
Might as well close it now. It will go south sooner than later. That or move it to off topic.
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I wish I could say you're wrong, my faith in our posters is undoubtedly misplaced.

Don't want to move it to OT, as the OP can't see it there, and he 's not even close to getting access.
 
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Virgo

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Derfish said:
That is my original comment that some people say anything to stir the pot. Like my mother used to say "It is a bucket of poop, there more you stir it the more it stinks!"
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Except he is not stirring the pot at all...just making a point that both white and black people can hear derogatory terms directed at them, under certain circumstances...It depends on who is trying to insult whom...All this fits within his main point which is that Dominicans (in general) are not as racially-focused as others are or as others accuse Dominicans of being, or would like Dominicans to be. Of course, everywhere (including the DR) there are specific people (of any color or racial background) who are racially/color biased. He is talking about general attitudes.
 
AlterEgo

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Virgo said:
Except he is not stirring the pot at all...just making a point that both white and black people can hear derogatory terms directed at them, under certain circumstances...It depends on who is trying to insult whom...All this fits within his main point which is that Dominicans (in general) are not as racially-focused as others are or as others accuse Dominicans of being, or would like Dominicans to be. Of course, everywhere (including the DR) there are specific people (of any color or racial background) who are racially/color biased. He is talking about general attitudes.
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Exactly. Dominicans practice equal-opportunity when they call people names. :)

They also call people ugly, fat, old, etc. They don't have a sensitivity filter, and they're not insulted when someone calls them "the fat bald guy". I can imagine it has been a shock to many when they arrive in the US/UK/Europe and find out they are the ones being discriminated against because of their features or their complexion.
 
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the gorgon

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AlterEgo said:
Exactly. Dominicans practice equal-opportunity when they call people names. :)

They also call people ugly, fat, old, etc. They don't have a sensitivity filter, and they're not insulted when someone calls them "the fat bald guy". I can imagine it has been a shock to many when they arrive in the US/UK/Europe and find out they are the ones being discriminated against because of their features or their complexion.
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you are so right when you say that Dominicans do not have a sensitivity filter. they are also heavy into descriptors. in a place like the USA, people are very cautious about how they address others, especially people with disabilities. not so in the DR. there is a dumb guy who stops by in the afternoons where i play dominoes, and everyone calls him mudo. i never knew at the beginning what was the reason, until i realized that the word means mute. i am not sure that there is any malice aforethought, but just a lack of civil refinement.
 
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the gorgon said:
you are so right when you say that Dominicans do not have a sensitivity filter. they are also heavy into descriptors. in a place like the USA, people are very cautious about how they address others, especially people with disabilities. not so in the DR. there is a dumb guy who stops by in the afternoons where i play dominoes, and everyone calls him mudo. i never knew at the beginning what was the reason, until i realized that the word means mute. i am not sure that there is any malice aforethought, but just a lack of civil refinement.
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I reckon that before a lot of people got "sensitive training" ("political correctness?") it was the same in most places. Eventally people were trained to use different/new terms. So, a cripple person became "disable" or handicapped, and idiot became a mentally handicapped person, a person with great difficulties to understand any thing went from stupid to having "a learning disability"...and so on. In the DR there are people who have been trained to be "more considerate", but it depends heavily on their general education level.

As for your example, they probably call him "el mudo" meaning "the one who cannot speak". I suppose this would also be acceptable elsewhere. There are also "el ciego" (the blind one), "el sordo" (the deaf one), etc. They are generally not thought as insults, but descriptors similar to "el alto" (the tall one), "el fuerte" (the strong one), "el rico" (the rich one), and so on.
 
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the gorgon

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Virgo said:
I reckon that before a lot of people got "sensitive training" ("political correctness?") it was the same in most places. Eventally people were trained to use different/new terms. So, a cripple person became "disable" or handicapped, and idiot became a mentally handicapped person, a person with great difficulties to understand any thing went from stupid to having "a learning disability"...and so on. In the DR there are people who have been trained to be "more considerate", but it depends heavily on their general education level.

As for your example, they probably call him "el mudo" meaning "the one who cannot speak". I suppose this would also be acceptable elsewhere. There are also "el ciego" (the blind one), "el sordo" (the deaf one), etc. They are generally not thought as insults, but descriptors similar to "el alto" (the tall one), "el fuerte" (the strong one), "el rico" (the rich one), and so on.
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there is a difference between referring to someone as being mute, as opposed to bellowing out Mudo when he walks by. it is not a matter of political correctness. it matters not a whit if one guy chooses to use the term blind, and other to say visually challenged. that is not what is at issue here. it is a matter of calling someone a name based on a disability. i have seen tall guys called Tree, and large guys called Biggie. calling someone Dummy because he cannot speak has nothing to do with political correctness.
 
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