Who are these idiots?

Friday evening I passed a news stand and a title on a paper caught my attention:

I read on. It so turns out, that a movie presentation, part of the CULTURAL event at the Santo Domingo book fair (Feria del libro) had been canceled just hours or minutes before it's schedule. The rumor now is that it was Israeli pressure which forced the shut down of the presentation of the "Documentary". Imagine!

Well, the "Documentary", filmed 1936 by Leni Riefenstahl (Leni Riefenstahl - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia), was NOT a "documentary" but a in large part staged NSDAP (Nazi) Propaganda flick with the title Triumph des Willens [Triumph of the Will].
The movie is 1:45 long and Leni Riefenstahl HAS been credited for novel direction and editing.
While I will obviously object to the message, after viewing it (Triumph des Willens on YouTube) I have to agree that some shots (angles, ideas etc) were way ahead of it's time... but that may now really only qualify cut down and edited for a presentation at a filming seminar, maybe.

Here are some news links to the "story":

• Israel influye contra documental Hitler - ElNacional.com.do
• Rechazan que se proyecte pel?cula en Feria del Libro - List?n Diario Digital
• Cancelan el filme que elogia nazismo - List?n Diario Digital

Interesting, how most seem to insist that it was a "Documentary" and only one really denounces the fact that it instead was PRO-NAZI propaganda material which has been banned in many countries.

• En la Feria del Libro se prohibi? "El Kama Sutra Dominicano", pero se permiti? propaganda Nazi :: CLAVE digital

I would not object to showing material like this to an informed (prepared) crowed to document how the NAZI machinery operated, or to show Mrs. Riefenstahl's "visions". But as THE movie as a CULTURAL even at a book fair??

Interestingly enough, NONE of the news paper reports I found so far, clearly point out WHO (by name and position) were the light bulbs who came up with that "great" idea. I mean, one really has to search to come up with that pick.


Are these the same who still vote for Balaguer, Pena Gomez or Bosch?
Or are THESE the "EDUCATED" class of the DR?

Why not celebrate a National "Ignorance" day, instead? Free Presidentes and Brugal (the clear stuff, it's more effective!)!

The DR HAS a history with the Jewish people which is worth while discussing with PRIDE (Sosua). Now THAT would make a great subject for a CULTURAL event!

.... J-D.

Correction, it was filmed 1934 and released 1935.

By the way, as a mitigation factor, I might mention that the film received some raving International reviews and PRICES before the war! Even a gold medal at the 1935 Venice Biennale, and the Grand Prix at the 1937 World Exhibition in PARIS!!
The movie features only ONE short mention on "race", when Julius Schleicher speaks.

... J-D.

? bient?t said:

"Idiots," say you? Not so fast. Showing how propaganda works is not the work of idiots.

Please give Dominicans more credit.

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I don't often call anybody an Idiot on here or elsewhere. So far to the "not so fast" comment.

Without FIRST understanding the history behind it?

I'll gladly give anyone credit who has a basic understanding or the underlining history. YOU go out, and ask people HERE, WHO Adolf Hitler was or about the 3rd Reich. Maybe I've been asking the wrong people, but the answers I often got around here, ranging from not knowing at all to "el Presidente de Alemania" would suggest that a little "preparation" would not be uncalled for, before exposing the general public to a propaganda flick at a cultural event to a public who has a history of being subjected to vote courting on the premises of Salami-bribes and cold-ones handouts.

I think there are better cinematographic initiations to that subject: Holocaust, Schindler's List, Hitler -The Last Days, Air Battle Over England, D-Day.

But SURE! Why not. Hey I provided a link to the full version. You are welcome to download it and make it a nice little Sunday eve family viewing! I mean, go for it. You will tell me how it went and how enlightening it proved to be, right?

Vacara said:

Hey JD, how's your Spanish compared to SantiagoDR?. I read the links that you posted and all of them express in no uncertain terms that this is nazi propaganda.

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Actually, on Saturday they DID NOT.

The first ones mostly mentioned the rumor of the Israeli embassy having "powered"-off the showing of what they initially called a HISTORY DOCUMENTARY.
Only the last link I provided did from the beginning denounce it be Nazi Propaganda and unfit for that event.
Besides, the news response was not the subject of my "beef" here.

As to the IDIOTS, my question was, who it was who had the bright idea to schedule THAT "movie" in the first place. The organizers.



Vacara, I'd be the first to be glad for ANYONE, certainly SantiagoDR inclusive to have better Spanish then I do. What's your point?





... J-D.

? bient?t said:

JD, you are a great contributor. So, why succumb this low?

The literal mind would read this and conclude I don't know anything about the Nazi past. Of course not: I'm Dominican, and the FSM knows we need a lesson on good taste. Or maybe assume I'm insensitive.

We read and analyze and learn and read some more and... yeah, aunque usted no lo crea.

This is not the first time some of us have seen this video; it's old news. No. Really.

I ain't no island; I'm part of the main... Jewish or not.

So, be easy on us.

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"So why succumb this low?":
You mean I should have opted to join those who chose to play offended because their little "movie" session was thwarted, allegedly because of an Israeli interference in Dominican-Cultural festivities? For the sake of being a "great contributor"? Thanks btw! But sorry, I will not compromise.
Those who chose THAT flick over the 10's of thousands available and certainly dozens good ones available on the subject of the 3rd Reich, are idiots.

"... have to give Dominicans more credit":
Credit would be EARNED IF the people who had a say in all this, would have come forward and pointed the finger to themselves and explained and possibly even accepted to an error of judgment and mistake instead of sending out for others to point the finger at the embassy of one of the nations which which has suffered beyond imagination under those who commissioned this propaganda.
This would have allowed me to give credit for taking responsibility and assuming an error, actually something which in my opinion would have been greater than the bloop at hand.
You seem to try to suggest that I implied that the Dominicans as a whole are idiots. Well, while I certainly question the preparedness of the general public to be able to take that film's message with utter caution, I nowhere will be shown that I implied that Dominicans as a whole are idiots.
If that would have been something you and others felt reading my posts here, I apologize wholeheartedly as it would not have been my intention.

"We read and analyze and learn and read some more": I am glad I can trust YOU and yours DO. Still, would you like for the two of us to assist to a history class in a public school before we discuss the subject any further? Would you join me for a little inquest on the street, asking people about the subject, recollecting answers? I'm game! You and I would wind up having some good times and maybe find a way of changing things beyond my name calling or you apparent resistance to accept that there was a blunder.

"This is not the first time some of us have seen this video; it's old news. No. Really. ":
It is, about 75 years old. That doesn't make it any less dangerous and given what happened between then and the 10 years that followed, offensiveness. Propaganda does not expire. Thousands of Neo Nazi's are sadly living prove of that.
If "many of you" have seen it, what made it so worth while repeating a presentation?

"I ain't no island; I'm part of the main... Jewish or not.":
Certainly you are not. No individual is. But then, it wasn't about you, or did you....?


Don't get me wrong. I have always opposed the ban of Nazi "material" imposed in some countries, notably Germany and the US. I think it make it just the more attractive to confused young generation. The third Reich, it's uprising and fall and the human cost should be EXPLAINED to generations to follow. And the artifacts and other remainders should be preserved as warnings and not enhanced in "value" because they have been outlawed.
But that takes fundamental education... not of a few, but the general public. Something I not only feel somewhat missing here, but gradually all over the world.

... J-D.

I am starting to be unsure if some people on here are trying to be "funny" and I might be missing the "humor". I shall thus not comment on some of the bizarre statements posted. I prefer to remain unsure that I read them as they were intended by the writer(s).

? bient?t chooses to play the "estoy ofendido"-card, and in the name of the whole Republic... FINE. You are quite entitled to enjoy your little "ofendido"-minute if that makes you feel patriotic. Maybe goes to suggest a few things, but that shall remain my interpretation.
It only leaves me wondering how you think the International community will judge that choice of film event? As the pinnacle of intellectual and cultural wisdom, or maybe a hint of lack of sensitivity and understanding of the feelings this may have brought up?

Ladies, Gentlemen, I am sorry I brought up the subject, but I shall not be expected to be sorry in any way for how I feel about the subject and those who had a hand in choosing this material for public viewing at a cultural event.

This thread has clearly lost it's allure, and some seem to suggest that this is my fault... they may be right too.
So, you will have to excuse me, but I'll move on to other more attractive subjects.
I don't want to develop any ill feelings against anybody here.

Thank you all for your interest and input! ... J-D.