Rolando Pascual - 16yr old signs with Milwaukee Brewers

Cleef

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Feb 24, 2002
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Interesting story to follow Rolando Pascual a 6'6', 195lb flamethrower signs with the Milwaukee Brewers (who don't have an academy presence in the country).

Story states that he's been cleared to go to the states and start rookie ball. A 16yr old kid, they can't be serious.
 

irishdomician

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Whats the problem?

Cleef said:
Interesting story to follow Rolando Pascual a 6'6', 195lb flamethrower signs with the Milwaukee Brewers (who don't have an academy presence in the country).

Story states that he's been cleared to go to the states and start rookie ball. A 16yr old kid, they can't be serious.


As most Canadians will tell you, we have hundreds and possibly thousands of 16 and 17 year olds playing pro and semi pro hockey.
 

rellosk

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Mar 18, 2002
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Cleef said:
Story states that he's been cleared to go to the states and start rookie ball. A 16yr old kid, they can't be serious.
It sounds like a win-win situation to me. They reportedly gave him a $710,000 signing bonus (even if he only sees half, it more than he'd earn in a lifetime in the DR) plus even if he's not successful, the salary he'll earn in the minor leagues, is more than he'd earn in the DR. For even a small market team like Milwaukee, the investment in small.

There's also the slight chance that he could be as successful as Sammy Sosua or Bernie Williams, both acquired at age 16.
 

Redscot

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irishdomician said:
As most Canadians will tell you, we have hundreds and possibly thousands of 16 and 17 year olds playing pro and semi pro hockey.


Not to mention tennis players, figure skaters, gymnasts etc. who are sequestered from society and raised in a bubble only practicing their sport of choice. In an ideal world young Rolando will be given some further education by the Brewers and helped along to emotional maturity, but he's in a better place then most of his contemporaries.

Ian
 

Cleef

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Feb 24, 2002
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Mea Culpa

irishdomician said:
As most Canadians will tell you, we have hundreds and possibly thousands of 16 and 17 year olds playing pro and semi pro hockey.
I had no idea the DR had hockey players.

So you're comparing kids born and raised in Canada, who stay in Canada to play Canada's sport in Canada - to a 16 yr old without English who moves to the states to become a professional? No family, no support structure - other than the false one supplied by the Brewers?

I'm sure Milllywaukee will set him up with a nice family that will take good care of him, but really, this is a disaster waiting to happen.
 

Cleef

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Feb 24, 2002
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Who wins?

rellosk said:
It sounds like a win-win situation to me. They reportedly gave him a $710,000 signing bonus (even if he only sees half, it more than he'd earn in a lifetime in the DR) plus even if he's not successful, the salary he'll earn in the minor leagues, is more than he'd earn in the DR. For even a small market team like Milwaukee, the investment in small.

There's also the slight chance that he could be as successful as Sammy Sosua or Bernie Williams, both acquired at age 16.
The only winners as of press time are the buscones, and the parents, period.

You really think he might see half? That's crazy talk.

I think you might see a ski resort in Jarabacoa first.

"plus even if he's not successful, the salary he'll earn in the minor leagues, is more than he'd earn in the DR. For even a small market team like Milwaukee, the investment in small."
Thanks Mr. Greenspan.

Is this really a win-win for anyone?

Obviously the wages are better in the states playing baseball, but so is the pressure and the demands on his life. He's a 16 yr. old kid, never been off that pile of coral, and now he's going to be riding buses through the back roads of the south (or wherever) away from his family, normal food, weather and lifestyle. Again, he's 16!!

$710K is NOT a small investment. That's a high second round pick in the draft on someone that's got more stability and support (and knows the language and culture) and also has a discernable track record and more projectable.

The Brewers have nothing in the DR to help support this young man; no academy, nothing - just a roving Latin American scout. I can't fathom him staying in the states all by himself, year round, which means he gets to come back at some time. What will he be coming back to?

We've seen this before. No offense to Milwaukee, but they are reaching for straws on this one.
 

suarezn

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Feb 3, 2002
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Hmmm...I have a brother who's also 16 and reportedly throws around 90 miles an hour (I haven't seen him pitch). I told him to wait a couple of more years to try to finish school and see if maybe he can get drafted, but maybe he should be looking for his money now.
 

rellosk

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Mar 18, 2002
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Cleef said:
The only winners as of press time are the buscones, and the parents, period.
And what's wrong with his parents winning? Even if he was older and his parents didn't pressure him to support them, there is a good chance that he would feel obligated. It's a good thing to take care of your parents.
Cleef said:
Obviously the wages are better in the states playing baseball, but so is the pressure and the demands on his life. He's a 16 yr. old kid, never been off that pile of coral, and now he's going to be riding buses through the back roads of the south (or wherever) away from his family, normal food, weather and lifestyle. Again, he's 16!!
Are you suggesting he wait until he's 18 and take the chance of an injury or not progressing further and never being signed?

Cleef said:
I can't fathom him staying in the states all by himself, year round, which means he gets to come back at some time. What will he be coming back to?
Do you know that he has no extended family in the US? Doesn't he get to go back to the DR to play winter ball?

Cleef said:
We've seen this before. No offense to Milwaukee, but they are reaching for straws on this one.
Of course they are, but isn't the amateur draft always a crap-shoot?

Please try to keep you responses non-combative. :nervous:
 

rellosk

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Mar 18, 2002
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suarezn said:
Hmmm...I have a brother who's also 16 and reportedly throws around 90 miles an hour (I haven't seen him pitch). I told him to wait a couple of more years to try to finish school and see if maybe he can get drafted, but maybe he should be looking for his money now.
If he can get $710,000 and has the same future outside of baseball as most Dominicans, why not?
 

irishdomician

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Cleef said:
I had no idea the DR had hockey players.

So you're comparing kids born and raised in Canada, who stay in Canada to play Canada's sport in Canada - to a 16 yr old without English who moves to the states to become a professional? No family, no support structure - other than the false one supplied by the Brewers?

I'm sure Milllywaukee will set him up with a nice family that will take good care of him, but really, this is a disaster waiting to happen.


O.K then, in Canada we have probably hundreds of young teens from europe who come here to play with less then this kid has if you want to go that route. These European kids don't sign big contracts, they play for enough money to live and feed themselves nevermind not speaking english and having no family here or anything like that. At least this kid will have a few 100 grand in his pocket!
 

miguel

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Nothing!!

Cleef said:
Story states that he's been cleared to go to the states and start rookie ball. A 16yr old kid, they can't be serious.
Actually, there's nothing wrong with this. Many players, many, are signed when they are in their teens, in the DR and everywhere baseball is played. It's a shame that a team like Milwaukee is getting him.

My brother was signed(in the US), with my older's brother consent, when he was 15 and one of my best friends(in the US), still playing, was signed when he was 16.

Milwaukee will do the same as all the other teams do: they will prepare him for EVERYTHING. They will educate the kid and teach him english. Everybody knows that this happens all the time. Sosa and MANY of those dominican players, they did not speak english when they signed and look at them now(not that they can speak english that well but enough to carry a conversation).

Besides, how can anybody forget about the best, in my opinion, catcher that have ever put on a uniform: IVAN RODRIGUEZ?. I think that he was signed when he was in DIAPERS!!!. LOL.

Btw, is that 16 in dominican years?.
 

rellosk

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miguel said:
Actually, there's nothing wrong with this. Many players, many, are signed when they are in their teens, in the DR and everywhere baseball is played. It's a shame that a team like Milwaukee is getting him.

My brother was signed(in the US), with my older's brother consent, when he was 15 and one of my best friends(in the US), still playing, was signed when he was 16.

Milwaukee will do the same as all the other teams do: they will prepare him for EVERYTHING. They will educate the kid and teach him english. Everybody knows that this happens all the time. Sosa and MANY of those dominican players, they did not speak english when they signed and look at them now(not that they can speak english that well but enough to carry a conversation).

Besides, how can anybody forget about the best, in my opinion, catcher that have ever put on a uniform: IVAN RODRIGUEZ?. I think that he was signed when he was in DIAPERS!!!. LOL.

Btw, is that 16 in dominican years?.
How did it work out with your brother? I thought MLB couldn't sign you before age 16. Did he (or MLB) lie about his age when he was signed?
 

HOWMAR

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Jan 28, 2004
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The real criminal here is Major League Baseball. Of the 3 major team sports in the US (no, I don't include hockey) baseball is the only sport that recruits and drafts future players who have not waited at least 4 years after being graduated from high school. Except for so-called hardship cases, football and basketball will not draft aplayer until four years after his high school graduation year. Basketball bends this rule much more than football, but it is still meant for a student not to be swayed from furthering his education to play ball. I know of many baseball so-called future stars who went directly from high school to the minor leagues, only to fail. Now they have no career, no education. Not only should MLB address the steroid issue, they should address this issue.
 

miguel

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Well.....!

rellosk said:
How did it work out with your brother? I thought MLB couldn't sign you before age 16. Did he (or MLB) lie about his age when he was signed?
Remember, when it come to baseball, it's business first and getting/having the upper hand on someone. He was "scouted" (looked at) beginning when he was about 13 by "someone". Never said that he was an scout since my brother was a minor but he did tell my older brother. Everybody knew. He became like a "family member". He dealt alot with my older brother and they came into an "agreement" when my brother was 15 that my brother would sign with his team when he was able to. My older brother "signed" a "contract" that basicly said that this "scout" was going to be the first one that would get a chance to "talk" with the family regarding my bother's minor league future. My older brother "signed" and he was the first and the only one that my older brother gave a chance to. When my brother was allowed to sign, he did and he was signed.

If you care to know what goes on "behind the scene" when trying to "sign" an underaged kid, PM me and I will tell you some great things. Just be prepared for some dispicable and shameful things!!.

Btw, this is in the US.
 

Cleef

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Feb 24, 2002
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Back to 7th grade.

miguel said:
Actually, there's nothing wrong with this. Many players, many, are signed when they are in their teens, in the DR and everywhere baseball is played. It's a shame that a team like Milwaukee is getting him.
Did you read the homework......

I mean, did you read the article?

Milwaukee has nothing to support him with in the DR. No academy, no winter ball teams, nothing.

I think a more entrenched team would be a far better choice for him to sign with. His options are limited; go to the states, sink or swim.

An unscientific poll that I conducted (recently) showed that 99.9% of the families depending on the professional exploits of a 16 yr. old ....better not quit their day jobs.

You think Milwaukee cares about his education?

You think a 6'6" flamethrower has been paying attention in school up to this point? Wanna bet that he hasn't been going for a long time?

Do you have even the slightest inkling of what a 16yr old's mentality is?

Especially one with no education, born and raised in a third world, and now without the creature comforts of home, culture and communication?

How's a kid like that going to react when he gets his lunch served to him when he faces older, better and more refined baseball talents? Facing crushing disappointment, realizing he isn't the big fish in a small pond anymore.

What's going to happen when he realizes that being bigger and stronger means nothing, and that he needs to work like mad to become what his suitors expectations are?

The only thing that's been expected of this young man to this day is to "win" a contract. He's done it.

Now what? 16 years old.
 

toneloc24

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Mar 8, 2004
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Sorry Cleef, but....Freddie Adu

This type of story isn't specific to the DR and baseball, unfortunately. They tried to sign this kid at 10 years old!!! :eek:

Freddy Adu: Just Going Out To Play
Aug. 8, 2004

"When teams are abusing you like that, the greatest thing to do is just score on 'em."
- Freddy Adu

(CBS) Last weekend, soccer star Freddy Adu became the youngest player ever to participate in the All-Star game of any professional sport.

That's just the latest in a string of "firsts" for Adu. When Correspondent Lesley Stahl first introduced him to you last spring, he had just become the highest-paid player in American pro soccer - $500,000 a year, at the tender age of 14.
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Freddy Adu can do just about anything he wants with a soccer ball, including fake much older players right out of their cleats. People who know say that he could develop into the best player not just in America, but in the entire, soccer-mad world.

"I just love it so much, you know," he says. "When I'm out there on the field, I'm in a whole different world, you know? It's like, I'm just having so much fun."

So he gets paid all that money to have fun?

"To have fun, yeah," he replies. "I mean, I couldn't ask for a better life, man."

It does look like a charmed life. He gets half a million dollars a year to play for D.C. United, the team he grew up watching. At an age when most kids are begging their parents for a higher allowance, he's got a $1 million contract with Nike and another endorsement deal with Pepsi.

In his first commercial, Pepsi has paired Freddy with the best soccer player in history: Pele.

Says Pele, "I told him, 'Listen. God give you, you know, the gift to play football.'"

Freddy's "football" gifts were apparent during D.C. United's very first exhibition game in February. Teammate Ben Olson is a grizzled veteran, at 26.

So how is Freddy playing?

Olson reports, "He's playing great. You probably saw today. He was, I think, one of the better players on the field. ? Already."

Bruce Arena is the most influential figure in American soccer, coach of the men's national team that will compete for the World Cup in 2006. It's a team Freddy hopes to make.

Of Freddy, Arena says, "We think he's gonna be a great one."

What is it in Freddy's play that makes everybody who knows what they're talking about say, "Oh, wow"?

Says Arena, "He's strong, he's quick, he's agile. He's got good balance, and he's got great vision. Very special."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Freddy learned the game as soon as he learned to walk, in his native Ghana, in West Africa. He didn't just play soccer; he lived it.

"I did not go one day without playing," he recalls, and it was just kicking and learning.

"It was awesome," he explains, "because, you know, like, there was no coaches, no one to tell you what to do. It was just, you play and learn stuff on your own."

It was during those early days in Ghana that Freddy's mother, Emelia, first encouraged her soccer prodigy. Freddy recalls: "My mom was always the supplier of soccer balls, and so people were always knocking on my door, and trying to get me out so we could play."

Freddy's street soccer days ended in 1998, after his parents entered a visa lottery at the U.S. embassy in Ghana. They won the lottery and got visas to come to the United States. Freddy was 8 years old.

Was it scary?

"Yes," replies Freddy, "and sad. I didn't even have a ball when I first came. I didn't even have a soccer ball, so it was hard."

Life got even harder. After they settled near Washington, D.C., Freddy says his father just abandoned the family one day.

Does Freddy ever see his father?

"No, I don't see him. He's completely out of the picture."

Freddy says he has not seen him since he left, and that his father has not tried to get in touch with him.

Emelia, suddenly the sole breadwinner for Freddy and his younger brother, worked two jobs to make ends meet.

Freddy recalls, "She would wake up at 5 in the morning, leave at 6, go to work? She gets off work at 6 in the evening, to go to an overnight job. She worked, I mean, unbelievable amount of hours, you know?"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Meanwhile, Freddy's soccer skills were noticed on the playground, and he was recruited for a local league team. In less than a year, he was the best player on an all-star team, playing with kids 4 and 5 years older than he was.

"You know, we went to Italy for a huge tournament," he recalls, "and there was teams from all over the world there, and we were representing the United States, and I was really nervous, because these guys are so much bigger than I am. I'm 10 years old. I'm about 5-foot-3, and like, weighed like 110, you know. So I'm really scared. I ended up scoring four goals in five games, and, uh, I also got the MVP (most valuable player) of the tournament and the U.S. won."

It was also that day that Freddy learned that soccer is a business as well as a game. He got an offer of $750,000 to play with an Italian soccer team.

He was 10 years old.


His mother said no.

Was Freddy upset?

"No, I wasn't upset. It was just so much money. I was just?'Why not just take it?' But, you know what? She was looking out for our well-being."

Eventually, his mom did agree to let Freddy attend a kind of "soccer boarding school" in Florida, run by the U.S. Soccer Federation. For the last two years, he's been attending classes and practicing with the national youth team.

Last year, he became a citizen and officially joined the U.S. "under-17" team. His play, even with much older opponents constantly pushing and tripping him, made the buzz around him even louder.

What is the very best moment so far that he has had, playing soccer?

Freddy recalls: "We're tied with Sierra Leone, one-one, in the second game of the tournament, and, I mean, they're hacking. They're just beating me up all over the field. 88th minute. One of my teammates, Jamie Watson, flicks the ball to me. I run by the defender, take out the goalie, and score. When teams are abusing you like that, the greatest thing to do is just score on 'em. That was the greatest feeling."

But Freddy's great play (and his confidence) also have led to accusations that he's really older than he admits.

"It's been with me, like, ever since I actually started playing, and it used to bug me a lot, you know? 'Cause you're telling me that my family's lying about my age, and we're trying to really cheat," Freddy says. "I mean, what do I have to cheat for? I've always been playing against people older than me anyways. So what do I have to cheat for?"

Was his family ever able to produce any documentation?

"Yeah, actually," Freddy replies. "I have my birth certificate and everything at home."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And, of course, now it doesn't matter anyway, because Freddy is a professional now.

But before his professional debut, Freddy's mom insisted on one more thing: that he complete an accelerated academic program for athletes in Florida that allowed him, at 14, to finish high school. He got his diploma this month.

Are there any ways in which this kid is still able to be a kid?

Freddy says he plays "a lot of PlayStation and always trying to look pretty for the girls."

Spin the bottle?

"We've done that, man," he replies. "We actually just did that last month. Crazy."

What's really crazy are the expectations being heaped on Freddy. You hear that he's the "next Pele," that he'll be the youngest player ever in a World Cup, that he'll finally make America as mad about soccer as the rest of the world is.

And 14 is really young. No other way to slice it.

Says Olson, "I couldn't imagine. I couldn't imagine this stuff he's dealing with, to play on this professional level at the age he's at is?it's remarkable."

Is there any hazing going on?

"Not yet," replies Olson. "But I think I'm gonna be in charge of that."

As the No. 1 pick on draft day, Freddy's $500,000 salary from D.C. United dwarfs even the game's veterans. It has become a clich? that every rookie with a big contract buys his mama a house. Freddy may be the first one ever to do it?and then go home and live with her.

"I wanted to get us a place of our own with a little bit more space," says Freddy. "The kitchen is just huge, because my mom?lives there, man, and she loves being in the kitchen."

Is she a good cook?

"Oh my goodness! She could be the best cook ever, man."

But is she working any more?

"She doesn't work any more. She's done," says her son. "She's had enough. You know, she's worked so hard."

Arena says, "What I know of Mrs. Adu, she is pretty sharp. And she's done a very good job in corralling Freddy a bit, and not letting his head get too big. And I think Freddy living at home is gonna be a real plus? She's gonna be able to keep him in line, and I think that's gonna help him."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
He's going to need help to keep his head from swelling. You know you're a star when you're on "Late Night With David Letterman" at an age when most kids aren't allowed to stay up late enough to watch "Letterman."

Still, the real test of how Freddy will deal with the spotlight and the pressure will come on the soccer field.

Says Arena, "What you don't wanna do is rush him in there too early and have him lose his confidence and set him back a way. And I think we need to move him along slowly."

It's a little late for that. In less than a week, he'll be on the field as a pro -- with all that that implies.

"Well, you know, they say that there's a bulls-eye on your back sometimes when you play," explains Arena. "He's gonna have one on his back and on his chest, on his forehead, on his legs."

And teammate Olson says, "Sure. You know, there's gonna be some jealousy around the league. 'I'm not gonna let a 14-year-old, you know, make me look bad.' Things like that. But that's to be expected? He's playing against grown men who are playing for their living."

Freddy acknowledges, "I know that it's not gonna be easy. They're like, 'Why is this kid making more money than me? I'm 25, and I've already done?There's this kid, hasn't even played the game yet. I mean, I know? It's true. but you know what? I mean, I don't have to prove myself to any of those guys that I'm better than them. I'm just gonna go out there and play, man."

How is he going to get to practice? He's not old enough to drive.

"Actually, I don't know. I don't know," he says. "My mom's probably gonna have to take me back and forth."

Of course, if he wasn't 14 and he wanted to tell 60 Minutes that, then he could go get his driver's license.

With a laugh, Freddy says, "Yeah. I know. That's good. I like that one."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Since this story first aired, Freddy has turned 15. He's not yet in the starting lineup for D.C. United, but he has scored two goals.

He's also a big draw at the box office. Attendance for D.C.'s home games is up 20 percent, and every time the team has played on the road, about 10,000 more fans than usual have shown up -- to see Freddy Adu.
 

Cleef

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Feb 24, 2002
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Focus

C'mon folks, focus.

We're talking about a gangly kid from the bush, who more than likely is just short of being (completely) illiterate, and furthermore hasn't any notion of life in another culture other than the barrio and MTV.

Freddy Adu is wise beyond his years, very well schooled, comes from money, etc.

Age is just a number. However when you drill down to the experiential level (for the sake of the argument) Adu is closer to a 35 yr old, Rolando's still swimming in his mother.
 

miguel

I didn't last long...
Jul 2, 2003
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Lookie here!!

Cleef said:
Did you read the homework......

I mean, did you read the article?

Milwaukee has nothing to support him with in the DR. No academy, no winter ball teams, nothing.

I think a more entrenched team would be a far better choice for him to sign with. His options are limited; go to the states, sink or swim.

An unscientific poll that I conducted (recently) showed that 99.9% of the families depending on the professional exploits of a 16 yr. old ....better not quit their day jobs.

You think Milwaukee cares about his education?

You think a 6'6" flamethrower has been paying attention in school up to this point? Wanna bet that he hasn't been going for a long time?

Do you have even the slightest inkling of what a 16yr old's mentality is?

Especially one with no education, born and raised in a third world, and now without the creature comforts of home, culture and communication?

How's a kid like that going to react when he gets his lunch served to him when he faces older, better and more refined baseball talents? Facing crushing disappointment, realizing he isn't the big fish in a small pond anymore.

What's going to happen when he realizes that being bigger and stronger means nothing, and that he needs to work like mad to become what his suitors expectations are?

The only thing that's been expected of this young man to this day is to "win" a contract. He's done it.

Now what? 16 years old.
I did read the article.

I also read the there's nowhere on that article the says some of the things that you are saying. Nowhere does it says that he is uneducated. People living in a third world country CAN have an education. If any of his family member has an ounce of common sense, they would get a lawyer and seek counseling and I am sure that they did since he is a minor.

Granted, they do not have an academy in the DR but I can bet my life that they WILL take care of their investment. They WILL not sign someone for that much money just to throw him to the "wolves". They signed him for a reason and I'll be darned if they are willing to lose all that money and not take care of him. How do I know that they will?. Because in the article, it also said, that they "will do whatever it takes".

They have signed other latin players so I gather that they know what they are doing. Baseball is, now, a business. They do not sign players, they invest in them.

When you say things like "especially with no education, born and raised in a third world and now without the creature comforts of home, culture and communication" you make it seem like this kid will be picked up at the airport and be told "you are here, this is the US, goodbye". You make it seem like he does not have a chance. Maybe he does, maybe he does not. Only time will tell. But I can asure you that in order for a team to invest almost a million dollar on someone, they saw something on that someone.

How many dominican baseball stars began just like him?. Many. So there is the possibility that he can make it. Let's not forget that Sosa, just to make one example, was so poor that he used to make his glove from a piece of cardboard.

He is not the first, nor the last kid from the DR that have been signed by a team that does not have an academy in the DR. Some in his same situation have made it so why can't he?. If they gave him so much money, that says that they, too, saw something in him.

Let's not forget that underaged kids parents and relatives are known to hire a lawyer to counsel them on business matters.

I am not saying that I know for a fact that he will make it, I am just saying that he will be given the opportunity to make it. It has been done before by many so I will not throw the "tower" on him.

The opportunity was given to him so I guess that now he has to show that he is that good. Only time will tell.

From my part, I wish him all the luck in the world!!.
 

toneloc24

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Mar 8, 2004
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Cleef said:
C'mon folks, focus.

We're talking about a gangly kid from the bush, who more than likely is just short of being (completely) illiterate, and furthermore hasn't any notion of life in another culture other than the barrio and MTV.

Freddy Adu is wise beyond his years, very well schooled, comes from money, etc.

Age is just a number. However when you drill down to the experiential level (for the sake of the argument) Adu is closer to a 35 yr old, Rolando's still swimming in his mother.

Really not trying to pick a fight, but where do you get that Freddy Adu came from money? His mother worked two jobs to support her family, rather than collect welfare, or try to cash in on her lottery ticket. Teams have been throwing money at him for years, since he was 10. I don't know why, but he still ended up signing at a young age (14), at a price of completing his high school education before his 1st pro game as per his mother's stipulation on the deal.

I only bring this up to say, Rolando's situation may not be so unique, unless his parents don't put for his best interests first, as opposed to their own self-interests. It can work out for Rolando.


"Emelia, suddenly the sole breadwinner for Freddy and his younger brother, worked two jobs to make ends meet.

Freddy recalls, "She would wake up at 5 in the morning, leave at 6, go to work? She gets off work at 6 in the evening, to go to an overnight job. She worked, I mean, unbelievable amount of hours, you know?"'