Definition of a Dominican Man

[frank12]

I got to come clean here for a minute...i got a caffeine high so intense that i'm walking on water. When i'm under these conditions and Saturn is in the seventh house, i come out of the closet and speak honestly, but not necessarily coherently.

Here's what i think about Dominican men--including my family members that have been raised here and currently live here in this country: they're sissies. Every last one of them. They're not "Men". Not even remotely. They wouldn't know what a "Man" is if one walked up to them and slapped them in the face.

They think a man is about screwing as many women as possible while maintaining a wife or girlfriend; they think carrying a gun around is what makes a man; they think lying to their woman is what men do; they think bragging about cheating on their wives and girlfriends is what men do; they think maintaining short hair and a clean shave is what makes a man a man; they think wearing long pants--including jeans--with a dress shirt and expensive leather shoes in 85f (35c) weather is how a man dresses; they think keeping their hair well trimmed and combing it all the time is what makes a man a man; they think sitting in a restaurant and having their shoes shined by some kid is what men do; they think pouring on ridiculously expensive cologne is what makes a man a man; they think driving around in an expensive car instead of walking or riding a bike is what makes a man a man; they think drinking Johnny Walker Black or Chivas Regal or any expensive cognac or liquor is what makes them sophisticated...makes them "classy"; they think pulling a gun or a beer bottle out in a fist fight is what men do; they think going to church on Sunday and mentioning "Si Dios Quiere" (If God wants it) at the end of every sentence while simultaneously trying to screw your daughter or wife is what a man is about.

Dominican men are cowards. All of them. I can't remember meeting more then a half dozen in my entire life on this island who are not. Dominican men are mostly ignorant, jealous, possessive, complainers, and materialistic.

Very few read, and the ones that do, read very, very selectively. I've only met a handful who weren't superstitious and religious--which is one in the same. I can count them on my two hands the amount of Dominican men who are atheist and are voracious readers. The few i've met really impressed me; they went against the grain despite the ostracization from their family and peers. But like all things, there was an explanation...they were either raised abroad, been educated abroad, or been living abroad for several years and changed their mindset completely; they changed their values completely, and changed their morals and definition of what a "Man" is completely.

I'm sorry...no, i really am not...I am seldom ever impressed with a Dominican man. They cherish and worship all the wrong things in life in my opinion. Yeah, i'm not right in the head, i live in van when i am in the U.S, have long hair, don't care about fancy phones or cars, don't wear dress clothes...ever! I don't care about how much money you have or make, or what you do for a living; I don't care about job titles or what i do for a living either...just as long as i have a job. Any job!

I have never worshiped or respected the same things that most Dominican men do--including my cousins and wives. I hate materialism, and am happy just having a job...any job. i don't . I don't drink, i don't smoke, i don't do drugs, and i never do things to impress someone. I do the opposite. I tell people i'm stupid...because i am.

How many Dominicans have you met that are that honest, forthright, and self-deprecating in their humor? How many have you met whom are honest about their lack of education, lack of experience, and uncertainty in certain situations? How many Dominican men have told you "I don't know anything about this, I don't have any experience in this, but i am willing to learn."

Frank

 

[boknows]

That's odd??? I never even noticed a Dominican man on the island.

 

[reilleyp]

As boknows said, I have not noticed the Dominican men that much. LOL. However, having said that, you may be correct in your observations but we have an exception to that stereotype.

Our worker was a wild man back in his 20's. Now in his 40's he is the opposite of everything you mentioned. He is taking care of kids that are not his own, as a father and a provider financially. When I gave him a big tip, he said that the first thing he will do is put aside the money for his mother and father who are very old, and who have been forgotten financial by 14 out of 16 children. I met the grandparents and I know for a fact that he has helped them.

He stops his motorcycle if he sees a stray cow or pig to see if he can find the rightful owner. He will get involved with problems that are not his own, just to do the right thing. As I mentioned, he is not perfect, but he tries hard. He can fix pretty much anything, but if he cannot he will admit it, or if I show him how to do it he listens and tries to learn. He is picking up some English, and tried to teach me some Spanish. At this point we have invented our own form of Spanglish that nobody can understand, but that is getting off subject. He also laughs at himself and calls himself a gorilla. Great guy all around, a little crazy, but definitely opposite from the stereotype you wrote about.

 

[PaGuyinDr]

First congrats on the new thread. I hope you will continue the cabarete diaries.... I am kinda living vicariously thru your exploits there.

2nd, I guess I can kind of see your point ( sorta ). However, I think those observations are true with shallow men the whole world over. The DR has not cornered the market on the type of man you just described. A**holes, ( as they are commonly referred to in the US ) abound! But that's what makes it easier for the good guys like you and me to ultimately succeed in social situations and win in life. Look at it this way, if it were not for the A**hole, how could we ever differentiate ourselves? I think they actually help us in the long run... In our careers, in our social lives, even in casual circumstances. I don't think we should hold them in derision, we should actually be grateful that the world is full of them. Because if it was not for the a**hole, how could people otherwise discern our unique and wonderful qualities? How else could people know that we have so much to offer?

Lastly, I have to disagree with you wholeheartedly on the Johnny Walker Black thingy. It is, quite frankly what the sophisticated man drinks ( assuming a Bombay Safire martini straight up with a twist is not within easy reach ).

 

[greydread]

As boknows said, I have not noticed the Dominican men that much. LOL. However, having said that, you may be correct in your observations but we have an exception to that stereotype.

One of the most encouraging signs that manhood is alive and well in the Dominican Republic was a Guy I met on my 1st trip there. I spoke absolutely no Spanish and one of the Guys who worked at the hotel where I stayed was night security and drove a taxi by day. Over the course of many visits this Guy went out of his way to show my friends and I the Santo Domingo that tourists don't see. As we learned the language and our way around town he showed us more of Santo Domingo than we ever dreamed was there. This Guy was ex-military and ex-PN but he had an entrepreneurial spirit that wouldn't be denied and during his tenure as driver/ bodyguard/ guide/ confidant it was clear to us that everyone who had met him including former LE colleagues had mad respect for the Man.

He eventually went into his own business in pest control and applied the same work ethic he's always had to that endeavor and the last time I saw him business was booming and he was financially independent with a bright future. He is a family Man who dotes on his Children and I somehow knew, shortly after meeting him that he would make good. As for the Guys sitting around playing dominoes and drinking beer all day and creeping around making babies all night? Hell, we have them in the USA. They're no surprise.

 

[frank12]

I am happy to hear that ReillyP, and i believe you. I can relate. But if you ask your worker if he won the lottery tomorrow (just a small amount of money, not much) if he would buy an SUV with the money...most likely he would say, "yes," despite not needing an SUV.

Everyone i work with at the restaurant where i work wants to own an SUV, despite the fact that most do not need an SUV.

i work with around 24 Dominicans. I am the only half-Dominican. Everyone i work with--with the exception of a few--all own either an Apple Iphone or a Samsung Galaxy--or something similar. Does it matter that most of them have no use whatsoever for such an expensive phone? No. Does it matter that most of them have never used a single app on their phone? No. Does it matter that most of them have no minutes whatsoever in order to make a phone call? No.

When i ask them why did they spend so much money on a phone (most are locked into a contracts with either Orange or Claro), they say, "Because i need it."

"Ok, i understand that, but did you need such an expensive phone when you are only making $8000 a month?" i ask them.

"Yes." they answer.

Meanwhile, i use a regular $15 phone to the shock and dismay of my co-workers. (But i do possess a smart phone that i use during football & NHL seasons for the scores and times of the games.)

Also, ask your worker if he believes in Witches or any other well known Dominican superstitions--but don't ask him in a skeptical way where he can detect skepticism in your voice--he might be reluctant to be honest in that case. Ask him if he knows anyone who has seen a Witch? And ask him if he knows of any well known Witches on this island...particularly in the Moca area where there are constant sightings of them. Two crashed on top of the church last year with several eye-witnesses. I don't know if there was any damages to the church or the broomsticks or the cruise control button.

Also, ask him if he thinks men with long hair is good or bad? Ask him what he thinks about men who walk around in shorts and flip flops and t-shirts and don't feel the need to dress up and ever any wear pants or dress shirts in 85f/35c weather? I'm thinking about my cousins and uncles right now with this question. They hate this about "Men" and they think its a sign of lack of education, bad morals, and a lack of class. They consider men with long hair to be one step slightly above homosexuality. Ok, maybe a half a step.

Ask him what he think about men who have girlfriends while being married? About all the Cabanas on the island? About homosexuality? and hell, while were at it...ask him what he thinks about abortion and atheists as well.

I have no doubt that he is a good father--most Dominicans are. I'm talking more about the definition what Dominican men perceive to be a sign of weakness in men, and in particular what a Dominican man defines as a true "Man."

Ask him if he has a gun, and if not, would he like to carry one around if you gave him one?

I understand, these are innocuous questions, but they will give an insight--or window--into what he thinks a man is or isn't?

One more thing, ask him why Dominican men love to drink Grey Goose and Johnny Walker Black or Blue, but then mix it with carbonated high fructose corn syrup--otherwise known as soda.

Frank

 

[PaGuyinDr]

One more thing, ask him why Dominican men love to drink Grey Goose and Johnny Walker Black or Blue, but then mix it with carbonated high fructose corn syrup--otherwise known as soda.

Frank

I agree itch you there. Completely unacceptable.

 

[reilleyp]

You should be filming a "reality show" and making lots of money with your funny observations. With the money you make youwould not have to put up with these guys. I will try to answer your questions in order. Some support your observations, others will show that he is a lot different;

Yes he would get an SUV, most likely a Cadillac. He would need it because most likely he would move to NY where the winters are tough and he would need an SUV worthy of a lottery winner.

The phone, just a simple one with big buttons. Eyes are getting bad and he is not a techie. Would possible get an expensive phone just to take photos.

He probably believes in witches, or saw some live in person during his younger wild days.!!!

In reference to the dress code of the men you observed, he would say "PO SEE BLAY, a little GAY"

Girlfriends, I refer back to his younger days, yes, lots, and he probably does not have an opinion on abortion, but does wear a rosary around his neck. I go to the DR for relaxation, so I do not bring up religion. Too tense of a subject and leads to arguments.

I skipped the Dominican men questions because I am not sure what you mean, and had I asked him, I think the conversation would have gotten way too deep for both of us.

He is ex military, would most likely enjoy a gun, however, he realizes that a gun makes you a target for both the cops and criminals in the DR. Maybe he just cannot afford one, or maybe he does not have one for all those reasons.

Finally, no matter what I buy him, top shelf or bottom shelf, he just likes some Brugal Anejo with some ice and water.

He is a good guy.

 

[LTSteve]

This is their world and welcome to it! You are taking your long ingrained thinking and trying to apply it to this environment. Can't be done.

LTSTeve

 

[Aguaita29]

Everyone i work with--with the exception of a few--all own either an Apple Iphone or a Samsung Galaxy--or something similar. Does it matter that most of them have no use whatsoever for such an expensive phone? No. Does it matter that most of them have never used a single app on their phone? No. Does it matter that most of them have no minutes whatsoever in order to make a phone call? No.
Frank

Funny when people have a Iphone but don?t even know how to use it, and don?t have internet access on it. All they use it for is for phone calls and to play candy crush. LOL

 

[JMB773]

Frank are you telling me you have met every Dominican man on the island???? Let me give you a little advice about being a man. The is NO definition on being a man and if you have one of if someone told you there is one you have been mislead. Just because they do not live the life you decided to live does not mean they are any less of a man then you.

The life a man decides to lead is a right and gift given to himself, you CAN'T tell another man how he chooses to live his life, how silly is that. If you think dressing like a bum, sitting around a bar listening to stories people tell you is your idea of being a man then I applaud you. I have no issues on how you live your life, because it is YOURS and only YOURS.

If a Dominican men goes out and work a "honest day" of work then they should be able to buy anything they want if it makes them HAPPY!!! the keyword being happy. If driving a Lexus LX570 does not make you happy GUESS WHAT??? you shouldn't buy one. If wearing old blue jeans, a dingy tee shirt red CROCS make you a man then you should wear them like no other.

I have met some not so cool Dominicans in DR and I know is really cool ones just like every place on the planet.

The thing you are really missing is what makes a man, is respecting the choices other men make and not JUDGING them. You focus a lot on the tangibles like if a man drinks bourbon "neat" this is a REAL man A DRUNK!!! but a real man and if a man enjoys a virgin Pina Colada no chance he could be a man even though he maybe happily married.

In the USA you would be labeled a HUGE HATER!!! and I am pretty sure Dominican men are not sitting around thinking of things they do not like about frank12.

BTW Are you telling me 100% of Dominican women on the island view frank12 as the ideal man???? If they do not, who told you that you should be the image all men in DR should follow???

From what I get from some of your post you enjoy sitting around listening to a bunch of DRUNKS!!! now how is this being a man???

 

[JMB773]

I am happy to hear that ReillyP, and i believe you. I can relate. But if you ask your worker if he won the lottery tomorrow (just a small amount of money, not much) if he would buy an SUV with the money...most likely he would say, "yes," despite not needing an SUV.

Everyone i work with at the restaurant where i work wants to own an SUV, despite the fact that most do not need an SUV.

i work with around 24 Dominicans. I am the only half-Dominican. Everyone i work with--with the exception of a few--all own either an Apple Iphone or a Samsung Galaxy--or something similar. Does it matter that most of them have no use whatsoever for such an expensive phone? No. Does it matter that most of them have never used a single app on their phone? No. Does it matter that most of them have no minutes whatsoever in order to make a phone call? No.

When i ask them why did they spend so much money on a phone (most are locked into a contracts with either Orange or Claro), they say, "Because i need it."

"Ok, i understand that, but did you need such an expensive phone when you are only making $8000 a month?" i ask them.

"Yes." they answer.

Meanwhile, i use a regular $15 phone to the shock and dismay of my co-workers. (But i do possess a smart phone that i use during football & NHL seasons for the scores and times of the games.)

Also, ask your worker if he believes in Witches or any other well known Dominican superstitions--but don't ask him in a skeptical way where he can detect skepticism in your voice--he might be reluctant to be honest in that case. Ask him if he knows anyone who has seen a Witch? And ask him if he knows of any well known Witches on this island...particularly in the Moca area where there are constant sightings of them. Two crashed on top of the church last year with several eye-witnesses. I don't know if there was any damages to the church or the broomsticks or the cruise control button.

Also, ask him if he thinks men with long hair is good or bad? Ask him what he thinks about men who walk around in shorts and flip flops and t-shirts and don't feel the need to dress up and ever any wear pants or dress shirts in 85f/35c weather? I'm thinking about my cousins and uncles right now with this question. They hate this about "Men" and they think its a sign of lack of education, bad morals, and a lack of class. They consider men with long hair to be one step slightly above homosexuality. Ok, maybe a half a step.

Ask him what he think about men who have girlfriends while being married? About all the Cabanas on the island? About homosexuality? and hell, while were at it...ask him what he thinks about abortion and atheists as well.

I have no doubt that he is a good father--most Dominicans are. I'm talking more about the definition what Dominican men perceive to be a sign of weakness in men, and in particular what a Dominican man defines as a true "Man."

Ask him if he has a gun, and if not, would he like to carry one around if you gave him one?

I understand, these are innocuous questions, but they will give an insight--or window--into what he thinks a man is or isn't?

One more thing, ask him why Dominican men love to drink Grey Goose and Johnny Walker Black or Blue, but then mix it with carbonated high fructose corn syrup--otherwise known as soda.

Frank

frank12 look up the definition of a "Condescending Man" My sister-in-law has an older model Iphone that I brought her from the states and she makes a bout 8500RD a month as you stated. Tell me why she should not have this phone a phone that she really enjoys playing games and using it as a phone and no internet access a A29 stated. If you give ONE reason why she shouldn't own an Iphone like majority of the people around the world I will TAKE BACK the phone.

The really SAD thing frank12 is you like so many other people believe POOR people should ACT and behave POOR!!!

 

[frank12]

frank12 look up the definition of a "Condescending Man" My sister-in-law has an older model Iphone that I brought her from the states and she makes a bout 8500RD a month as you stated. Tell me why she should not have this phone a phone that she really enjoys playing games and using it as a phone and no internet access a A29 stated. If you give ONE reason why she shouldn't own an Iphone like majority of the people around the world I will TAKE BACK the phone.

The really SAD thing frank12 is you like so many other people believe POOR people should ACT and behave POOR!!!

I like your post, and i agree with nearly all of it, but i would like to address some things one by one:

1. First, anyone making $8000 pesos a month should not be locked into an Orange or Claro contract that eats up more then 20% of their paycheck. I know, because i hand out 28 employees paychecks. Many have children to feed, clothes to buy, school supplies to purchase, mouths to feed, etc. The fact that they do not know how to budget their money does not mean they should own an Iphone 4.

2. The fact that many Dominicans have expensive smart phones and yet do not have any minutes in order to return anyone's call, is shall we say...ironic. But maybe the irony is lost on you? Its not lost on me. I have to repeatedly say no to people asking me to call this person or that person, or to borrow my cell phone in order to make an emergency phone call to their kids at home.

3. The fact that someone does an honest days work for an honest days wage is fantastic. I applaud it. I work for almost nothing so i can relate. But its reckless to then go out and spend a large percentage of your income on a phone that you do not need when you have other more important priorities to address...like child support. Its about having your priorities in check. It sounds like you got yours in check. That's fantastic. I'm happy for you. But most people making 8000 pesos a month ($200 US a month) do not have their prioritizes in check. Not remotely. Hence, they spend a lot of their money on clothes and dressing in a pre-conceived fashion which dictates in Dominican society and culture that "This is how a real Man dresses."

Dominicans are a slave to fashion, and a slave to high percentage loans that they use to purchase furniture and motorcycles, etc. The loans are 3% to 3.5% a month (36% to 40% a year!!) many spend large chunks of their paychecks on clothes, phones, hair, etc. when it could have been better spent on school supplies, food, and more pressing needs.

I'll answer some of your other issues in a minute.

Frank

 

[frank12]

OK, where did i leave off...oh yeah...the definition of a Man.

To me, a man or woman is someone who takes care of their responsibilities and gets their priorities in line. This means you leave the materialism somewhere else. It means you spend within your means. This does not mean borrow as much money or credit as you can and then hope that somehow everything will turn out alright.

It does not mean dressing in expensive leather shoes, expensive jeans and clothes in order to impress someone. It means being comfortable with who you are. It means being comfortable with what you are about. You do not need an expensive Iphone when you have no use for it. You do not need to be locked in an expensive Orange or Claro contract just to impress your friends. Ok, if the phone came to you cheaply or as a gift, great, there is nothing wrong with that. But spending money you do not have...maybe its time to step back and re-access your priorities in life.

Being a Man means doing what's right, even when everyone around you is doing the opposite. It means learning to think for yourself, and not being a slave to marketing and sales gimmicks. If you can afford an Iphone, great. I can obviously afford one, but i do not need one except for rare occasions.

Is being a Man driving around an SUV which you struggle to pay for? Is being a man walking around with a handgun sticking out of your pants? Is being a man walking around in expensive clothes and expensive leather shoes which you cannot afford to get wet? Is being a man carrying around the latest IPhone when you do not even have internet access?

I cannot pretend to know what being a real man is? Certainly, none of my Dominican relatives would say i fall anywhere under the definition of a real man. In fact, they would say the opposite. They think i am a homosexual with my long hair, freaky people...need not apply, attitude. But i live within my means, have no loans, do not drive a car, do not carry a gun, do not want an SUV, and i do not own jewelry, nor do I own a pair pants or shoes.

So, i got that going for me. I must be one ring down from a flaming homosexual.

Frank

 

[greydread]

In the USA you would be labeled a HUGE HATER!!! and I am pretty sure Dominican men are not sitting around thinking of things they do not like about frank12.

They are now.


Jejejeje!

 

[neural]

"I'M NOT A BAD GUY. I know that sounds--defensive, unscrupulous--but it's true. I'm like everybody else: weak full of
mistakes, but basically good. Magdalena disagrees though. She considers me a typical Dominican man: a sucio, an
a******".

These are the opening lines of THE SUN, THE MOON, THE STARS by Junot Diaz. In his collection of short stories "This is How
You Lose Her" he skillfully describes Dominican men.

 

[skinny36]

I think most dominican women are the same...no???


[/I]

I am happy to hear that ReillyP, and i believe you. I can relate. But if you ask your worker if he won the lottery tomorrow (just a small amount of money, not much) if he would buy an SUV with the money...most likely he would say, "yes," despite not needing an SUV.

Everyone i work with at the restaurant where i work wants to own an SUV, despite the fact that most do not need an SUV.

i work with around 24 Dominicans. I am the only half-Dominican. Everyone i work with--with the exception of a few--all own either an Apple Iphone or a Samsung Galaxy--or something similar. Does it matter that most of them have no use whatsoever for such an expensive phone? No. Does it matter that most of them have never used a single app on their phone? No. Does it matter that most of them have no minutes whatsoever in order to make a phone call? No.

When i ask them why did they spend so much money on a phone (most are locked into a contracts with either Orange or Claro), they say, "Because i need it."

"Ok, i understand that, but did you need such an expensive phone when you are only making $8000 a month?" i ask them.

"Yes." they answer.

Meanwhile, i use a regular $15 phone to the shock and dismay of my co-workers. (But i do possess a smart phone that i use during football & NHL seasons for the scores and times of the games.)

Also, ask your worker if he believes in Witches or any other well known Dominican superstitions--but don't ask him in a skeptical way where he can detect skepticism in your voice--he might be reluctant to be honest in that case. Ask him if he knows anyone who has seen a Witch? And ask him if he knows of any well known Witches on this island...particularly in the Moca area where there are constant sightings of them. Two crashed on top of the church last year with several eye-witnesses. I don't know if there was any damages to the church or the broomsticks or the cruise control button.

Also, ask him if he thinks men with long hair is good or bad? Ask him what he thinks about men who walk around in shorts and flip flops and t-shirts and don't feel the need to dress up and ever any wear pants or dress shirts in 85f/35c weather? I'm thinking about my cousins and uncles right now with this question. They hate this about "Men" and they think its a sign of lack of education, bad morals, and a lack of class. They consider men with long hair to be one step slightly above homosexuality. Ok, maybe a half a step.

Ask him what he think about men who have girlfriends while being married? About all the Cabanas on the island? About homosexuality? and hell, while were at it...ask him what he thinks about abortion and atheists as well.

I have no doubt that he is a good father--most Dominicans are. I'm talking more about the definition what Dominican men perceive to be a sign of weakness in men, and in particular what a Dominican man defines as a true "Man."

Ask him if he has a gun, and if not, would he like to carry one around if you gave him one?

I understand, these are innocuous questions, but they will give an insight--or window--into what he thinks a man is or isn't?

One more thing, ask him why Dominican men love to drink Grey Goose and Johnny Walker Black or Blue, but then mix it with carbonated high fructose corn syrup--otherwise known as soda.

Frank

 

[skinny36]

I also think it has to do with education....if most women in the DR would have an education and have a decent job..they wouldn't rely so much on the men and would pack their bags for them if they found out they were cheating. They really don't have a choice..and the men know that...and so it continues for generations!

 

[bronzeallspice]

I also think it has to do with education....if most women in the DR would have an education and have a decent job..they wouldn't rely so much on the men and would pack their bags for them if they found out they were cheating. They really don't have a choice..and the men know that...and so it continues for generations!

Oh, but lots of Dominican women are educated and work but still choose not to leave their
husbands when they are caught cheating.

I know this married Dominican couple in the DR that the husband has fathered 3 children
(one was stillborn) to a woman he met at his job and his wife found out about it and
although their was a huge fight over it she decided to stay with him because she loves
him.:tired: So now he has two women and goes to his mistress' place when he feels like
it.

She had a choice, to leave him and return home to her mother's house.

 

[skinny36]

Guess that's why I have been married a few times...I don't put up with S&*T.....you treat me like trash...I put you out like the trash!!!
A friend of mine, dominican woman, has a man, he is married and has three kids... I said to her..."why would you put yourself through that?? Do you like drama? do you like waiting for a man?
It's beyond me!

Oh, but lots of Dominican women are educated and work but still choose not to leave their
husbands when they are caught cheating.

I know this married Dominican couple in the DR that the husband has fathered 3 children
(one was stillborn) to a woman he met at his job and his wife found out about it and
although their was a huge fight over it she decided to stay with him because she loves
him.:tired: So now he has two women and goes to his mistress' place when he feels like
it.

She had a choice, to leave him and return home to her mother's house.