Greatest Dominican President

[DCfred]

I would say Bosch. Not only was he a great thinker, a man of great intellectual ability, but he was immensely honest and never used his position to enrich himself. It was unfortunate that he came to power so soon after the Bay of Pigs. His vision of a more equitable society was viewed by the establishment as the road to a communist state. And with Washington's nod, he was soon rendered to the ash hep of presidential history. The cold war was an unfortunate time in the Dominican Republic. Many well meaning people who wanted to empower the Dominican people were "neutralized" by being branded "communist." And Washington and the Church looked the other way.

Trujillo was a psychopath. Even some of his descendants admit that. People always reminisce about how wonderful it was then during Trujillo. It was only wonderful if you were part of the oligarchy. And even them had to fear him. I know a woman who had to go to Baltimore for a year because her family was tipped off that Trujillo was after her.


Balaguer's legacy will crumble with the years, just as his ill constructed monumental works are crumbling -- the perfect metaphor for him.

Fernandez, well is too hard to tell. I want to know more about the deal he made with Balaguer in 1996.

PRD's presidents, Antonio, Gorge and Hippo have their spot in the presidential hall of shame and corruption. Bosch is my choice.

 

[miguel]

Re: Best President......

I am ashamed that today people think Trujillo and Balaguer were the best Dominican presidents. It would be interestnig to see if you would still think they are the best if members of your family had been killed by these cruel dictators.
The best Dominican presidents have been Juan Bosch and Antonio Guzman.

yes, i had a uncle dissapear when balaguer was in power and i know that he was a cruel president at the beginning of his presidency but i am speaking from my mind and not from my heart. if i speak with my heart, yes i feel that the was one of the worse but speaking from my head, i have to understand what he did for the country. the country is the way it is now because he fixed the whole country. go back before he was president and u will see that the country was a mess. the houses and the streets were disgusting. remember that dr is a third world country and even now u go there and it looks great for a country that had nothing to show. you are intitled to your opinion but remember that juan bosch, althought a great mind, was in power for only 3 months and there is no way in anybody's mind that one can be a great president after only 3 months in power. if he was so great, then why did they took him out of office. in case u do not know, it was because of his communist ideas and presidents all over the world thoght that he was going to make the dr another cuba. do not get me wrong, bosch was a great mind, but very stupid in his views and ideas. how can anybody say that guzman was the greatest dominican president when the poor man had to commit suicide because, while in power, he put his whole family to steal to no end. it was estimated that him and his family stole more than 500 million us dollars. and do not forget to recall that, before he took power, he was a businessman that also sold milk and when the price of milk went down, he said " i will not sell my milk that low, i prefer to throw in the river" and he did. instead of giving it to the poor, he decided to throw it away. in my oipinion, and it's only my opinion, the worse dominicans presidents are 1- rafael leonidas trujillo molina, 2- eulises giroz "lili", 3- salvador jorge blanco, 4- antonio guzman fernandez, 5- jaboco magluta, 6- hipolito mejia and maybe 10 or 15 more. let them show what they can do for the country and the dominican people and not what they can do for themselves, their friends and family.

just an opinion.

mah

 

[saturnc15_DR]

still do not believe....

With all due respect, I think that Balaguer did a lot for the country...it is true..he built roads, streets, highways, etc. However, it is said that the qualities of a great president are seen not on what he does to improve the country, but on what he does to improve his own people. You CANNOT try to reform the internal Dominican market without investing on your own people. Balaguer, unfortunately, did not invest on the Dominican people. In fact, he killed a lot of his own , and no great president would ever behave in such a cowardly manner.
Let me remind you that Juan Bosch was democratically elected president in December 1962 with backing from the Kennedy administration. He was a strong advocate for land reform, enforcing civil liberties, and nationalism issues. I DO agree that his views were with direct contrast to communist regimes of the time. However, Juan Bosch did what no other president had done before (and still have not done).. he invested on education in such a great extent that he provided scholarships to thousands of students (no matter what political party or views...just Dominicans) to countries such as Mexico and the Soviet Union to pursue their higher education with the promise that some day they would return, and help improve their nation.
TODAY, the technological, social, and economic advances of the nation are due to this same group of intellectuals who had such an opportunity.

Remember, while the country was suffering from the wrong-doings of the CDE, Balaguer built a monument to Columbus. The monument took more energy than half of all the houses in the island. That is not good investment. The man was smart, but a little distorted.

A GREAT PRESIDENT DOES NOT KILL HIS OWN !!!

 

[saturnc15_DR]

I forgot...

If you cna name one time in which Balaguer was elected democratically I will bow to your feet. Of course that will never happen, because, unlike Juan Bosch, both Balaguer nor Trujillo were EVER elected by the will of the Dominican people.

 

[Jon S.]

Well........when it comes down to it, they were all mediocre or just took things to the extreme. Bosch tried to do something good but the timing was horrible and the opposition used it to their advantage. Balaguer was Trujillo's brains anyways so everything that was done in Trujillo's time was something Balaguer probably came up with. Balaguer's governments were a mixed bag to me(and probably everyone else too) but he did good things, lots of public works which, surprisingly, are still around. Leonel was too recent, if he gets re-elected and picks up some balls on his way to the Palacio, then maybe he will show what he's made of. Everyone else was a prick so I won't comment, kinda funny since the others have all been PRD presidents

 

[Tony C]

And what exactly were the "good things" that Bosch was planning on doing?
Nationalize industry?
Align the DR with the Warsaw Pact?
Create Class warefare?
End the family unit?

What a shame they kicked him out so quickly. After all the people liked the idea of selling Dulce de Leche on street corners! That was Dr. Bosch's response when a reporter asked him about the Failing Economy.

 

[saturnc15_DR]

Today...

Well, apparently our notions of what a great president is, or shall be, are a bit different.
I'm glad that Dominicans are interested on this notion, since we really need it.
I think the gresatest president of all is the one that incorporates particular ideas of the presidents we have all characterized as great presidents.
let's hope our great president is coming soon.

 

[miguel]

And what exactly were the "good things" that Bosch was planning on doing?
Nationalize industry?
Align the DR with the Warsaw Pact?
Create Class warefare?
End the family unit?

What a shame they kicked him out so quickly. After all the people liked the idea of selling Dulce de Leche on street corners! That was Dr. Bosch's response when a reporter asked him about the Failing Economy.

tony, i could not have agreed with you more. juan bosch was a communist that was going to turn the dr into one of the worse country in the world. thanks God that they saw what he was about and kicked his ass before dr became a communist country with another criminal dictador. as i stated before, he had a great mind but a very stupid mouth. bosch, one of the best, give me a ....... brake.

 

[saturnc15_DR]

suggestion....

Al Pueblo Dominicano:

Ni vivos ni muertos, ni en el poder ni en la calle se lograr? de nosotros que cambiemos nuestra conducta. Nos hemos opuesto y nos opondremos siempre a los privilegios, al robo, a la persecuci?n, a la tortura.

Creemos en la libertad, en la dignidad y en el derecho del pueblo dominicano a vivir y a desarrollar su democracia con libertades humanas pero tambi?n con justicia social.

En siete meses de gobierno no hemos derramado una gota de sangre ni hemos ordenado una tortura ni hemos aceptado que un centavo del pueblo fuera a parar a manos de ladrones.

Hemos permitido toda clase de libertades y hemos tolerado toda clase de insultos, porque la democracia debe ser tolerante; pero no hemos tolerado persecuciones ni cr?menes ni torturas ni huelgas ilegales ni robos porque la democracia respeta al ser humano y exige que se respete el orden p?blico y demanda honestidad.

Los hombres pueden caer, pero los principios no. Nosotros podemos caer, pero el pueblo no debe permitir que caiga la dignidad democr?tica.

La democracia es un bien del pueblo y a ?l le toca defenderla. Mientras tanto, aqu? estamos, dispuestos a seguir la voluntad del pueblo.

Juan Bosch

Palacio Nacional,

26 de septiembre, 1963.



...I BELIEVE IN DIGNITY AND DEMOCRACY..IF THE DOMINICAN NATION ELECTED HIM TO BE THE PRESIDENT BEING HIM A COMMUNIST...THEN THE DR SHOULD HAVE BEEN A COMMUNIST NATION...IT'S CALLED CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT.
Obviously no one in this forum cares about the constitution.
Long live Juan Bosch !! Long Live PLD !!!!

 

[miguel]

Re: suggestion....

Al Pueblo Dominicano:

Ni vivos ni muertos, ni en el poder ni en la calle se lograr? de nosotros que cambiemos nuestra conducta. Nos hemos opuesto y nos opondremos siempre a los privilegios, al robo, a la persecuci?n, a la tortura.

Creemos en la libertad, en la dignidad y en el derecho del pueblo dominicano a vivir y a desarrollar su democracia con libertades humanas pero tambi?n con justicia social.

En siete meses de gobierno no hemos derramado una gota de sangre ni hemos ordenado una tortura ni hemos aceptado que un centavo del pueblo fuera a parar a manos de ladrones.

Hemos permitido toda clase de libertades y hemos tolerado toda clase de insultos, porque la democracia debe ser tolerante; pero no hemos tolerado persecuciones ni cr?menes ni torturas ni huelgas ilegales ni robos porque la democracia respeta al ser humano y exige que se respete el orden p?blico y demanda honestidad.

Los hombres pueden caer, pero los principios no. Nosotros podemos caer, pero el pueblo no debe permitir que caiga la dignidad democr?tica.

La democracia es un bien del pueblo y a ?l le toca defenderla. Mientras tanto, aqu? estamos, dispuestos a seguir la voluntad del pueblo.

Juan Bosch

Palacio Nacional,

26 de septiembre, 1963.



...I BELIEVE IN DIGNITY AND DEMOCRACY..IF THE DOMINICAN NATION ELECTED HIM TO BE THE PRESIDENT BEING HIM A COMMUNIST...THEN THE DR SHOULD HAVE BEEN A COMMUNIST NATION...IT'S CALLED CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT.
Obviously no one in this forum cares about the constitution.
Long live Juan Bosch !! Long Live PLD !!!!

WHATEVER DUDE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[DCfred]

The one point that I forgot to mention earlier on in this thread and an important one to make is that the oligarchy was terrified of any notion of land reform. Bosch understood that as long as the majority of farmers did not have title to their land it would be a useless asset. With no tile you can't borrow money to plant crops, buy farm machinery or just sell the asset. Legally, you have no collateral. Bosh knew that to lift the rural people, more of them would have to have clear title to the land they work. But at the time, this was viewed as a great threat to liberty. The funny thing is that Trujillo took his enemy's land with no compensation whatsoever and then parceled it out to his supporters. People who criticize Bosch but praise Trujillo and Balaguer are being intellectually dishonest

 

[miguel]

The one point that I forgot to mention earlier on in this thread and an important one to make is that the oligarchy was terrified of any notion of land reform. Bosch understood that as long as the majority of farmers did not have title to their land it would be a useless asset. With no tile you can't borrow money to plant crops, buy farm machinery or just sell the asset. Legally, you have no collateral. Bosh knew that to lift the rural people, more of them would have to have clear title to the land they work. But at the time, this was viewed as a great threat to liberty. The funny thing is that Trujillo took his enemy's land with no compensation whatsoever and then parceled it out to his supporters. People who criticize Bosch but praise Trujillo and Balaguer are being intellectually dishonest

and since we live in the good u s of a, u r entitled to your opinion

 

[saturnc15_DR]

DCFred....

Obvioulsly u are a man who clearly knows about DOminican history DCFred. Thumbs up.

 

[Tony C]

Re: suggestion....

...I BELIEVE IN DIGNITY AND DEMOCRACY..IF THE DOMINICAN NATION ELECTED HIM TO BE THE PRESIDENT BEING HIM A COMMUNIST...THEN THE DR SHOULD HAVE BEEN A COMMUNIST NATION...IT'S CALLED CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT.
Obviously no one in this forum cares about the constitution.
Long live Juan Bosch !! Long Live PLD !!!!

After years of being under trujillo and the mess the DR became after his murder the Dominican people just voted for anybody that was different. I am a strong believer in Democracy as well but only if the electorate is eductated and privy to freely. desiminated information. Neither which was common in the DR at the time.
Bosch was elected by claiming he was not either a communist or a socialist.
Just a few days ago I was watching a Documentary about Cuba. In it was the famous clip of Fidel declaring in English; "I am not a Communist!" Of course this was just after his rise to power and he was still hoping to milk a few more bucks from the NYC Liberal elite.

 

[Texas Bill]

I think it was Michaevelli who said (or words to the effect) "Tell whatever story you need to gain the results you want."

It seems to me that all the Presidents of the DR have been followers of Michaevelli since their practices have adhered to his "Philosophy".

What one President did to elevate the country/society another did the opposite and tore it down. Ingrained in the day to day political endeavors are the ingrediants of greed, malfeasence, and corruption in EVERY administration, no matter WHO has been President. In this light, NONE of the previous Presidents have earned the symbolic "GREAT" attachment to their names. They have neither been good administrators, nor managers, since they obviously didn't manage their subordinates nor administer justice and equality.

So, the debate is moot.

Texas Bill

 

[Criss Colon]

Geatest Dominican Astronaut?????????????

and.....Greatest Dominican President????????

Two Imponderables!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC

 

[DCfred]

A balanced view about Bosch from El Caribe:

http://www.elcaribe.com.do/caribe_digital/raices/biografias_RD/biografias_bosch.htm

 

[bochinche]

......what the heck! i'm going to add something to this.

the most intelligent president - probably a tie between bosch and balaguer.

the most ruthless dictator - 'lili' or trujillo, but there were others.

worst president - too many to decide from.

..................i like living in this country, but i came to the conclusion a long time ago that this is a tin-pot country, with a tin-pot government and a tin-pot economy.

...all dr presidents, past and dare i say it, present are in it for themselves - it's just some are better at it than others (SJB vs. Guzman, for example). you could argue that bosch wasn't in it for himself, but that is all you will end up doing - argue.

i see words being bandied about like, communism, democracy, dictatorship.

i've never understood why people take offense to communism, or why people should call someone a communist as if it was a bad word.
there have been no communist presidents here (bosch included), but look at cuba, even with u.s. embargoes they still have some of the best education and health programs in the world. unfortunately, fidel is a dictator, and whether you like him or not. that in itself is probably not a good thing.
besides most people here are so greedy for personal gain, it probably wouldn't work in the d.r. anyway.

democracy....i hate namby-pambies that use this word as if it's the saviour of the world.
democracy....many countries, including this one are just not ready for democracy. i didn't like fujimori, but he had the right idea when he officially suspended democracy in peru - what the hell is peru supposed to do with a democracy - look at it now, since he left. it is in a terrible state.
.....musharraf, a member of the pakistani army undemocratically took over pakistan, sounds bad, but don't tell me any of the bhutto family are "democratic" - they were supposedly elected democratically, but what is the point of that if all they do is become "in it" for themselves.
if the people are not well informed, democracy is impossible. dominicans are not well informed.

democracy also leads to other problems .....mugabe, he was elected democratically, when rhodesia/zimbabwe abandoned apartheid. he is still there 28 years later and is such a ruthless dictator that he makes trujillo look like a saint.

dictators - usually terrible. however, trujillo doesn't compare on the world stage to idi amin, emperor bokassa or even saddam hussein (i haven't even mentioned hitler). there are, though, some "acceptable" dictators - most of the arab gulf states are run by one emir, sheikh or another. monaco is run by prince rainier, a dictator.
even papa and baby doc duvalier are much more well known around the world than trujillo. so if you are sick enough to describe trujillo as 'great', then in terms of what? or in comparison with who?

what you have to conclude is this................there have not been any dominican presidents, as of this point in time, that can be truly described as 'great' and to pick out the greatest is akin to choosing the best chocolate from a packet of m&m's.

the truly 'great' dominican president hasn't arrived yet, and although he probably won't be popular, i believe he is one that will invest in the infrastructure rather than the people (something similar has happened with the present costa rica - the people are now reaping the benefits of that change in infrastructure).
that will mean yet another great sacrifice, but i do hope the greatest dominican president will be elected soon.

 

[Tony C]

....
i've never understood why people take offense to communism, or why people should call someone a communist as if it was a bad word.
there have been no communist presidents here (bosch included), but look at cuba, even with u.s. embargoes they still have some of the best education and health programs in the world. unfortunately, fidel is a dictator, and whether you like him or not. that in itself is probably not a good thing.
besides most people here are so greedy for personal gain, it probably wouldn't work in the d.r. anyway.

Sorry but not true.

The sucess of the Cuban educational system is a fraud. Yes they can assemble an Ak-47 but the basics are very much laking.
My wife(Dominican BTW) Works with recent arrivals from other countries in the Miami-Dade County Public School system. She is constantly amazed at how poorly educated the recently arrived school children from Cuba are. 4th graders who don't even know their multiplication tables. 3rd graders that don't know their alphabet.
The health program is even worse. Sure their is great medicine but that is for tourists with hard currencey(US DOllars) the Typical Cuban has to depend on medicines sent to them from family members abroad. Thats after having to wait for days just to see a doctor. If you don't have family members abroad to send you medicine you are SOL

The reason that Communism is such a dirty word for me is that it goes against my basic Human nature. I work hard so i expect to be rewarded. Why should my work go to reward somebody who doesn't work as hard as I do.
I will say that their has never been a truly Communistic Goverment. It has been used as a way for despots to control the masses. the main reason it has not nor will be applied is because it will and cannot work.

Now getting back to the original question of this post....
What is Great? Like or hate him Balaguer for me was an extremely intelligent and sharp individual. Were all his actions what was best for the DR. Probobly not. Same for Trujillo. Actually you have to give some credit to anybody who attains the post of Head of State of almost any nation.

 

[mariaobetsanov]

This is an old post, A president have to be a freely elected not a DICTATOR. TRUJILLO BUILD ROAD WITH OTHER PEOPLE MONIES, ASK AND FIND OUT WHO BUILD THE ROAD TO PUERTO PLATO FROM SANTIAGO. AND YOU WILL FIND A MAN WHO HAS NOT YET BEEN PAID OVER THIRTY MILLION AMERICAN DOLLARS THAT HE SPEND PLUS INTEREST FOR OVER THE YEARS THAT IS OUTSTANDING EVEN TODAY! WHEN HE PRESENTED HIMSELF TO COLLECT, HE WAS GIVEN THE CHOICE TO LEAVE OR DIE TRYING. HE WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A FRIEND.,OF TRUJILLO., HE WAS MY MOTHER GODFATHER.