Next minister of Interior & Police says government will apply the law

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TropicalPaul

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Sep 3, 2013
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I assume you are a low class tourist that does not fall within the 5 % figure (that you drew from a hat.) Is that correct? Have you ever stayed in boutique hotels? Ever meet university grads? Have you eaten in real "5 "star restaurants or shopped in luxe malls? Ever stayed at the weekend places that los Ricos stay at? rRch or wannabe rich tourist also stay there amigo. I used to think the way you think years ago. Then I saw another way. A way that you will NEVER see because every post you make is negative. Negative. And more negative. You are so hung up on who "drives the bus" that you will never see the real DR.
And you generally end your posts with a line of unsubstantiated BS opinion. Who are YOU to say the DR "will remain unchanged"? Tell me who do you think is listening to you or respects you?
I can back up everything I have stated here but quite honestly I don't feel I should give you the time. I don't like you and I'm sorry to say that. Have a wonderful evening wherever you are.

While I agree that there are upscale places such as Cap Cana and Casa de Campo it's true that the model in DR has been very much about high volume, low-cost. From the UK the key number is a week in an all-inclusive for £1,000 including a 9 hour return flight (which on its own costs minimum £500). After all the agencies take their commission and taxes are paid, hotels have to operate on average on around US$50 per person per day, all-inclusive and to do that you have to have serious volume. Once those flights are up and running and 80% of passengers go to an AI, yes, the remaining seats fill the Casa de Campo, the boutique hotels, the eco-lodges, the boys in Sosua etc. But without the AI's in Punta Cana the rest falls like a pack of cards.

I know the Americans reading this will say "ah but Jetblue flies all over the island" but it's important to remember that US visitors are "only" 50% of the total. You also need your Europeans, your South Americans, your Russians and your Canadians to get that type of volume. And this is why David Collado has been doing a whistle-stop tour to the owners of the big AI's in the last few days. These are the priority, once they get up and running the rest will fall into place. At this stage, reinventing what the DR is isn't really an option, it would take years and years to do that and the economic consequences would just be too great.
 

GusFring

Well-known member
Apr 15, 2020
532
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I assume you are a low class tourist that does not fall within the 5 % figure (that you drew from a hat.) Is that correct? Have you ever stayed in boutique hotels? Ever meet university grads? Have you eaten in real "5 "star restaurants or shopped in luxe malls? Ever stayed at the weekend places that los Ricos stay at? rRch or wannabe rich tourist also stay there amigo. I used to think the way you think years ago. Then I saw another way. A way that you will NEVER see because every post you make is negative. Negative. And more negative. You are so hung up on who "drives the bus" that you will never see the real DR.
And you generally end your posts with a line of unsubstantiated BS opinion. Who are YOU to say the DR "will remain unchanged"? Tell me who do you think is listening to you or respects you?
I can back up everything I have stated here but quite honestly I don't feel I should give you the time. I don't like you and I'm sorry to say that. Have a wonderful evening wherever you are.
Refute what I said. The poster said he would like to see more high end tourists as a solution.

The 60,000+ rooms in Punta Cana are not designed for a high end tourist. Refute it.

Your personal attacks refute nothing. Why is it so difficult to engage in a civil discourse?
 

GusFring

Well-known member
Apr 15, 2020
532
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While I agree that there are upscale places such as Cap Cana and Casa de Campo it's true that the model in DR has been very much about high volume, low-cost. From the UK the key number is a week in an all-inclusive for £1,000 including a 9 hour return flight (which on its own costs minimum £500). After all the agencies take their commission and taxes are paid, hotels have to operate on average on around US$50 per person per day, all-inclusive and to do that you have to have serious volume. Once those flights are up and running and 80% of passengers go to an AI, yes, the remaining seats fill the Casa de Campo, the boutique hotels, the eco-lodges, the boys in Sosua etc. But without the AI's in Punta Cana the rest falls like a pack of cards.

I know the Americans reading this will say "ah but Jetblue flies all over the island" but it's important to remember that US visitors are "only" 50% of the total. You also need your Europeans, your South Americans, your Russians and your Canadians to get that type of volume. And this is why David Collado has been doing a whistle-stop tour to the owners of the big AI's in the last few days. These are the priority, once they get up and running the rest will fall into place. At this stage, reinventing what the DR is isn't really an option, it would take years and years to do that and the economic consequences would just be too great.
This is 100% spot on. High volume low quality. Just like all of the Chinese components installed in 95% of plumbing, cars, electronics, masks, and you name it.

It's not good bad or indifferent. It's not a judgment. It is simply is a fact. If you disagree, refute it.

High end tourism is a bonus. Cream on the top.
 

aarhus

Woke European
Jun 10, 2008
5,008
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While I agree that there are upscale places such as Cap Cana and Casa de Campo it's true that the model in DR has been very much about high volume, low-cost. From the UK the key number is a week in an all-inclusive for £1,000 including a 9 hour return flight (which on its own costs minimum £500). After all the agencies take their commission and taxes are paid, hotels have to operate on average on around US$50 per person per day, all-inclusive and to do that you have to have serious volume. Once those flights are up and running and 80% of passengers go to an AI, yes, the remaining seats fill the Casa de Campo, the boutique hotels, the eco-lodges, the boys in Sosua etc. But without the AI's in Punta Cana the rest falls like a pack of cards.

I know the Americans reading this will say "ah but Jetblue flies all over the island" but it's important to remember that US visitors are "only" 50% of the total. You also need your Europeans, your South Americans, your Russians and your Canadians to get that type of volume. And this is why David Collado has been doing a whistle-stop tour to the owners of the big AI's in the last few days. These are the priority, once they get up and running the rest will fall into place. At this stage, reinventing what the DR is isn't really an option, it would take years and years to do that and the economic consequences would just be too great.
I think it was just one poster on here said focus just on the high end market and that is an important market here but you describe it well here. You know the tourism market. So they need to come up with something to get this going again.
 

GusFring

Well-known member
Apr 15, 2020
532
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So Mr. Boyter, I pose to you the following questions as well.....
What would you consider a fair price to be for a foreigner to remain here within the RD for 3 months/6 months, without residency?
The existing fee schedule is a fair price.

It has worked pretty well now for how many years?
 
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johne

Silver
Jun 28, 2003
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Refute what I said. The poster said he would like to see more high end tourists as a solution.

The 60,000+ rooms in Punta Cana are not designed for a high end tourist. Refute it.

Your personal attacks refute nothing. Why is it so difficult to engage in a civil discourse?
It was not a personal attack. If you feel that way I suggest you contact the mods and ask for censure. It is difficult to engage in a civil conversation because you drive done a one way street only. I have no time for you foolishness nor time to refute anything you say. This is a board of opinions and you should accept the fact that I don't agree with any of your opinions.
 

Caonabo

LIFE IS GOOD
Sep 27, 2017
7,339
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This is 100% spot on. High volume low quality. Just like all of the Chinese components installed in 95% of plumbing, cars, electronics, masks, and you name it.

It's not good bad or indifferent. It's not a judgment. It is simply is a fact. If you disagree, refute it.

High end tourism is a bonus. Cream on the top.

Mr 'Gus,

You read my assertion within posting #465, and cherry picked it to fit other means in your response #'s 495 & 502, as well as here in 503.

The record will show that my original statement within #465 was:
"Again, I personally do not stand to gain from the implementation of a long term visa agreement for those tourists who wish to make believe they reside here within RD.
I would only like to see a higher class of tourist visit. We do not need more low hanging fruit in my opinion."

My statement was not indicating ALL tourists who visit this country. It was meant to address those tourists who choose to stay long term. I, nor this country, have any use for long term low hanging fruit. They just get in the way of quality progress. If the long termers were of substantial means, I would be willing to make an exception.

Again, my original statement was not meant to broad brush the entire tourist industry. If you would like to invoke my thoughts, please keep them within their original context.
 

Caonabo

LIFE IS GOOD
Sep 27, 2017
7,339
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If they are illegal and discovered, they could be deported. Why do they need a separate discourse? Venezuelans are not very prevalent on the north coast with the exception of the good BBQ place I used to go to called Crazy Ranch.

The Venezuelans do not need a separate discourse, but they are here in very substantial numbers, second to Haitians.
Venezuelans are not very prevalent on the north coast, because there is not that much money on the north coast to be made, besides what many of the self-important people would have you believe.
 

GusFring

Well-known member
Apr 15, 2020
532
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The existing exit fee schedule is geared towards low budget personnel....aka, low hanging fruit.
'High-end" tourists are in and out. They do a 5 dayer, maybe a 10 dayer or a 2 weeker that's it.

As I said and has been repeated by other posters, the system is geared for volume. More volume more money. Millions of tourists.

Describing the millions and millions of tourists to the DR as low hanging fruit is like saying the sun will set in the West. That's the model. $80 a night for a family of 5. It is targeted at the tree of the low hanging fruit.

And the DR is far from a high-end location. There are so many other higher-end options, sadly. So many lost so many millions in Cap Cana and other locations of failed "higher-end" projects. Those pain points are still felt today and the developments are still limping along with many unfinished villas that have not been completed for 15 years.

Figure out how to turn something into say The Albany Club in The Bahamas you might be on to something.
 

Fulano2

Bronze
Jun 5, 2011
3,706
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Europe
Perhaps not but there are many places in the DR that cater to higher end $$$ tourists. Some of the Villas are too expensive for the average tourist to afford and same for some of the more exclusive hotels.
Just building a nice building with nice rooms won’t make a place attractive for the “high end tourist”. If they really have money they have probably big houses, modern or classic with large and many rooms, a pool and a nice library. And some real nice wheels.
Raising prices makes even less sense.
You could put a Rolls price tag on a Toyota but that doesn’t mean rich customers will buy a Toyota.
I read this article regarding tourism.
I had has to do with emotion, staff, surrounding, not just luxury.

 

johne

Silver
Jun 28, 2003
7,755
3,402
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At the moment a tourist legally becomes a squatter on day 31 when coming in on a tourist card. What will tomorrow bring?
Probably the thought that they won't want to come back again? Especially to Sousa? Hope that guidance helps you. I wouldn't worry about it windy.
 

Ecoman1949

Born to Ride.
Oct 17, 2015
3,531
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I don’t think it is the way to go for the dr to make it expensive to get a snowbird visa or more difficult to get residency. and especially right now. There is no point in trying to compete for American and Canadian tourists with the St Barths, Cayman and Aruba type islands who already have the advantage of being English speaking and safer and now add they manage the corona health crisis better.
If the Canadian government did allow the Turks and Caicos amalgamation with Canada, a lot of Canadians would be DR done. The ease of going back and forth with no immigration restrictions, currency at par, ease of real estate purchases, and free access to a decent medical system would be a significant draw. Many Canadians prefer Mexico for vacations and real estate purchases. The six month up visa every time you enter the country is the reason. Cartagena is also popular. Again for the six month visa. It’s time for the DR government to shit or get off the pot and make a positive decision on tourist visas. The pandemic has increased the urgency of the matter.
 

Ecoman1949

Born to Ride.
Oct 17, 2015
3,531
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Somewhere between the 6 months and a year and then he/she really “should consider” legalizing or get the f..... out.
The thing is the six month visa dovetails nicely with the North American Winter/Summer season. Many Canadian and American snowbirds usually leave November/December and return April/May. I don’t think there is a stigma attached to annual six month visa for snowbirds. The bonus here is the visa is an incentive and many purchase real estate Or do long term rentals. They become long term contributors to the local economies.
 

Fulano2

Bronze
Jun 5, 2011
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Europe
If the Canadian government did allow the Turks and Caicos amalgamation with Canada, a lot of Canadians would be DR done. The ease of going back and forth with no immigration restrictions, currency at par, ease of real estate purchases, and free access to a decent medical system would be a significant draw. Many Canadians prefer Mexico for vacations and real estate purchases. The six month up visa every time you enter the country is the reason. Cartagena is also popular. Again for the six month visa. It’s time for the DR government to shit or get off the pot and make a positive decision on tourist visas. The pandemic has increased the urgency of the matter.
Same for many Europeans... Why RD when you have so many Spanish and Greek islands with the same currency, same cell phone tariff so you can spend hours a day doing business, better climate and better food and wine and beer.
And of course not that bloody 10-13 hour flight.
 
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windeguy

Platinum
Jul 10, 2004
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I assume you are a low class tourist that does not fall within the 5 % figure (that you drew from a hat.) Is that correct? Have you ever stayed in boutique hotels? Ever meet university grads? Have you eaten in real "5 "star restaurants or shopped in luxe malls? Ever stayed at the weekend places that los Ricos stay at? rRch or wannabe rich tourist also stay there amigo. I used to think the way you think years ago. Then I saw another way. A way that you will NEVER see because every post you make is negative. Negative. And more negative. You are so hung up on who "drives the bus" that you will never see the real DR.
And you generally end your posts with a line of unsubstantiated BS opinion. Who are YOU to say the DR "will remain unchanged"? Tell me who do you think is listening to you or respects you?
I can back up everything I have stated here but quite honestly I don't feel I should give you the time. I don't like you and I'm sorry to say that. Have a wonderful evening wherever you are.
Sure , places like Amanera exist. Marriott is having issues building a Ritz Carlton Reserve which is at a similar level. Those cater to very wealthy people. The 1%ers. They have very few rooms at these places. The DR government makes the same amount per head as the few thousand that might stay at such places throughout the year. They are not even on the radar when it comes to revenue.

We also have several thousand snowbirds who stay at various locations on the north coast, Punta Cana, and maybe even but I hope not for their sakes in Santo Domingo or Santiago.

We also have dozens upon baker's dozens of whoremongers.

AI resorts were getting around 10 MILLION guests per year before the Covidic Epoch started, each paying those in and out fees. Who do you think drives the bus? Who do you think is the focus regarding tourism? Hint : 10 million AI tourists beats 10 thousand exclusive resort, 20 thousand if that Snowbirds, or dozens of whoremongers every day of the week when it comes to government planning. This is a point some people fail notice.
 
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windeguy

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Probably the thought that they won't want to come back again? Especially to Sousa? Hope that guidance helps you. I wouldn't worry about it windy.
I have some concern about what has been defined as squatters that I know. They live here year round only leaving for a week or two in a year. They have been here illegally for years. Foolish for them to do that no matter what changes today (or tomorrow). Is that OK with you?

There are quite of few snowbirds as well that might be affected in the Sosua and Cabarete area as you point out. People who own winter homes in Casa Linda. People who rent houses/apartments or stay longer than a month in hotels and Airbnbs. We rented our apartments to many of them over the years ourselves. I am quite familiar with that group. If I needed that rent money, I might be worried about them as well, if that was OK with you.....
 
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johne

Silver
Jun 28, 2003
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Sure , places like Amanera exist. Marriott is having issues building a Ritz Carlton Reserve which is at a similar level. Those cater to very wealthy people. The 1%ers. They have very few rooms at these places. The DR government makes the same amount per head as the few thousand that might stay at such places throughout the year. They are not even on the radar when it comes to revenue.

We also have several thousand snowbirds who stay at various locations on the north coast, Punta Cana, and maybe even but I hope not for their sakes in Santo Domingo or Santiago.

We also have dozens upon baker's dozens of whoremongers.

AI resorts were getting around 10 MILLION guests per year before the Covidic Epoch started, each paying those in and out fees. Who do you think drives the bus? Who do you think is the focus regarding tourism? Hint : 10 million AI tourists beats 10 thousand exclusive resort, 20 thousand if that Snowbirds, or dozens of whoremongers every day of the week when it comes to government planning. This is a point some people fail notice.
Yawn. I'm sorry I was up late last night. Talk to you next week Windy. BTW don't worry (" I hope for their sakes") those people who snowbird in and around SD aren't doing too bad. LOL. I might say, a lot better than Cab, POP, Sousa the north coast with the breeze from the Atlanta Ocean. See you later have a blessed day. Don't worry maybe things will get better.
 
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