dominican middle class

[billyidol]

in my country of origin we have a new generation of millionaires, gone are the fancy suits and porsche cars only to be replaced by ordinary everyday clothing. This generation of millionaires has realised that to become rich one must try to keep their expenses the same as they were when they were on lousy money and save the extra money as their income increases. Thats been my experience , i still wear the same stuff i did when i was in my twenties (with no cash) and as my income increased i socked it away and into property instead of frittering it away

I myself am unsure what middle class means anymore. It used to mean that people could live a basic life, with a small amount of luxuries/ frivoloties thrown in.

Now most people I know, even people who are earning more than say 60K a year , which would put them in at least upper middle class bracket pretty much live paycheck to paycheck and many are spending more than they make, have credit card debt, etc etc

These days, the guy at the bar with the high priced suit is probably way in debt, in a **** job, whereas the guy walking around in shorts just might be an Internet millionaire. (at least in the States)

in the DR, (and Latin America) it's always "dress to impress" (whom I don't know)

 

[billyidol]

costs

my budget is this and its $1000 per month for one person
electricity (private) = 160
food (1person) 200
home insurance 45
personal insurance 20
fun/drinks/pizza 400
phone 20
pool costs 40
misc costs 120

roughly a grand a month US

Depends where you live. Most people would say no. Do a search, lots of threads on cost of living.

Larry

 

[Hillbilly]

NAL:Once again, your post #4 of 29/12/05 was very well written and much more precise than my rather flippant rejoinder of "just about anybody with a steady job." However, we can take both answers and add a few things:

Those that have bank accounts, credit cards, telephones in their homes, cable, electric bills, water bills and such. Those are the things (and not necessarily all of them at once, of course,) that separate the haves from the not-haves.

I won't go into the social middle class, since we have been over this a thousand times before--(Remember AZB & our friend in Piantini's thread?? On "chopos" and "chopismo"??????)

HB

 

[NALs]

Nal, I wonder how Dominicans manage to buy those high priced apts. they seem to be building everywhere. They go for over US$100.000 and higher. I know what they earn goes farther in DR than in the US, but still, with the interest rate on home loans being so high it is almost prohibitive, I don't know how the upper middle class gets the money to pay for them. I guess it is the rich who are buying those. So, with the money they make, where does the upper middle class live, what type of homes can they afford to buy if their average high income is $17,808 a year? Not to mention those earning only $7,752.

Also, are these figures for individuals or for families?

1. Please keep in mind that prices for the same property varies, depending on the language being advertised!

A property advertised on the internet in english will be priced higher than if it was advertised locally in Spanish. Think for whom they are advertising.

In a predominantly spanish speaking country, anything advertised in any other language is obviously not meant for local people.

2. Many people here have multiple income streams, even among the rich. Those figures are based on a per person basis from a typical job that person may be able to take, but since many people have more than one income stream (could be a side business plus their day job, etc), actual incomes can be higher among upper middle class. Household incomes are higher since many couples have work, as oppose to one spouse working and the other staying home.

Even among the upper classes, many women work, though usually this is just a woman putting her skills to use (since many have degrees) and they usually own their own shop or boutique store or some form of business. However, many of them don't need to work.

3. Eventhough people often refer to the drug trade as a source of great wealth, in reality the drug money is not as pervasive as most people think. It has been estimated that less than 1% of the population is actually involved in the drug trade as distributors (ie. receive the shipment from Colombia and then resell to foreign dealers and/or local dealers). This means that a very tiny minority of those in the drug trade are making huge income, but most people in this country are not receiving much, most often nothing from this illicit and highly illegal scheme.

This country around 3% of drugs destined to US and Europe pass through, not enough for much accumulation of income, except for a very tiny minority of delicuents.

4. Also, keep in mind that the Dominican real estate industry is kept alive not just by the local middle class, but also by expatriate Dominicans who buy properties for their own selves, personal investment strategies, or for their local family members. Additionally, the population of expatriates is on an upward trend, in addition to tourists searching for a peace of paradise on their vacations. Also, many of the elites from other Latin American countries also purchase and sell and rent and invest in Dominican real estate. It's quite common to run into a Venezuelan or Puertorican or Cuban businessman who owns a multi-million dollar property somewhere in this country.

In short, there is more to the industry than meets the eye with the up coming sticker shock many Americans will receive once they realize that they can't afford their much desired retirement. Suddenly, living on a Caribbean isle less than a 1,000 nautical miles from their homeland, with easy connections, an established and growing communities of expatriates, and enough amenities to keep most people happy would not sound like a bad idea after all. Add to that a maid, chofer, more house for the money, tropical weather year round, beautiful and diverse scenery, and society that is becoming more and more commercialized and relatively wealthier and suddenly, this good deal sounds even better.

-NAL

 

[NALs]

Then you have the millionaires who succeeded in the "import export business" (copyright Quirino), the music and sports scene or whatever, but didn't complete secondary schooling. Economically they are upper class, but educationally/culturally they don't even qualify as 'middle'.

Every society has these anomalies, though.

Those are the new riches, and now you see why the old money don't like the attitudes or new wealth of the new riches.

Money without an appropriate educational background does not bodes well for traditional upper class.

Thus, many of them are simply denied membership to traditional old money locations, such as the Santo Domingo Country Club.

But, the new riches have simply created their own clubs to go to, so I guess everything is even now.

Let's not mention the expatriate. Although many are not affluent to be considered rich, expatriates are wealthier than many Dominicans and a class on their own, with their own places to mingle and chat. Thus, when we are talking about the moneyed people in this country, there are the:

Old money elite (La gente de primera, these live the epitomy of hispanic lifestyle. Socialization with acquaintances, membership to prestigious social and sports clubs, vacationing in luxurious locales, living in THE best neighborhoods, etc. Many have bloodlines to historic and honorable people who secured Dominican independence and/or who were prominent leaders in the colonial period of this country, these are blue bloods and acenstry is very important to them. They usually great you with an expectation that you will be impressed by their last name and the connotation their last name has regarding the existence of this country. Often they feel paternalistic towards the country and masses, due to this reality of their blood lineage.)

New money elite (La gente de segunda, looked down by the old money elites, because these are people with large pockets but nothing in the brain and/or no class of anysort. Of course, there are exceptions, but...)

Upper middle class (often looked down upon by the elites, since they see the upper middle class as wannabes)

Lower middle class (often looked down by the upper middle class, since the lower middle class are often such because of family from abroad sending monthly checks)

The poor (these people are out of the money rivalries. None of the other economic groups want anything to do with the poor and the poor want nothing to do with them.)

And the expatriates (these people are not always welcomed by the old money elites, especially those who are associated with prostitutes or with having no class. They have their own clubs, congregate among themselves, often are as removed from the culture as the poor are from the moneyed classes and they pretty much don't care what the Dominicans think of them, except for a select few who actually make the effort to befriend real Dominicans and understand the country they live in).

Oh, and let's not forget the expatriate Dominican or Dominicanyork. (Often looked down by the old money elite as well as by the new riches. The upper middle class are not particularly happy with expatriate Dominicans elevating the incomes of low class Dominicans by simply sending checks. This puts social competition. The lower middle class exist because of them and these people are highly grateful to the expatriate Dominicans and the poor only dream of becoming expatriates someday since they have seen what being an expatriate and/or having an expatriate family member does to personal economics).

Perhaps we can include Haitians as a class of their own. These people live pretty much like they used to live in Haiti, but a notch wealthier. They are looked down upon by just about everybody, for being predominantly poor, French speaking, the historical wars and invasions, and for cheapening the wages in certain sectors of the economy. These people usually have their own neighborhoods, stores, clubs, etc. It's important to note that rich Haitians are NOT looked down upon, instead rich Haitians are often welcomed by the wealthier Dominicans.

-NAL

 

[Chirimoya]

I've heard it said about class systems in general that each class despises the one directly above or below it most. The ones above feel threatened by the 'wannabes' as they see it, and the ones below feel jealousy and resentment towards the ones right above them.

I question the linking of 'old' money with honour. Isn't it a question of simply when your family made its fortune, rather than how?

 

[NALs]

I've heard it said about class systems in general that each class despises the one directly above or below it most. The ones above feel threatened by the 'wannabes' as they see it, and the ones below feel jealousy and resentment towards the ones right above them.

I question the linking of 'old' money with honour. Isn't it a question of simply when your family made its fortune, rather than how?

When your family makes its fortune will often lead to how it was done.

For example, old money are tied to the land, they always have been.

Notice those gigantic fields or plantations in the countryside?

Much of it is either owned by the government or the old money elites. Many have diversified their income streams to include other industry, but the land is still essential to their original wealth.

Much of the gigantic parcels that are still owned by old money elites was originally created by the colonial powers, when the country was divided among the Peninsulares or Spaniards born in Spain.

After the Haitian invasion, all Church and elite lands were confiscated by the Haitian state.

The heroes of the republic established the country once again and with time, the large landholdings were recreated, being splitted between the founding fathers and close related people to the successful anti-Haitian revolution.

With the case of new money, the money is often made not from land and large scale export agriculture, but from tourism, manufacturing, etc. These ventures were only possible in the 20th century, since before this time there hardly was an economy to speak of. With the growth of the middle class, these economic activities have become viable with time.

When a fortune was made is as important as how it was made, because how it was made proves that the fortune was made in such timeperiod, since different wealth from different source have been created in different times, with the further back in time the more agricultural based the fortunes were.

-NAL

 

[NALs]

Nal,

What about the other factors that determines class, like:
Education (higher learning)
Lifestyle (pop culture, etc.)
Values (upper/bourgeois)

In the US, a Bus Driver (blue collar) may have a salary of $65,000 a year and he will not be considered in the same class as a Paralegal (white collar) who makes the same amount. I know a lot of well-paid city workers who live the lifestyle of lower class people, the only difference is that they have a newer car or more clothes. Economically they are middle class on paper, but when it comes to the other aspects, they are considered lower class. A Professional would spend his $65,000 totally different than a non-Professional would.

On this thread we are regarding class in the economic sense, since this is what is usually representative in national statistics.

Social classes are a different matter, not kept in statistics.

-NAL

 

[LoveMyDRHusband]

"becasue $7,000 American dollars buys more in DR than it does in US" NAL

So true I bought one of the nicest houses on the block in my husband's town for $6,500US for the same in the US I wouldnt even be able to buy a run down single wide trailer that has seen its day in Florida.