- Thread starter carlosbra
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Middle Class in DR
It was more a matter of self produced data at the time, as people were asked their place of origin (to be understood for those with a formal or some type of education as place of birth). However for those that lacked formal or much education the question's answer was to be where they arrived from last...
You are assuming she had a birth certificate but as she by all accounts did not show up in the Catholic Church's official records in SD she could have been illegitimate as previously noted and therefore would have had no birth certificate.
Furthermore, I am assuming her husband Peter told the city coroner where she was born upon her death and he should have known the difference from Saint Domingue and Santo Domingo because his father was born in the former if not he himself.
Who knows Chip! But the lack of any trace of her name in any record during colonial and post colonial times is suspect, to say the least!
Like I said, it's plausible to be as you put it, but the lack of any trace of her in any records in Santo Domingo makes the odds of her being from Saint Domingue even the more so plausible as well...
I hope she was upper or middle class at least... You know... to keep it relative to the thread...
Not really Pichardo because her husband's father was born in Saint Domingue and would have known the difference. Sofia also does not show up in the birth records of that period in Charleston.
Everything points to Santo Domingo - her father in law's frequent travel there due to the fact that it was a French possession at the time of her birth, her Spanish last name, the death records from Charleston, SC and finally the fact that I like arroz y habichuela con fritos so much.
My wife's cousin's husband works IT at New Horizons in Santo Domingo - $30000 pesos per month. Virgina makes 15,000 as a public relations assistant. Her sister makes 27,000 as a first year Doctor, her brother makes 12,000 at Wendy's.
Below is an earlier answer to another poster just about in the same line as yours...
Yeah, one hand (mouth really) says poverty is down 1.6% and the next week they announce that 60000 more families (Sixty thousand more families) are going on Solidarity Cards (of course they are trying for 60,000 more votes: "If you don't vote for PLD, Papa will take away your free food card!" )
Dirty? Of course!...And remember there are over 500000 families on that program!! And they breed!
HB
Dirty? Of course!...And remember there are over 500000 families on that program!! And they breed!
HB
It's not surprising considering the actual figures for households (families can and do share the same house in poor communities) in poverty level is about 237,500. The you add the ones living in the Low Income bracket or some 1,125,000 households (again with a less higher ratio living a shared home).
When you consider that the Solidarity Cards are meant to focus the subsidies now placed to the entire spectrum (as in Electricity, cooking gas and all other foods under price controls) to the real individuals and families it aimed to assist allowing the gov to remove the subsidies as they are and only using the assigned cards to dispense the welfare assistance, it's logical the number of families added to the program will continue to rise!
The DR is using the welfare method of assistance employed in the U.S. (which shouldn't surprise nobody at all here given how linked we're to the U.S. system in many respects) to create a social security net that allows families in need to seek assistance when they qualify from the Gov and OUR pockets (the ones paying for it via our taxes).
That in turn allows the gov to dismount all subsidies to the sectors and also to target the families that need help in assisting them in various educational/training/job programs to better their situation long term.
The DR's Social Security system is in the baby steps of becoming what it represents in other developed nations with a rather larger surplus of initial funds, that surpassed all expectations and estimates by a long shot.
If you take the figures above and the existing figure for families in the program, they haven't included a good portion as of yet of those that qualify for the programs...
The Solidarity Card (TS) is a tool that validates the host (a) as a beneficiary (a) of the Social Protection Network. It is issued by the Dominican government to poor families who are identified by the Census System of Beneficiaries (SIUBEN).
This electronic debit card is not transferable. It allows its bearer consumption in the right places. The instrument is also capable of handling multiple subsidies at the same time, is conceived as an ideal medium for the transparent transfer of social benefits that the Dominican government decided to provide for the poor and needy of the country.
Among the Benefits it currently offers are subsidies "Comer es Primero (PCP), Attendance Incentive (ILAE) and Bonogas Home (BH) of the Solidarity Program (PS), the Food Supplement Program on Aging Protection in Extreme Poverty ( PROVIDED) belonging to the National Council of the Aging Person (CONAPE), the Higher Education Incentive (IES) of the Ministry of Education, Science and Technology (SEECyT)," all aimed at families that fall into the classification of poverty. We have channeled these subsidies in businesses located in the same user environment adhering to the Payment System of Social Subsidies (SPSS), which are visibly marked.
Furthermore, it is in effect, the Program for Drivers Bonogas (BC) of the Technical Bureau of Land Transport (OTTT), for car drivers to public transport.
Currently, the Solidarity Card as part of the Social Protection Network protects almost 800 000 families have been identified through the census carried out by System of Beneficiaries (SIUBEN) , whose subsidies are channeled by the Social Grants Administrator (ADESSE) , an agency of the Cabinet of Social Policy (GCPS), which is supported by the United Nations Program for Development (UNDP).
The benefits of the various programs of the Social Protection Network, are not widespread. Families to receive assistance have been identified in the location and type of need. The one which were counted in the census but not included, may apply to the SIUBEN and their state of need is then considered.
The goal and commitment to channel social grants, is to encourage citizens left behind by their poverty to be inserted as productive entities in society.
If you wonder what are the requirements to qualify for the card:
- Person of Dominican nationality.
- Of adult age.
- Possessing Electoral Identification Card non expired.
- Not be in the status register of the Central Electoral Board as deceased(JCE).
- Belonging to a household identified as eligible, to be in moderate to extreme poverty to receive subsidies from SIUBEN.
- Recognized as head of the household (women only) by the members of the same home.
- Be registered as beneficiary (women only) in the subsidy program.
Now to see this in an even more practical way, you can go here and see where, to whom, how much, which programs, what amount, etc... Per province, municipality, etc... These programs are being meted out to people in need:
Mapa de Subsidios - ADESS
Or here for detailed report by Province:
Reportes Estad?sticos - ADESS
This is how the "all inclusive" subsidies will come to an end in the DR, replaced by a true assistance program that helps those that DO need the extra income or freebies.
It was supposed to have been done last year and the gov (like always politics) need and means to be back in power pushed it back to be fully done with, AFTER the elections cycle... No surprisingly for me...
Not my fault that you flunked elemental mathematics in school or fail to be able to "RAZONAR" as a human would, under normal circumstances...
Chip you live in a world all your own in the DR, where you consider yourself as upper class compared to the other 10 million Dominicans all around you. Where you consider that people like you (upper class and expats) are the ones supporting those local biz all around you. Where you consider that we can't afford to have meat other than once in a blue moon, never mind that we call the Dominican diet "La Bandera" a.k.a. Carne, arroz y habichuelas... Where you deem that the majority of households in Santiago live under poverty or extreme poverty, the barrios pobres outrank the low middle class and up ones, the income is what the gov reports from tax revenues collection and therefore families live from RD$8,000 to RD$12,000 a month...
You live in a world all your own accordingly to what you post here from "experience" in the DR...
Next time you pay for anything other than what you get billed by the phone, cable tv, internet, electricity and Gas, ask the person to give you a receipt with the tax comprobante (NCF) printed on it... The ask yourself how much did you buy/spend that got a tax report and how much not... Then you'll be welcomed to the "other" DR and Santiago you've never met before and will now understand how much do people spend in the DR to have that lifestyle, which in many aspects are above yours in over 80% of the Households that surround you in your own neighborhood (all Dominicans)...
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Not my fault that you flunked elemental mathematics in school or fail to be able to "RAZONAR" as a human would, under normal circumstances...
Chip you live in a world all your own in the DR, where you consider yourself as upper class compared to the other 10 million Dominicans all around you. Where you consider that people like you (upper class and expats) are the ones supporting those local biz all around you. Where you consider that we can't afford to have meat other than once in a blue moon, never mind that we call the Dominican diet "La Bandera" a.k.a. Carne, arroz y habichuelas... Where you deem that the majority of households in Santiago live under poverty or extreme poverty, the barrios pobres outrank the low middle class and up ones, the income is what the gov reports from tax revenues collection and therefore families live from RD$8,000 to RD$12,000 a month...
You live in a world all your own accordingly to what you post here from "experience" in the DR...
Next time you pay for anything other than what you get billed by the phone, cable tv, internet, electricity and Gas, ask the person to give you a receipt with the tax comprobante (NCF) printed on it... The ask yourself how much did you buy/spend for that got a tax report and how much not... Then you'll be welcomed to the "other" DR and Santiago you never met before and will now understand how much do people spend in the DR to have that lifestyle, which in many aspects are above yours in over 80% of the Households that surround you in your own neighborhood (all Dominicans)...
Pichardo, with all due respect unlike you apparently I took graduate level statistics in college and your numbers would never make sense to anyone who has studied such. Furthermore, I'm sure the people at Mercadeo in PUCMM would have a big laugh at what you are proposing. Now who is being the silly one?
As far as me being "upper class", you've already stated that I was lower class so which one is it?
While I recognize there are plenty of wealthy people here in the DR it is obvious the poor outnumber them and I really fail to see what is the problem with recognizing this. Oh yeah, tell Leonel I said hey.
Now that I've got Leonel's ear - instead of paying people to promote the DR on public forums why don't you clean up government spending, ie get rid of all of the botellas, cut the number of functionaries and their wages and pay the police and medical professionals a decent wage and I assure you there won't be enough room on this island for the number of gringos that would move here and invest. 
I wonder what these requirements have to do with a person being poor? So only potential voters can get it? do you get one if you're not Peledeista?
I friend of mine here with a marketing degree says there can be no gaps in the wages earned in any valid study and wonder if whoever proposed this is really from Mars.
Tell him to switch careers... He has the drive to become somebody with a diploma from College, but not the tools to allow him to do so in that field...
Tell him also that far from paid infiltrator, my credentials are posted here for all to see and there are very, very, very few people with my name and title in the DR, let alone the city of Santiago...
Being accused as identified as a PLD member, would draw laughs from the local people that know me and my family roots...
It's that deep...
As far as gaps, there's none! It's still your lack of understanding to see it as it's clear as water since the first post...
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Nope, the Central Electoral Board (JCE) is the only one that issues voting or non-voting Cedulas in the DR. The Status Register is the master list of who's issued a Cedula and those that are no longer alive to claim use of it.
What entitles the person (head of household and only females) to claim for the assistance is the data collected from the economic census and gov ministries, which clearly identify areas by their income levels and such. That's to say that you won't find a person from Villa Olga on the card, no matter how the PLD tries to buy the votes with it...