native Spanish speaker calls DR "The Dominican"

[XanaduRanch]

One More Time ...

Now Tom, go back and actually read my posts this time. If you try not to focus on personal slurs for just a minute or two, you will even have a chance to understand them.

We are all very pleased with your Latin. It is no doubt superior to most. You get another gold star. But that is not the topic here. You can focus on Latin again just as soon as you come across an ancient Roman with whom to speak.

The rest of us can't help but notice that indo-european languages have evolved and continue to evolve.

Hate to be a party pooper and keep bringing this up, but since you can't seem to actually answer the question:

"... please read the last few posts regarding why the "Dominican" is especially problematic in English and respond to that subject if that is possible for you ..."

Tom aka XR My wife and I went back to the hotel where we spent our wedding night. Only this time, I stayed in the bathroom and cried.

 

[Porfio_Rubirosa]

"... please read the last few posts regarding why the "Dominican" is especially problematic in English and respond to that subject if that is possible for you ..."

Good God man, don't yell. It's bad enough you pontificate, insult, attempt to intimidate, and otherwise violate every rule of etiquette, but do you have to yell across the internet also? It doesn't make your point (or lack thereof) any clearer!

As is inevitable when debating with XR, we have now reached the point where he cries about nobody reading (or caring to read) his posts.

 

[Jane J.]

I wonder if you're the type of man who, if asked "How are you?" answers "Good! Yourself?" If so, please remove yourself from this debate tout de suite.

Here's the answer to your question, XR: The fact that everyone is doing it IS the justification. As an admitted language enthusiast and speaker of multiple languages, you already know that if a word's use is widespread it makes it correct. What you said about preciseness being lost in a murky stew really doesn't apply here, as no word is being eradicated from anyone's vocabulary, merely shortened, as a term of endearment. And if you really feel so strongly about the evolution of language, would you be having us speak as we did in the time of King Henry VIII or caveperson days or what?

The fact that you don't like to hear people to say "The Dominican" is your option, but no reason to harass or belittle others. How many million Dominicans live in NYC? Could you venture a guess as to from whence the entire folly of "The Dominican" sprung?

 

[Porfio_Rubirosa]

* I will not get dragged into the fray *

:bunny: Welcome to the fray.

 

[Jane J.]

Damn!

 

[VirginiaGomes]

I think that yes, they should be corrected. However, on this board, it seems that people take certain things way too serious and it seems that most bothered people by using the word here are not even DOMINICANS!

If a person from another country wants to call its OWN country whatever he/she wants, who am I to 'set them straight?' It is THEIR country!

I never use the word Dominican in that sense, however, I do hear a lot of other Dominicans call it Dominicana. Doesnt bother me none - only when the person is Dominican. I do tend to correct English speaking people who call it Dominican - and I also correct the people who dont even know of it at all.

Thanks Tall. That is my point. :nervous:

 

[VirginiaGomes]

Latine loqueris? Caeca invidia est. Fac ut vivas.

Die dulce fruere.

Latin crazyness? It is not jealousy, not impressing! :tired: :bored:

 

[VirginiaGomes]

I wonder why not "Domingueros?" Barum pum tss. But seriously, folks...

Domingueros is another word refering to Sunday. Like "Esta es mi camisa dominguera" (This in the shirt that I use on Sundays).

 

[VirginiaGomes]

I am still waiting for something other than these juvenile, off topic, replies.

Tom aka XR Character is the willingness to accept responsibility.

Will you understand a mature response??? aranoid:

 

[VirginiaGomes]

The fact that you don't like to hear people to say "The Dominican" is your option, but no reason to harass or belittle others.

What is his problem? Geez!


By the way, where did XR got those Latin words from? Bet you from the movie "The Exorcist" or something. Anyways, nobody care about your latin or your other six languages. If you can't say it in Spanish or English in the Dominican Republic forum, then just DON'T say it.

 

[Porfio_Rubirosa]

To add to one my earlier posts in regard to the DR possibly being the only country with an adjective followed by a political structure (no, nothing XR identified, of course - it has nothing to do with knowing the Latin word for "numbskull"), the "Czech Republic" and the "Malagasy Republic" have been in similar positions to the Dominican Republic linquistically. My understanding is that Europeans get around the Czech problem by referring to it as "Czechia" - roughly akin to calling the DR "Dominica", "Dominicania" or "Dominicana" (the latter of which I personally like).

The Malagasies got around the problem altogether by changing the name of their country to Madagascar. In other words, they changed from a country named after an ethnic group to a country named after an island.

I have seen references on the web about travels "to Malagasy" - which is akin to saying "to Dominican".

Also, people from the maritime provinces of eastern Canada are often referred to as "Maritimers". When you travel there, you say that you are travelling to "the Maritimes" - all despite the fact that "maritime" is clearly an adjective used to describe the oceanic nature of the place.

 

[XanaduRanch]

Will you understand a mature response?

Reading your posts it doesn't look like we're in danger of ever finding out.

Tom aka XR I was trying to daydream but my mind kept wandering.

 

[Chris]

Common Usage

As some of us know, common usage defines a language - Anybody remember the ad from a company called Electrolux for vacuum cleaners? If you are from the right age group, you'll remember how we howled with laughter when they brought out a new ad saying "nothing sucks like Electrolux!". At that time, in our age group, anything that was 'not cool', was referred to as "it sucks!" The company soon changed the ad. But the words "it sucks!" and the word "cool" lives on today... Have we made the language poorer with this obviously grossly incorrect usage? No, infinitely richer I think.

More common usage - amongst sailors it is quite common to refer to 'sailing the Atlantic", or sailing "the Caribbean", instead of 'sailing the Atlantic Ocean" or the "Caribbean Sea" - quite similar to saying "The Dominican", instead of "The Dominican Republic". Does referring to going to "The Dominican" make us poorer, or define us as fools and blockheads? I don't think so. This is obviously common usage amongst a specific group of people and 'correcting' those people, defines the one who corrects, more than the one who uses this short form of language.

As English speakers predominantly, we've learnt to talk about the Dominican Republic. That is why any other usage sounds funny on the ears. Because of our own learning, not because others are stupid. To keep correcting this form of language, to me is simply putting oneself in a high and mighty, know-it-all position and this sucks!.

 

[XanaduRanch]

Yes, all the educated folks we like to 'hang out' with enjoy coloring their speech with phrases like 'it sucks'. Sometimes they even add 'dude!' at the end, yo! Groovy! Peace and Love! Common usage is just that - common.

Just because something is spoken does not make it proper or acceptable. Your vocabulary and how you use it defines yourself to those around you. If you want people to think you're an ignorant, uneducated, backwoods, hick by incorporating such slang into your speech, go for it. You'll be in the proud company of master linguists like El Guapo de Gurabo!

Just please stop whining when others around you point and giggle.

Tom aka XR Support your right to bare arms. Wear short sleeves!

 

[Tordok]

I wonder why not "Domingueros?" Barum pum tss. But seriously, folks...

Tordok, wouldn't the answer obviously be c)?

PS I'm not from the Dominican.

Domingueros would refer to things related to the day Sunday, although I guess just as well it could've become the "gentilicio" for people of Santo Domingo. It turns out that Dominicanos gained preference early and caught on. The logical answer indeed would appear to be c) but there is no well established historical documentation that proves it. As I am sure you all have noticed almost everyone in the DR refers to people from the city of SD as capitale?os and not San Domingueros or anything else, which gramatically might make more sense. Like many on the forum have stated, people drive language and not the other way around.

With regards to the actual debate of this thread, it doesn't really bother me that many use a misnomer to refer to the country. XR seems to be correct in his misgivings about the use of "The Dominican" but it may be too late to change this since many in the U.S. media, especially baseball writers, have taken a liking to this gramatically wrong form. People who travel to the Dominican Republic take a flight down there and enjoy the country. I guess that people who travel to "the Dominican" apparently have discovered a new nanotechnology by which they reach the inner organs of its inhabitants, as in a colonoscopy, and enjoy what you find in such procedures.

-Tordok

 

[Chris]

Common usage is just that - common.

Yes sure it is. And perhaps inadvertently, you've just illustrated the point of 'common usage' -- defined as "ordinary" or "everyday". Just like "The Dominican" is used by many people in an ordinary, everyday way - "common" usage.

But commonly, in ordinary, everyday usage of the language, we use the word "common" to denote low-class or inferior - quite removed from the word's original meaning. So, am I mistaken or did you just use "common" language in the quoted sentence? I'm sure I'm mistaken -- surely you did not use language in this improper manner!

 

[XanaduRanch]

What's most fascinating to me is that in this discussion over the use and acceptability of a slang term the posters political philosophies come tumbling out into plain view for everyone to see.

It is beyond dispute that referring to this country as "The Dominican" is viewed, or perhaps heard, by many here as ignorant. The promoters of this silly term proudly proclaim their right to use it. But then they are chagrined when others view their choice of words as prima facie evidence of their lack of attention in grade school level English classes. No one who has consciously chosen to refer to this country in English as "The Dominican" has any basis to complain when anyone else thinks that they are rather dimwitted for doing so.

So the discussion isn't about whether it's a proper term or not. It's really about accepting the consequences of one's own actions - or words. Speak that way, and people will pass judgement on you whether you like it or not. That's life.

Tom aka XR You're not a complete idiot. Some parts are missing.

 

[Chirimoya]

XR, I don't see that the debate is divided along political lines at all. You and I have very different political viewpoints on many things yet we agree on the basic premise that calling the DR 'the Dominican' sounds ignorant and is grammatically nonsensical.

I used to live in the United.

Kingdom, that is, not the States.

What is true is that some terms that initially get rejected or ridiculed do end up becoming part of the language through persistent usage. I can't think of any examples of the top of my head, but they do exist. Those of us who resist them have the choice to do so, but end up in an purist minority.

Chiri

 

[Forbeca]

What is true is that some terms that initially get rejected or ridiculed do end up becoming part of the language through persistent usage.

Chiri, that's what we're afraid of. I'm really so surprised at some educated posters who are willing to look the other way on this one.

 

[XanaduRanch]

XR, I don't see that the debate is divided along political lines at all. You and I have very different political viewpoints on many things yet we agree on the basic premise that calling the DR 'the Dominican' sounds ignorant and is grammatically nonsensical.

But, Chiri, while we may disagree at times I do admire your sense of ethics and responsibility.

I started my career in radio in 1974, and by 1975 was performing not only on radio but also on the national television networks in the United States. That's 30 years ago, and my voice is to this very day heard on over 600 radio stations in this hemisphere every hour of every day. I think that qualifies me to speak to the subject at hand.

I can honestly say that had I made a conscious decision to pepper my vocabulary with slang terms such as this, I would never have had that career in the first place. I never would have been allowed on the air. And that would have been my fault. So anyone here who thinks saying "The Dominican" is cool, or hip, or trendy and is without consequences is just fooling him or herself.

Tom aka XR Just when I was getting used to yesterday, along came today.

P.S.
Some of the best examples of words getting into the common vernacular come from trademarked products that become too popular for their own good. Ever walk across the new linoleum to get a kleenex to blow your nose? Call all carbonated beverages a 'Coke'? Then there are those other linguistic train wrecks that arise from ignorant use of the language, such as "Flammable", "Inflammable", and "Noninflammable". Why are there three? As George Carlin used to say, "Either it 'flams' or it doesn't!" This just came about because of people who never learned English properly and never had it corrected. I see the same thing happening today with "affect" and "effect". Oh well.