Need advice from a roof expert

beeza

Silver
Nov 2, 2006
3,485
736
113
My house is about 25 years old. Traditional Dominican construction methods of cement block and rebar. It has a two tier Bermuda roof with a shallow incline.

It's leaking again. With all this rain I have a few spots of filtration. Since I've lived in this house, I've painted the roof four times. The last time I used the Lanco siliconiser which goes on blue and dries white. Each paint job has cost me well over $2k in paint alone, plus the manpower. Our proximity to the ocean and extreme heat takes its toll and I'm lucky if I get three or four years out of a paint job. Last time I went up on the roof to install my Starlink dish, I noticed huge areas of bare concrete. It's as if that 'Siliconiser" paint has just vaporised! (I did two coats)

I want advice on what would be the most cost effective way to make a more permanent solution to my roof. The roof is approx 25mX20m making it a 550m2 area with a rough calculation for the incline.

Do I paint it again? Is there new paint technology that is more resistant? Should I tile it? Should I put zinc or some other sort of protective lining? I want it white to keep the heat down.

I don't want to spend a fortune, but I want the best bang for my buck in terms of cost vs longevity.
 

malko

Campesino !! :)
Jan 12, 2013
5,666
1,447
113
Holy cow ! 2k worth of sillador de techo ?

I have a roof that is half tiled cuppola ( if you see what I mean ) and half flat roof with drains ( like yours ). I have zero problems with the tiled portions ( 4 different pyramidal structures ), but that's going to be an expensive fix.


A few years back I ripped out the original tarmac carpet thingy, and went with the same Lanco as you. It changed my life. Heat wise and leak wise.

Are you sure the area in question is bare concrete and not dirty Lanco sealer. I have a patch where the water stagnates and kind of looks bare. But on closer inspection it's dirt on top of the sealer.

Also, I was recommend at Ochoa ( where I bought the sealer ) to give it another coat every other year.
No worries it uses up waaay less sealer, about a quarter of what I originally use.

Just for info, I was given crazy quotes when I wanted to get it done. Can't remember exactly but one of the quotes was around 100k pesos.
I did it myself and it cost me 10 times less...... well lots of sweat and aches as well 😀


I had originally thought of a zinc roof atop of the flat portions of the roof...... But the zinc also needs painted with sealer.
 

USA DOC

Bronze
Feb 20, 2016
3,330
862
113
If you have filtration, and for years the real problem is the rebar...it gets rusty quickly and loses it strenght... just hope you are not in the house when a strong earthquake happens.........
 
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Manuel01

Well-known member
Apr 1, 2009
1,330
1,395
113
I had the same problem for 10 years. Never ending Story. Add a heavy wood Construction and make a roof with tiles. You also gain aditional storage and you solved this problem forever. And yes, it gonna cost you a fortune but with this continous leaking, the damage to your entire structure will be several times more expensive.
 

malko

Campesino !! :)
Jan 12, 2013
5,666
1,447
113
So of course I had to climb onto the roof after reading this thread 🤬.

The last coat of sealing was applied 4 years ago, we think.

Decided to give it another coat, and in some places 2 coats.

Went to Ochoa in Santiago, would recommend going to SD or Santiago.
Why ? I did some roof sealing in POP in December and the dates on the sealer ( date when it was made ), was months past.

Anyway, cost :
2 times 5 gallons of heavy duty sealer 8.5k x 2, so 19k. One can seal 35 square meters in 2 coats per 5 gallons.
2 gallons of primer around 2k pesos. ( Supposedly it's a primer + a micro crack sealer ).
1 extension metal rod ( I normally use a broom handle but decided to go crazy 🤣) 1.2k
2 rollers 400 pesos. 2 brushes 200 pesos.

19+2+1.2+0.4+0.2= 22.8k pesos.

Instead of heading to check out, go first to " facturacion", for some unknown reason they discount you 10 or 12 %.
20k pesos, give or take.


Man hours :

Day 1. Prepping. Cleaning. Sweeping. Washing down with soap and bleach. Sanding rough parts.
Maybe took me 4 hours.

Day 2. Priming. Maybe 3 hours.

Day 3. Applying the sealant. Maybe 4 hours.

Day 4. Second coat of sealer, where needed. 2 hours.

Hopefully good for another 4 years.
 

chico bill

Silver
May 6, 2016
13,882
7,775
113
So of course I had to climb onto the roof after reading this thread 🤬.

The last coat of sealing was applied 4 years ago, we think.

Decided to give it another coat, and in some places 2 coats.

Went to Ochoa in Santiago, would recommend going to SD or Santiago.
Why ? I did some roof sealing in POP in December and the dates on the sealer ( date when it was made ), was months past.

Anyway, cost :
2 times 5 gallons of heavy duty sealer 8.5k x 2, so 19k. One can seal 35 square meters in 2 coats per 5 gallons.
2 gallons of primer around 2k pesos. ( Supposedly it's a primer + a micro crack sealer ).
1 extension metal rod ( I normally use a broom handle but decided to go crazy 🤣) 1.2k
2 rollers 400 pesos. 2 brushes 200 pesos.

19+2+1.2+0.4+0.2= 22.8k pesos.

Instead of heading to check out, go first to " facturacion", for some unknown reason they discount you 10 or 12 %.
20k pesos, give or take.


Man hours :

Day 1. Prepping. Cleaning. Sweeping. Washing down with soap and bleach. Sanding rough parts.
Maybe took me 4 hours.

Day 2. Priming. Maybe 3 hours.

Day 3. Applying the sealant. Maybe 4 hours.

Day 4. Second coat of sealer, where needed. 2 hours.

Hopefully good for another 4 years.
Heat stroke and heart attack priceless 🥵
 
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XQT

Well-known member
Dec 7, 2022
469
425
63
Puerto Plata
So of course I had to climb onto the roof after reading this thread 🤬.

The last coat of sealing was applied 4 years ago, we think.

Decided to give it another coat, and in some places 2 coats.

Went to Ochoa in Santiago, would recommend going to SD or Santiago.
Why ? I did some roof sealing in POP in December and the dates on the sealer ( date when it was made ), was months past.

Anyway, cost :
2 times 5 gallons of heavy duty sealer 8.5k x 2, so 19k. One can seal 35 square meters in 2 coats per 5 gallons.
2 gallons of primer around 2k pesos. ( Supposedly it's a primer + a micro crack sealer ).
1 extension metal rod ( I normally use a broom handle but decided to go crazy 🤣) 1.2k
2 rollers 400 pesos. 2 brushes 200 pesos.

19+2+1.2+0.4+0.2= 22.8k pesos.

Instead of heading to check out, go first to " facturacion", for some unknown reason they discount you 10 or 12 %.
20k pesos, give or take.


Man hours :

Day 1. Prepping. Cleaning. Sweeping. Washing down with soap and bleach. Sanding rough parts.
Maybe took me 4 hours.

Day 2. Priming. Maybe 3 hours.

Day 3. Applying the sealant. Maybe 4 hours.

Day 4. Second coat of sealer, where needed. 2 hours.

Hopefully good for another 4 years.

Good post!

If you did the work, you got quality work.
I have a flat concrete roof with Lanco Siliconiser with good results.
Lanco Ultra is also very good.

Good idea to re-apply as you stated before filtration occurs.

If you find a diligent semi intelligent person, it may be worth to pay for the work.
But cleaning the roof, working with a roller and not missing spots and doing two coats in two days may be complicated for some.


 

Memo

Member
Jul 30, 2005
112
15
18
Las Galeras
www.elotrowa.com
Good post!

If you did the work, you got quality work.
I have a flat concrete roof with Lanco Siliconiser with good results.
Lanco Ultra is also very good.

Good idea to re-apply as you stated before filtration occurs.

If you find a diligent semi intelligent person, it may be worth to pay for the work.
But cleaning the roof, working with a roller and not missing spots and doing two coats in two days may be complicated for some.


 

PJT

Silver
Jan 8, 2002
3,719
452
83
This poster has a Burmuda roof. When it was constructed, it was terminated with a thin layer of white cement. The white cement fills the pores of the gray cement construction to ward off water filtration. Shortly after, a layer of Italian membrane was applied and painted with aluminized silver paint. The aluminum particles in the paint seal the pores in the membrane. The roof has been painted every 4-5 years to maintain the water seal. It has been 25 years without a leak. Also, a benefit, the silver paint reflects the sun's rays, keeping the house a few degrees cooler.

Regards,

PJT
 
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Pikobello

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2020
303
279
63
Santo Domingo
That's the key, don't wait too long to repaint your roof. Also important when you build new and the roof is flat, use a industrial bomb and cement who comes with the trucks, when they cast the roof and it get hard, then use a so called helicoptero, a polishing machine for polish the roof to close all pores.
After that you can use paint or membrane. I use this one all the time:

 

Memo

Member
Jul 30, 2005
112
15
18
Las Galeras
www.elotrowa.com
Well, it ain't easy--and nothing is permanent, but you can fix this problem.

Prepare to work hard, in the sun. Or in the alternative you can locate, pay well, and supervise closely a couple of diligent workers. It's a seriously daunting and depressing job to tackle solo, although it's possible to do so.

First, disconnect your cistern. You don't want all of the crud and debris that you are going to generate to flow into your water system.

1. The problem recurs because water has found it's way under some (many) apparently sound areas previously coated with one or another of the latest whiz-bang elastomeric, siliconized, rubberized, fluid-applied membranes. Applying a "fresh" coat is both easy and temporary. Pretty easy, and very temporary.

This water, trapped in between and underneath the layers of your roof coating wants out. And water WILL have it's way, either steaming it's way to the surface and violating the integrity of the latest whiz-bang coating in the process, or rotting the concrete and rusting the re-bar on its way to the inside of your home. The only way to treat this is by removing ALL of the unsound coating. Heed my words, or at least recall them a couple of years from now it you yield to the temptation to take short-cuts in the preparation work

2. Buy yourself a couple of 4" wall scrapers with replaceable blades. In fact get three. That way when one breaks you and your lovely assistant can continue scraping, scraping, scraping as you peel away layers and layers of failed coatings. Wear gloves to protect your knuckles. Avoid using a grinder or a power wire brush--that will only polish the cement and make adhesion of new materials problematic.

3. Chip away and scrape failed concrete to a relatively sound substrate. If doing so exposes rusted reinforcing rod, clean and prepare that metal. There are a couple of products, now more or less readily available in the Dominican that will chemically alter the rust, magically consolidating it into solid protective coating that you can then paint. I've no idea how this works, but it does.

So: clean the exposed metal, apply miracle conversion product and then prime. Once the primer paint is dry thoroughly wash any cavity or depression in the roof surface created by your work to remove all crumbly concrete and dust. Apply diluted concrete bonding agent with a small paintbrush as directed and while the bonding agent is still wet place a 1:1 sand and cement mortar fortified with additional bonding agent.

Cover any of those patched with a damp rag to retard evaporation and allow the chemical process of cement curing to proceed. (Full cure requires 28 days, by the way, and no cement should be painted or coated before fully cured. I'm just sayin'.)

4. Reapply your serious sunscreen and fight over who gets to wear the big floppy hat, wear the knee pads, and use the kneeling pad.

5. Scrape, scrape and scrape from all different angles.

6. Be amazed at the amount of mold and algae hidden within and under layers of roofing membrane. Good riddance.

7. Sweep well and then scrub the roof with detergent--and don't skimp on the bleach.

8. Finally, pressure-wash the entire roof. Scrape the newly loosened edges of the remaining existing coating. Wash with bleach and water a second time and then rinse well.

You now have 2 or 3 grueling days or more invested in this project. This level of detail in preparation is important to a successful job. Without it you are just pushing your problem down the temporal road, so to speak.

Avoid heatstroke (Seriously). Work early in the morning and again in the evening. Stop when you're tired. Tomorrow is another day, and this is not a speed competition. Be smart, be diligent. Do I need to mention the importance of staying hydrated?


Materials:

In my lifetime I have applied hundreds and hundreds and hundreds, probably many thousands of gallons of fluid-applied membranes. The gold standard is a product manufactured by Minnesota Mining and Manufacturing, 3M. It is a roof and deck coating for designed to waterproof roofs and planters in commercial buildings and the decks of parking garages. You can't buy it, because 3M only wants people who understand the importance of proper preparation to use their product. There are other solvent-based competitive products that are pretty OK in my experience, but probably aren't readily available here. If you want to go that route, find someone who is roofing and waterproofing a high-rise in Sto. Dom. and ask them where they get their material.

I am fortunate to have 5 "flat" concrete roofs here in the RD. None of them have a fluid-applied membrane coating now, nor will they in future.

Believe me when I say "been there; done that--and ain't gonna go there no more." Because there's a better way. And because you did all of this onerous labor in preparing your roof you're interested in the better way, right? But before I get there, let me offer a final suggestion to those who are determined to go the siliconized, rubberized, whiz-bang elastomeric coating route anyway: begin by applying a dilute coat over the whole surface, what we used to call a "wash coat." Then attend to detailing the cracks and any patches you've made with a brush and full-strength material, or material maybe slightly thinned with water. Work the material across the cracks and then in line with the cracks, but avoid over-working the material. Feather the edges and try and minimize bubbles by lightly "tipping" the material with your brush. It's just what it sounds like.

You're not doing this in the direct sun or in the heat of the day are you? Stop that.

When dry, I'd apply a full coat using a brush, taking care to minimize the occurrence of bubbles in the coating. And THEN a second full coat, perhaps using a roller but in any event "laying off" the coating in the direction that water will flow on your roof. Easy Peasy.

A different approach:

The Thoro company manufactures a cementacious product called Thoroseal, and the Ferreteria Americana carried the product for about 20 minutes fifteen years ago. I've looked high and low and never seen it since then, but if you find it let me know.

Since then I have found 2, maybe 3 suitable alternatives. These products are all purchased in powder form and most are mixed with a special bonding agent using a paddle mixer and a half-inch drill motor. The resulting slurry is applied with a mason's brush, first detailing the cracks and patches as outlined above, followed when dry by a full coat tipped off in the direction of water flow, as above. And then a second coat.

After a couple of years you might want to wash the roof and detain any cracks that may have materialized in the intervening years--it's just a matter of respecting and protecting all of the work you did in the first place.

The Sika corporation makes lots of pretty terrific products, including a cementicious waterproofing and bonding agent as described above. This stuff is readily available in the large newly remodeled ferreteria in Las Terrenas, among other places.

PlanaSeal 88 is another good cementicious coating, mixed with a special bonding agent and water. Available at the Ferreteria Unidos in the Capital.

Finally, Laticrete makes a "Hydro Ban Cementitious Coating" that is a powder that you mix only with water. It's available through the ceramic store on the Av. 27 de Febraro, located neat the Volvo dealer (but on the other side of the highway.) Bring the big check book. I've used this product under tiles in the walk-in showers and also to coat the inside of new cisterns. (Actually, I stopped a streaming leak in a concrete cistern 15 years ago, using hydraulic cement and then Thoroseal , applied to the OUTSIDE of a nearly full cistern. Still holding.

Anyway, for what it's worth: there you have it.

Take your time, you'll be glad that you did later on this year when the rains come and you're recuperated and are ready to tackle repair of the interior water damage, now that it's dry inside.

Best of luck.
 

Memo

Member
Jul 30, 2005
112
15
18
Las Galeras
www.elotrowa.com
Well, it ain't easy--and nothing is permanent, but you can fix this problem.

Prepare to work hard, in the sun. Or in the alternative you can locate, pay well, and supervise closely a couple of diligent workers. It's a seriously daunting and depressing job to tackle solo, although it's possible to do so.

First, disconnect your cistern. You don't want all of the crud and debris that you are going to generate to flow into your water system.

1. The problem recurs because water has found it's way under some (many) apparently sound areas previously coated with one or another of the latest whiz-bang elastomeric, siliconized, rubberized, fluid-applied membranes. Applying a "fresh" coat is both easy and temporary. Pretty easy, and very temporary.

This water, trapped in between and underneath the layers of your roof coating wants out. And water WILL have it's way, either steaming it's way to the surface and violating the integrity of the latest whiz-bang coating in the process, or rotting the concrete and rusting the re-bar on its way to the inside of your home. The only way to treat this is by removing ALL of the unsound coating. Heed my words, or at least recall them a couple of years from now it you yield to the temptation to take short-cuts in the preparation work

2. Buy yourself a couple of 4" wall scrapers with replaceable blades. In fact get three. That way when one breaks you and your lovely assistant can continue scraping, scraping, scraping as you peel away layers and layers of failed coatings. Wear gloves to protect your knuckles. Avoid using a grinder or a power wire brush--that will only polish the cement and make adhesion of new materials problematic.

3. Chip away and scrape failed concrete to a relatively sound substrate. If doing so exposes rusted reinforcing rod, clean and prepare that metal. There are a couple of products, now more or less readily available in the Dominican that will chemically alter the rust, magically consolidating it into solid protective coating that you can then paint. I've no idea how this works, but it does.

So: clean the exposed metal, apply miracle conversion product and then prime. Once the primer paint is dry thoroughly wash any cavity or depression in the roof surface created by your work to remove all crumbly concrete and dust. Apply diluted concrete bonding agent with a small paintbrush as directed and while the bonding agent is still wet place a 1:1 sand and cement mortar fortified with additional bonding agent.

Cover any of those patched with a damp rag to retard evaporation and allow the chemical process of cement curing to proceed. (Full cure requires 28 days, by the way, and no cement should be painted or coated before fully cured. I'm just sayin'.)

4. Reapply your serious sunscreen and fight over who gets to wear the big floppy hat, wear the knee pads, and use the kneeling pad.

5. Scrape, scrape and scrape from all different angles.

6. Be amazed at the amount of mold and algae hidden within and under layers of roofing membrane. Good riddance.

7. Sweep well and then scrub the roof with detergent--and don't skimp on the bleach.

8. Finally, pressure-wash the entire roof. Scrape the newly loosened edges of the remaining existing coating. Wash with bleach and water a second time and then rinse well.

You now have 2 or 3 grueling days or more invested in this project. This level of detail in preparation is important to a successful job. Without it you are just pushing your problem down the temporal road, so to speak.

Avoid heatstroke (Seriously). Work early in the morning and again in the evening. Stop when you're tired. Tomorrow is another day, and this is not a speed competition. Be smart, be diligent. Do I need to mention the importance of staying hydrated?


Materials:

In my lifetime I have applied hundreds and hundreds and hundreds, probably many thousands of gallons of fluid-applied membranes. The gold standard is a product manufactured by Minnesota Mining and Manufacturing, 3M. It is a roof and deck coating for designed to waterproof roofs and planters in commercial buildings and the decks of parking garages. You can't buy it, because 3M only wants people who understand the importance of proper preparation to use their product. There are other solvent-based competitive products that are pretty OK in my experience, but probably aren't readily available here. If you want to go that route, find someone who is roofing and waterproofing a high-rise in Sto. Dom. and ask them where they get their material.

I am fortunate to have 5 "flat" concrete roofs here in the RD. None of them have a fluid-applied membrane coating now, nor will they in future.

Believe me when I say "been there; done that--and ain't gonna go there no more." Because there's a better way. And because you did all of this onerous labor in preparing your roof you're interested in the better way, right? But before I get there, let me offer a final suggestion to those who are determined to go the siliconized, rubberized, whiz-bang elastomeric coating route anyway: begin by applying a dilute coat over the whole surface, what we used to call a "wash coat." Then attend to detailing the cracks and any patches you've made with a brush and full-strength material, or material maybe slightly thinned with water. Work the material across the cracks and then in line with the cracks, but avoid over-working the material. Feather the edges and try and minimize bubbles by lightly "tipping" the material with your brush. It's just what it sounds like.

You're not doing this in the direct sun or in the heat of the day are you? Stop that.

When dry, I'd apply a full coat using a brush, taking care to minimize the occurrence of bubbles in the coating. And THEN a second full coat, perhaps using a roller but in any event "laying off" the coating in the direction that water will flow on your roof. Easy Peasy.

A different approach:

The Thoro company manufactures a cementacious product called Thoroseal, and the Ferreteria Americana carried the product for about 20 minutes fifteen years ago. I've looked high and low and never seen it since then, but if you find it let me know.

Since then I have found 2, maybe 3 suitable alternatives. These products are all purchased in powder form and most are mixed with a special bonding agent using a paddle mixer and a half-inch drill motor. The resulting slurry is applied with a mason's brush, first detailing the cracks and patches as outlined above, followed when dry by a full coat tipped off in the direction of water flow, as above. And then a second coat.

After a couple of years you might want to wash the roof and detain any cracks that may have materialized in the intervening years--it's just a matter of respecting and protecting all of the work you did in the first place.

The Sika corporation makes lots of pretty terrific products, including a cementicious waterproofing and bonding agent as described above. This stuff is readily available in the large newly remodeled ferreteria in Las Terrenas, among other places.

PlanaSeal 88 is another good cementicious coating, mixed with a special bonding agent and water. Available at the Ferreteria Unidos in the Capital.

Finally, Laticrete makes a "Hydro Ban Cementitious Coating" that is a powder that you mix only with water. It's available through the ceramic store on the Av. 27 de Febraro, located neat the Volvo dealer (but on the other side of the highway.) Bring the big check book. I've used this product under tiles in the walk-in showers and also to coat the inside of new cisterns. (Actually, I stopped a streaming leak in a concrete cistern 15 years ago, using hydraulic cement and then Thoroseal , applied to the OUTSIDE of a nearly full cistern. Still holding.

Anyway, for what it's worth: there you have it.

Take your time, you'll be glad that you did later on this year when the rains come and you're recuperated and are ready to tackle repair of the interior water damage, now that it's dry inside.

Best of luck.
 

Drperson

Well-known member
Sep 19, 2008
1,114
319
83
So of course I had to climb onto the roof after reading this thread 🤬.

The last coat of sealing was applied 4 years ago, we think.

Decided to give it another coat, and in some places 2 coats.

Went to Ochoa in Santiago, would recommend going to SD or Santiago.
Why ? I did some roof sealing in POP in December and the dates on the sealer ( date when it was made ), was months past.

Anyway, cost :
2 times 5 gallons of heavy duty sealer 8.5k x 2, so 19k. One can seal 35 square meters in 2 coats per 5 gallons.
2 gallons of primer around 2k pesos. ( Supposedly it's a primer + a micro crack sealer ).
1 extension metal rod ( I normally use a broom handle but decided to go crazy 🤣) 1.2k
2 rollers 400 pesos. 2 brushes 200 pesos.

19+2+1.2+0.4+0.2= 22.8k pesos.

Instead of heading to check out, go first to " facturacion", for some unknown reason they discount you 10 or 12 %.
20k pesos, give or take.


Man hours :

Day 1. Prepping. Cleaning. Sweeping. Washing down with soap and bleach. Sanding rough parts.
Maybe took me 4 hours.

Day 2. Priming. Maybe 3 hours.

Day 3. Applying the sealant. Maybe 4 hours.

Day 4. Second coat of sealer, where needed. 2 hours.

Hopefully good for another 4 years.
You are a good worker