New Political Party

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Chip00

Guest
... Everything here is based on the ?you scratch my back and I?ll scratch yours? concept and it is because of this that you will never get away from the corruption that dominates this country.

Oh well I guess I need to start working more on my golf game...

Rick - I hear you and suppose your right. However, at the very least I will probably get involved with some party. I honestly feel that at some point things will have to change. I think just looking at the current situation with the crime rate, unemployment and such is a good predictor. Also, pay attention to what is happening in a lot of countries with the increase in socialist type of governments. Look at Mexico and what almost happened there. Nonetheless, it may be a fruitless endeavor but then again you know how the saying goes.. nothing ventured, nothing gained. At the very least I hope it will be less frustrating doing something as opposed to sitting at home and thinking of doing something and lamenting the situation until I morph into a state of apathy like so many of the locals.
 

Rick Snyder

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Nov 19, 2003
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Thank you for the little ?pick-me-up? Chip with your words of ?I hope it will be less frustrating doing something as opposed to sitting at home and thinking of doing something and lamenting the situation until I morph into a state of apathy like so many of the locals.?

It is because of that failure of wanting to hit that ?morph? state that I continue, from time to time, to try to convince those with the power to bring change to teach the complete Spanish alphabet and to learn how to recite same to all Dominican children before they enter the first grade. A lot of us have an idea as to something that may or would help the DR and it is our ability, or lack thereof, to understand that which we are up against that will determine how much ?frustration? we go through in our quest to reach our desires.

Thanks to Rocky my life is so much easier now and I never approach the ?frustration? state while living here now. If there is, and there always will be, a time of failure to understand I just think, ?they?re only children in adult bodies? and I understand and accept.

Rick
 

Rocky

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Apr 4, 2002
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Chip, like Rocky stated earlier your intensions are good and I too applaud you for possessing same but due to the proverbial ?been there, done that, got a t-shirt? in reference to a foreigner with plans to change the inevitable?.. Well??..

In my time here on this island I?ve tried to study the history of this country with no emphasis on any particular time frame or ruler and have come to conclusions on a number of points.

The history has had a tendency to instill the present culture and due to the pressure that culture plays on a society has the affect of determining where that society does and will go. The only way to bring about change is by changing the culture of the people. As it is their culture passed on to the next generation by them it is only logical that any changes in the culture will have to be applied by them.

If it were my desire I could list a large number of examples whereas their culture has had a tendency to retain their ability to obtain a better life and help society as a whole. Rather than go through a long dissertation of those examples I will only list two that readily come to mind.

Sit down with any Dominican here and start a conversation about ?malos costumbres?. If you don?t receive, and you probably won?t, any examples of what they consider as bad customs then ask them if trash being thrown on the streets is a ?malo costrumbe?. You should, as I always do, receive a 100% agreement that this practice is in fact a ?malo costrumbre?. Once agreement has been reached as to it in fact being a malo costrumbre then ask the simple question as to why they do it. The responses that I always receive to this question are always the same when they tell me, ??Porque es el costumbre aqu?!?.

The second example is when I see something being accomplished here that requires a lot more work then something that I or other foreigners have been taught and a suggestion is made as to how the same or possibly better results can be obtained by doing it a little differently with a lot less work. The typical response that I receive to my suggestion is, ??ste es c?mo lo he hecho toda mi vida y mi padre lo hizo esta manera al igual que su padre?. With mind-sets such as this it makes changes in culture very difficult.

I have made posts a number of times about Dominicans that ventured away from the island in search of an education and experience with the intension of returning to their home land and helping their mankind. There have been many Dominicans that have in fact done this and Leonel is the latest example of a foreign educated Dominican having returned to his homeland and tried to bring change to the country and has succeeded in a number of areas but there is only so much that one person can do when not backed by like minded individuals.

History has shown that the DR has always been controlled by those with money which equates to power. The ?Real y Supremo Consejo de las Indias? back in the 1500?s was basically the beginning of this control which lead through the years to different groups, organizations and countries being the controlling factor until 1838 when a twenty-year-old Dominican, of a prominent Santo Domingo family, who had returned home five years earlier after seven years of study in Europe started a significant organized movement against Haitian domination. The young student's name was Juan Pablo Duarte. In the ensuing struggles for dominance the personality and attributes of Duarte ran counter to those of most of the country's ?caudillos?. It was these ?caudillos? that have controlled this country from 1844 till presently. It was the unprincipled, self-serving dominance that did much to entrench the tradition of caudillo rule in the Dominican Republic and Trujillo was nothing more then another segment of this ?caudillo? dominance when he took over in 1930.

The ?caudillos? still rule this country but they presently do so under the guise of ?democracy?. It is because of their hold of the reigns, to include that of the military and police, that positive change in all the important aspects of this country will not change. If the changes that have taken place increase their monetary holdings then they are allowed and if they don?t then the changes are just ignored by those with the control.

Any new or different political party will have to pay its dues to those that are in power and any failure to do so will mean a short life to that particular organization. Everything here is based on the ?you scratch my back and I?ll scratch yours? concept and it is because of this that you will never get away from the corruption that dominates this country. (MHO).

Rick
So very true.
"That's how we do it"
"That's how it's done"
"That's how we've always done it"
There's no winning against that type of mentality.
 

Texas Bill

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Feb 11, 2003
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All this talk about making a "change" in the Dominican system of governance and Politics make me think of European history and that geographical area's "progress" toward this thing we call "Democracy".
From mankinds beginings there have been many manifestations of "pseudo-democratic" development. That isto say, tribal "leaders" depending on local "councils" for guidance (primarily to control the tribe itself) in making decisions which would affect the whole. This system evolved into the "kingships" and "privy councils" of later times. Occasionally, a "king" would become an "absolute monarch" with enough power to intimidate all the "lesser" states and eventually control them as well. (Rome is a good example).
By and large, today's "Euroean Union" is an expanded version of this, as is the USA, in that a central authority supercedes (with their participation) the authority of the individual states. This is a pseudo-federalist system and by no means does it fit the definition of a "democracy", per se. That word is a misnomer, even when attempting to describe the self-stated system of the US. The US is a Republic and not a Democracy. Any government which allows election of "representatives" for the constituency is a "republic", plain and simple.
We speak of the "caudillo's" in the DR as if they are unique in modern day political phenomenon. They aren't by a long shot. It's just that here, as in all SA countries, they have been in power for so long that thir presense is imbedded in the pshche of every individual in every country, the US not withstanding.
The problem which has faced each society throughout time has been that of the inequality between the "haves" and the "have-nots". There have been many theories which have addressed these differences and none have yet reached a viable solution to the disparagement between these segments of society. We all "beat our heads against the brick wall" in even discussing such because we each have a different slant on what is most important and therefore which element must be solved first. Kinda like the "chicken and the egg" question we all like to quote from time to time.
We speak of what is "fair". Some philosophies would take from the rich to give to the poor, regardless of the unfairness placed on the rich and not truly defining what is poor and why that condition exists. This is all based on the human element of "jealousy" by one person toward another who has more of what he wants. We seem to forget that people the world over would rather have something "given to them" rather than earn it "by the sweat of their brow". When that simily is placed in action by political figures, it becomes thenorm and people ultimately begin depending on "the guvment" to provide for their every need and desire. Sound familiar? Look around you, look at England, look at the USA, look at France.
I've taken up too much bandwidth, so I'll stop.
Justthink about all this before you go off on a tengent.
I get pi$$ed off too about what I see around me here, but everytine I try to bring it up, I get that "good enough for my dad" bit also, so I've just stopped and am concentrating on my boys. Maybe I can change them, they're still young.

Texas Bill