- Thread starter CarpeDReam
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The Democratic Revolution
LOL, no, I can very well understand the reasoning for no apology for your statements.
Please excuse me if it seemed I was touchy or something of that nature but you being one of the better of the new posters on our board has not given some of us the opportunity to come to complete grips with your writing style and therefore my false assumption that by using my name in your post that it was addressed to me. Sorry about that bad assumption.
Rick
Please excuse me if it seemed I was touchy or something of that nature but you being one of the better of the new posters on our board has not given some of us the opportunity to come to complete grips with your writing style and therefore my false assumption that by using my name in your post that it was addressed to me. Sorry about that bad assumption.
Rick
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Thank you for your response Rick, I really appreciate it.
One of my downfalls, is that I'm very impatient.
Another one, is that I was born in Spain and, consequently my english is not as good as my intentions. LOL
At the time I posted a response, I thought that my comments could fit very well (as an added comment or follow-up to Professor Diamonds report) since it was talking about DR and the economic/cultural consequences of his study.
I'm new to this, but I'm willing to learn the rules and live by them, Rick, again, I apologize profussely for whatever missinterpretation my comments may have caused.
I'm too old and too impressed by the value of this site, to start creating negative interrelations or the perception of it.
Sorry one more time and thanks
One of my downfalls, is that I'm very impatient.
Another one, is that I was born in Spain and, consequently my english is not as good as my intentions. LOL
At the time I posted a response, I thought that my comments could fit very well (as an added comment or follow-up to Professor Diamonds report) since it was talking about DR and the economic/cultural consequences of his study.
I'm new to this, but I'm willing to learn the rules and live by them, Rick, again, I apologize profussely for whatever missinterpretation my comments may have caused.
I'm too old and too impressed by the value of this site, to start creating negative interrelations or the perception of it.
Sorry one more time and thanks
Rafael, your written English is better than that of most native speakers, I wouldn't worry about it at all!
The analysis is not by Diamond himself, but by a Dominican commentator who, as I understand it, attended a talk by Diamond and applies Diamond's thesis to the case of the Dominican Republic.
Jared Diamond did use the island of Hispaniola as a case study in "Collapse", comparing Haiti, a failed state, with the relatively successful DR.
The analysis is not by Diamond himself, but by a Dominican commentator who, as I understand it, attended a talk by Diamond and applies Diamond's thesis to the case of the Dominican Republic.
Jared Diamond did use the island of Hispaniola as a case study in "Collapse", comparing Haiti, a failed state, with the relatively successful DR.
As someone who is writing a PhD on environmental protection in the DR, I can tell you that Diamond got it completely wrong. Firstly he spent 2 and half weeks in the DR for research, spent with the ?loony fringe of the DR?s environmentalists
- an interesting statistic from research of a colleague. Forests in the DR are expanding nationally, but shrinking inside the national parks
- since 1995, the DR has had the fastest growth of national parks in the world. It currently stands at 26% of surface area, but gross human rights abuses such as evictions without compensation have been committed because of a desire to increase national parks without bothering to do proper studies and planning
- Although Balaguer had some environmental wishes, the creation of national parks had other interests at stake as well
- The strict tree protection has been shown to increase deforestation, as it removes incentives for campesinos to care for trees, so they destroy them just so the government has less incentive to meddle in their affairs
- By far the biggest difference in the DR and Haitian environments is that the DR has no market for charcoal because of the subsidy for gas. I think this is the sole reason why forests have expanded in the DR in the last 10 years. National parks do nothing to protect the DR?s environments.
Diamond decided what his argument was, then made the data fit it. His other works are good, but this book is appalling.
I would go on, but I have a thesis to write.
I could go on, but I have
- an interesting statistic from research of a colleague. Forests in the DR are expanding nationally, but shrinking inside the national parks
- since 1995, the DR has had the fastest growth of national parks in the world. It currently stands at 26% of surface area, but gross human rights abuses such as evictions without compensation have been committed because of a desire to increase national parks without bothering to do proper studies and planning
- Although Balaguer had some environmental wishes, the creation of national parks had other interests at stake as well
- The strict tree protection has been shown to increase deforestation, as it removes incentives for campesinos to care for trees, so they destroy them just so the government has less incentive to meddle in their affairs
- By far the biggest difference in the DR and Haitian environments is that the DR has no market for charcoal because of the subsidy for gas. I think this is the sole reason why forests have expanded in the DR in the last 10 years. National parks do nothing to protect the DR?s environments.
Diamond decided what his argument was, then made the data fit it. His other works are good, but this book is appalling.
I would go on, but I have a thesis to write.
I could go on, but I have
1) The fact of the matter is that the LF?s government has abuse more the public funds in none-productive goods than any previous government: Trips (vacations) yipetas, cellulars phones, cloths, ect....
2) Where are the 178 millions from virizon going to, at least 1/2 is going to SD Metro and some kickback.
3) What is DEPRECO going to do about the 50 plus millions stolen from the Dept. Of Finance?s pension plan; or with all those goverment officials refusing to file their financial statement as required by law (78-82)?
Corruption is killing democracy in Dom. Rep. and all those traditional political parties and politicians should be deleted from the political arena, o
2) Where are the 178 millions from virizon going to, at least 1/2 is going to SD Metro and some kickback.
3) What is DEPRECO going to do about the 50 plus millions stolen from the Dept. Of Finance?s pension plan; or with all those goverment officials refusing to file their financial statement as required by law (78-82)?
Corruption is killing democracy in Dom. Rep. and all those traditional political parties and politicians should be deleted from the political arena, o
Those words are EXACTLY what Hitler and Mussolini advocated!!
Also you might study a bit of HISTORY before you start spouting off about such things, then temper your commentary to the modernity of other political philosophies.
Stalin's Russia started out with a continuation of the periodic Polgroms against the "Haves' and it all ended up with everyone except "Party Members" being the "HAVE-NOTS".
Is that what you want???
Just suppose YOU are the one being "sacrificed"....do you really want that???
How long do you think it would take for the"new" jefes to gain absolute power over the populace then begin to "sacrifice" those who didn't agree with them???
Texas Bill
He wants a Dominican "Chaves". That must mean that instead of massive crude oil reserves he can use aa world leverage and to fund his Workers Padadise ("socialism or death) as "Chaves" does, he'd use plantains...
LF is still paying homage ( rindiendole pleitesia) to the conservative elite class, that are clasists and racists. As long as " Columbus Day" is still celebrated, DR still will be tied up in chains by this " conservative elite".
Biggest change that needs to be made is changing the name of the country into Republic of Quisqueya !
That would be the beginning of a " de-euroethnocentrification" process. following the abolition of Columbus Day, a man that went to the island and took advantage of the weakness of the natives to exploit them and later on, Africans brought over to get exploited mercilessly too ( Columbus was a slave trader for Portugal before working from Spain).
Columbus, Nicolas de Ovando, all these people represent the mentality of the conservative elites. People like the late Joaquin Balaguer.
Who chose to name streests after Nicolas de Ovando? the colored and poor masses? or the conservative racist elites??
The case in point, people like LF, that came from the " concon", need to be independent from the grasp of these " conservative elite racist azquerosos ". in order to accomplish something of meaning.
"Democratic Revolution" sounds pretty, but it is nothing if he continues to " rindiendole pleitesia" to the conservative elites, that have always resorted to authoritariamism and depotism, because that way, the people will yield to their exploitation and keeping them within " the concon".
Biggest change that needs to be made is changing the name of the country into Republic of Quisqueya !
That would be the beginning of a " de-euroethnocentrification" process. following the abolition of Columbus Day, a man that went to the island and took advantage of the weakness of the natives to exploit them and later on, Africans brought over to get exploited mercilessly too ( Columbus was a slave trader for Portugal before working from Spain).
Columbus, Nicolas de Ovando, all these people represent the mentality of the conservative elites. People like the late Joaquin Balaguer.
Who chose to name streests after Nicolas de Ovando? the colored and poor masses? or the conservative racist elites??
The case in point, people like LF, that came from the " concon", need to be independent from the grasp of these " conservative elite racist azquerosos ". in order to accomplish something of meaning.
"Democratic Revolution" sounds pretty, but it is nothing if he continues to " rindiendole pleitesia" to the conservative elites, that have always resorted to authoritariamism and depotism, because that way, the people will yield to their exploitation and keeping them within " the concon".
Cobraboy:
These two guys arae not thinking about the underlying method of HOW they will finance their "dream" of "Revolution".
They fail to realize that Chavez(Venezuela), Brazil, Et Al, ALL have tremendous resources with whic to finance such a dream. The DR has NOTHING in the way of NATURAL RESOURCES with which to accomplish such a political philosophy asSOCIALISM. All the current "SUBSIDIES", ie., Propane, Electricity, rice, sugarcane, etc. are the principal causes of the tremendous indebtedness currently being enjoyed by thegovernment. That doesn't take away from thefact that the Administration(s), past and present, have increased the overall indebtedness by NOT practicing AUSTERIY in Government spending.
The solution lies NOT in the Government and economic MODELS, but rather in the implementaation of those factors.
There is no need to change the MODEL, as they advocate, but change the TYPE OF PEOPLE who are in charge. By changing the model and using the same type of employment of people, you wouldn't get a BETTER Government, but more of the same and unless you instigate a DICTATORSHIP, and that would be the worst case scenario possible.
I re-iterate, they aren't thinking the whole thing through. They've read the works of Marx and Ingel, listened to the rhetoric of Castro, Chavez and others ofthe Socialist ilk and have not applied truelogic to the Socialist Scenario. Such a system will NEVER work for a destitute Society and they fail to realize that one important factor.
I just feel sorry for them and their dedication to a system doomed to failure because of a lack of resources.
Texas Bill
These two guys arae not thinking about the underlying method of HOW they will finance their "dream" of "Revolution".
They fail to realize that Chavez(Venezuela), Brazil, Et Al, ALL have tremendous resources with whic to finance such a dream. The DR has NOTHING in the way of NATURAL RESOURCES with which to accomplish such a political philosophy asSOCIALISM. All the current "SUBSIDIES", ie., Propane, Electricity, rice, sugarcane, etc. are the principal causes of the tremendous indebtedness currently being enjoyed by thegovernment. That doesn't take away from thefact that the Administration(s), past and present, have increased the overall indebtedness by NOT practicing AUSTERIY in Government spending.
The solution lies NOT in the Government and economic MODELS, but rather in the implementaation of those factors.
There is no need to change the MODEL, as they advocate, but change the TYPE OF PEOPLE who are in charge. By changing the model and using the same type of employment of people, you wouldn't get a BETTER Government, but more of the same and unless you instigate a DICTATORSHIP, and that would be the worst case scenario possible.
I re-iterate, they aren't thinking the whole thing through. They've read the works of Marx and Ingel, listened to the rhetoric of Castro, Chavez and others ofthe Socialist ilk and have not applied truelogic to the Socialist Scenario. Such a system will NEVER work for a destitute Society and they fail to realize that one important factor.
I just feel sorry for them and their dedication to a system doomed to failure because of a lack of resources.
Texas Bill
Bill, to socialists the implementation is not nearly as important as the intent.
Ever met a socialist that has a good grasp of economics?
No I haven't. Forthat reason, I am impelled to point out that for a nation to embrace Socialism, it MUST have the natural resources and the industrial base with which to support the ideology. Without those ingredients, the system is doomed to failure, the people suffer as a result through the insideous undermining of their natural ambitions and efforts to "better" their circumstances.
These guys are like the "poor" boy in the crowd who doesn't have the money to buy the "candy" he sees other, more fortunate boys, eating and can't understand why. As a result he becomes jealous and vindictive to the point of justifying his stealing of their candy.
They also don't realize that by taking the money from those who have it and "re-distributing" it that they are removing the life-blood of the economy in that that money "trickles down" to the lowest person on the totem pole, financially, in the form of jobs and infrastructure.
They have "skimmed over" the essentials of gaining an education, of broadening their horizons intellectually and saving for that "rainy day".
I'm convinced that these people are just jealous whiners who will twist words and efforts to fit their own selfish agendas.
I suppose because I had a rough early life (we were poor and the country was in the Great Depresson) and pulled myself up by my bootstraps to a better life that I thoroughly resent such a philosophy. I've seen what "handouts" for nothing done can do to people who are "sheep'. They become slavishly dependent on the ones "handing out" the largess and that destroys their integrity and their souls.
Life has NEVER had any guarantees but these guys are trying to sell an empty dream for their own selfish reasons.
I'll render unto Rome what is due to Rome, but nothing beyond that.
There are a lot of people in NYC who own their own Grocery Store, and they started out pushing a vegetable cart in all kinds of weather for a living. If they cn be successful in such a competative market, why can't others???
Just one example of puling oneself up by his "bootstraps" to success.
Socialism doesn't offer that chance. It's against individual incentives altogether and THAT is my main objection to such a system.
I realize I'm preaching to the"choir", Cobraboy, but others will read this (hopefully) and maybe, just maybe, they'll stop and THINK about my words.
Texas Bill
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Amen, Bill, Amen!
We know about the trade-off of more security and less Liberty. What about the trade-off of more security and the destruction of individual humanity?
Both are bad deals...unless you're in charge of the security.