This is INCREDIBLE...

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gmiller261

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Dec 29, 2002
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This is NO attack on Chirimoya

?this happens because of corruption and the culture of impunity, the early sexualisation of young girls and children, the fact that in the campo and in the barrios it is accepted that girls as young as this are 'taken' and initiated by older men... so for some individuals all young girls are seen as fair game.?

Well you have described, by far, my worse nightmare.

For any Dominican to be able to use any words, especially ?corruption and the culture of impunity? to rationalize this behavior is offensive.

I trust Chirimoya has the insight to make this statement so I ask President Leonel Fernandez to corroborate this warped Dominican mentality.
 
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Chirimoya

Well-known member
Dec 9, 2002
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gmiller261 said:
?this happens because of corruption and the culture of impunity, the early sexualisation of young girls and children, the fact that in the campo and in the barrios it is accepted that girls as young as this are 'taken' and initiated by older men... so for some individuals all young girls are seen as fair game.?

Well you have described, by far, my worse nightmare.

For any Dominican to be able to use any words, especially ?corruption and the culture of impunity? to rationalize this behavior is offensive.

I trust Chirimoya has the insight to make this statement so I ask President Leonel Fernandez to corroborate this warped Dominican mentality.
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:confused:gmiller - not sure I understand your post.

I hope no one is rationalising this in the sense of justifying. More like explaining the context in which things like this can and do happen. I agree that it is an offensive, nightmarish situation. Especially when you think of all the other cases that never come to light.

What are you asking LF to do, though?
 
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2LeftFeet

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Dec 1, 2006
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Is there some place where more information is available in English? I went to Lambada's website and it wasn't posted.

This is very upsetting if it happened. I have a lot of questions. So many things just don't make sense with this but I'm hoping it's because I've only read the overview.

I can't see how corruption can justify overlooking this atrocity? I don't understand how the town where this young girl lives in isn't in an uproar over this? People get beaten and killed for stealing a cell phone.

There is a huge difference between having sex with a 12 year old girl ( I am not condoning it. It's wrong. A grown man or woman should NEVER have sex with a any 12 year old. ) and gang raping one.

The police officials that have chosen to look the otherway have daughters and sisters. They are allowing these animals to stay on the street. They could attack their daughters, sisters, etc...

Why wouldn't this be investigated? There are women who are prosecutors/judges. Are these perpetrators important people???

Are they implying that she wanted to have sex with all of these men? Isn't there an age of consent? So, if she is under that age and a grown man has sex with her isn't it defaulted to rape automatically???

What kind of injuries did she sustain? She must've been really hurt.

How can everyone ignore that???? Wouldn't that imply a HUGE cover up on EVERYONE'S part? The police, the hospital, whom ever did the foresic pathology report?

I just don't understand.
 
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Rocky

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Apr 4, 2002
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2LeftFeet said:
I just don't understand.
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I don't think that any of us fully understand and there are some really strange parts to the story, like the mother being killed the day before.
I'm of your thinking.
Wouldn't the locals be in an uproar and looking to string these guys up by their toes?
It appears that something happened to both the mother and the daughter, but I suspect that the news reports are not 100% accurate.
 
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Chirimoya

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Dec 9, 2002
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2LeftFeet - A fuller account in English is posted in the news section of Lambada's website. Ginnie Bedggood - book author, writer, expat Dominican Republic - the sixth story down.

I agree that as it stands, the whole account begs a lot of questions and we can still only speculate. The point is the authorities need to respond to these questions - why was this handled so badly, why was it not really prosecuted, why was one of the accused allowed to escape and not pursued, why was another let off on absurd technicalities, are they being protected, what are they going to do now to help this girl and her sister, etc. This is where corruption comes in - the implication is that the accused were powerful enough to buy off the police and legal system to sweep it all under the carpet, in the hope that the girl and what family she does have will not be in the position to fight it. Maybe they are powerful enough to intimidate the community into silence?

Again, I am explaining how and why something like this might happen, not justifying it.

I also agree with 2LeftFeet's point about there being a huge difference between consensual sex and gang rape of a minor. Thing is, I was not referring to consensual sex but the still common practice of underage girls being 'taken' by older men and initiated. This may not include the horror and violence of a gang rape, but it is still not consensual, so the line is quite fine.
 
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Lambada

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Mar 4, 2004
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There are some marches being planned to push for the authorities to respond to the questions raised. On Monday 9 am at the Colegio Dominicano de Periodistas, SD for a march to the Supreme Court (wear something black), on Tuesday in Jimani and on Wednesday in front of the Congress building for a public reading of Mujer y Salud's manifesto about this case. Anyone who wants to show solidarity with this cause is invited to attend.
 
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wuarhat

I am a out of touch hippie.
Nov 13, 2006
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Amnesty International claims that letter writing (polite but firm and not condescending or accusing) by individuals from outside the country has a positive effect on the treatment of political prisoners even in dictatorships. It might be a good idea to let people who are influential in this case know that the eyes of the world are on them. Are there any names and addresses available of prosecutors, judges, and police chiefs who might be responsible for making sure that the perpetrators are brought to justice.
 
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Chirimoya

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Dec 9, 2002
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I would advise respecting Mujer y Salud's strategy which is to try and resolve things locally, and only if that fails to widen it out to international attention.

If it came to letter writing the targets would be Jorge Subero Isa (Chief Justice), Radhames Jimenez (Attorney General) and Rafael Guzman Fermin (Police Chief). I can keep people here posted on progress and give more details if an international campaign is launched.

We'd have to think about the logistics of a letter-writing campaign: I wonder what Amnesty has done in the past when targeting the DR - do they know there's no real functioning postal system?
 
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Chirimoya

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Dec 9, 2002
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Some photos from this morning:

I wasn't there but they sent me some photos.

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The girl's aunt and Sergia Galv?n of Mujer y Salud

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Some of the demonstrators.
 
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wuarhat

I am a out of touch hippie.
Nov 13, 2006
1,378
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Chirimoya said:
I would advise respecting Mujer y Salud's strategy which is to try and resolve things locally, and only if that fails to widen it out to international attention.

If it came to letter writing the targets would be Jorge Subero Isa (Chief Justice), Radhames Jimenez (Attorney General) and Rafael Guzman Fermin (Police Chief). I can keep people here posted on progress and give more details if an international campaign is launched.

We'd have to think about the logistics of a letter-writing campaign: I wonder what Amnesty has done in the past when targeting the DR - do they know there's no real functioning postal system?
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My guess is that no matter how backward the postal system the people they want you writing to have no problem getting their mail. I would expect the same to be true in this situation. I used to correspond with someone in the Gauley sector of Santo Domingo (which from the looks of the place is not high on the list of places to receive government services) and she received every letter within a week or so. Thanks for the updates. I'll be keeping an eye on this thread.
 
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fightfish

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Jan 11, 2008
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I suspect the girl who was violated isn?t in the letter-writing mode. And neither is her family. Campo justice is a great thing, lacking in the U.S. for quite some time. Have at it primos, enjoy!!!!
 
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wuarhat

I am a out of touch hippie.
Nov 13, 2006
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Campo justice? Yeah right. Since the FBI busted up the Klan in the 60s we?ve been missing that in the states. These guys are campo justice. The guy who confessed will have a problem with campo justice, though not from anyone attempting the serve the interest of the victim, but the guy they call "the mute" and the rest of them are not going to have any problems with campo justice.
 
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Chirimoya

Well-known member
Dec 9, 2002
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Just to say that Mujer y Salud have decided to call off tomorrow's demonstration for a number of reasons, and reading between the lines (see bolded section from my translation of their e-mail below) I think they are cautiously optimistic that their actions so far have brought about some progress. Let's hope so. :)

Dear friends,

We have decided to postpone tomorrow's planned activity until a later date for various reasons, including:

1. The location opposite the Congress building will be cordoned off and militarised and we won't be allowed through.
2. The media will be focused on the day's official activities.
3. A process is under way and we have to wait a little and see how things develop.

We will keep you informed on developments and if new actions are called we will let you know.

Please forward this message so that anyone who was planning to go may be informed about this cancellation in time.

Many thanks.
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marliejaneca

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Oct 7, 2003
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Chiri - would you be so kind to give us a quick overview (in English) of what this good news is??

Many thanks,

Marlie
 
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