Watch Your Money! D.R. Bank Fraud And/Or Incompetence

[chico bill]

I filled up my car at the fuel station in front of the Base in Cangrejo.
They double charged me same day, same time, same amount and I'm waiting on Citibank to close the case but the merchant isn't responding but it will be taken off my card.
That's the 2nd time (and last) I have used that gasoline station.

 

[Pikobello]

What is "BP"?

BP = Banco Popular

 

[Lucas61]

O.P. Update: (More to come): Today I spoke with a manager at (Farmarcia) Hildalgo, La Sirena, Duarte/Mella. I showed the my account information which I had taken photos of pursuant to: a. the date, b. the number of the transaction, c. the business, d. the amount debited from my account. She checked through her records for the date that RD$ 3,000 was withdrawn from my account. She could find zero evidence for that transaction. Then I spoke to the manager of Altice where I had charges against my account which Banreservas denied. She checked her records and could find no evidence for these transactions. I cannot explain these events. My speculation is that rogue employees of both companies have access to bank account numbers but that's only a guess.

Tomorrow I will be spending the day (?) at BanReservas and insist on speaking to someone in management. The best I can hope is to get my money back but I think this is highly doubtful. We shall see. Regardless, whether they "fix" the problem or not, my trust in this bank is zeroed out and I will never bank here again.

A couple of points in response to members: a. Re: how BHD and BanReservas are linked via ATM's, a member here has a detailed and sensible explanation, b. Based on your opinions, I am opting for BHD and NOT Scotia Bank, c. It was BanReservas that declined charges from Altice. Unfortunately, they did not decline the charge from Hildalgo and RD$ 3,000 was taken from my account, d. Someone said that he'd been banking at BanReservas for years and never had a problem. I' ve been banking at the same for years and never had a problem. These are all new events. Once money is stolen from my bank, that bank account is toast--I'm gone.

Update later after I go to BanReservas. Today I dealt with the merchants.

 

[malko]

I am a bit confused.

About the " Altice" issue. Did the on-line transactions go through ?

And the farmacia one, was it on-line or a physical payment ?


How do we go about protecting ourselves from fraudulent payments ?

Online payments:

Only use a bank that has 2FA. You enter your card details---- and save them on the site, that's up to you---- and press payment. You should have to validate that payment through your banking app.
If that's not the case, change bank ASAP, it's 2024, no excuse.

If for some reason you bank does not do 2FA, pay online using a virtual card. You create a card on your banking app that has a different number than your regular card. Even better if it's a single use virtual card.

Physical payments :

A PIN code is the standard. No PIN code, no payment.
To secure your card even more, freeze and un-freeze your card through your app as you go about your life. It's literally at the top of your fingers.

 

[CristoRey]

I filled up my car at the fuel station in front of the Base in Cangrejo.
They double charged me same day, same time, same amount and I'm waiting on Citibank to close the case but the merchant isn't responding but it will be taken off my card.
That's the 2nd time (and last) I have used that gasoline station.

Thanks for the heads up.

 

[Lucas61]

I am a bit confused.

About the " Altice" issue. Did the on-line transactions go through ?

And the farmacia one, was it on-line or a physical payment ?


How do we go about protecting ourselves from fraudulent payments ?

Online payments:

Only use a bank that has 2FA. You enter your card details---- and save them on the site, that's up to you---- and press payment. You should have to validate that payment through your banking app.
If that's not the case, change bank ASAP, it's 2024, no excuse.

If for some reason you bank does not do 2FA, pay online using a virtual card. You create a card on your banking app that has a different number than your regular card. Even better if it's a single use virtual card.

Physical payments :

A PIN code is the standard. No PIN code, no payment.
To secure your card even more, freeze and un-freeze your card through your app as you go about your life. It's literally at the top of your fingers.

Regarding the Altice transactions: They were not my transactions and BanReservas declined them. Nevertheless, they were attempts to withdraw money from my account that I never authorized. Ditto for la famarcia: I never made any transaction so the question of 2FA, etc. is irrelevant to this issue. An entity unknown to me and also unknown to the manager of Hildalgo made the transaction and sucessfully withdrew money from my account. None of the transactions that were made that I am calling "fraud" were made by me. That's why they are fraudulent. They were neither made nor authorized by me.

 

[Lucas61]

OP Update #2:

Today I went to BanReservas to apprise them of the fraud, specifically, the money withdrawn from my account that was not my transaction. To my surprise, to file a claim ("reclamen") I ended up on a phone giving much detailed information and receiving a claim number.

I can expect to receive a result within 89 business days via an "affirmed" or "denied" SMS text. That's more than four months with the implication that I'll learn nothing about the reason for the fraud. Barring the small chance that I'll get my money back, this process is a waste of time and will not solve my problem.

To explain why, let me make an analogy to U.S. banking. About 15 years ago, on my Wells Fargo account, $500.00 was withdrawn four times by an unknown entity. I filed a fraud claim and my account was credited $2,000.00 Unfortunately, a few months later I was in Shanghai, China when I found out that my account had a zero balance and was overdrawn. I learned that my claim was denied and that $2,000.00 credit was withdrawn from my account. That gave me serious travel problems, I had to find other money, etc. I later received a snail mail form letter that gave no explanation for the denial, only that the claim was denied.

I then called customer service, escalated, and got the ear of a supervisor. The explanation that Wells Fargo gave me made me so furious that I called on a regular basis to argue with them about their hubris and stupidity." I can recall the explanation verbatim: "Since you were the only one who knew the password to your account, you stole the money!" Everyone I spoke with told me the same thing.

Meanwhile, I received a snail mail letter from an electronics company where I had bought items with my WF debit card. They had a data breach which matched the dates of my account withdrawals. I called that company and the CEO was very gracious. When I explained the problem with WF, she said that if I have any further problem, she will call the bank on my behalf. I went in person to a bank office, showed them the letter, and they immediately refunded me. I explained to that person and to others the arrogance of their claim that it could only be that I stole my own money.

Here's the point relevant to BanReservas and to why I'm making this comparison. Since WF was finally able to evaluate precisely why this fraud occurred (a one off event), evidence based, I maintained my account. If I had never received that letter from that electronics company, a solution to the mystery, I would have closed my WF account.

If BR can evaluate precisely why this fraud occurred, a specific example with evidence as in the case of WF, I will keep my account open. If they cannot, I will close it. It's highly doubtful that they have the granular control necessary to exactly evaluate the fraud such that I could safely dismiss it as a one-off event. If that's the case, adios BR.

My advice: If you have an BR account, remove your funds: "Forewarned is forearmed," ; "Better safe than sorry," ; "Better to err on the side of caution." For some things in life, all it takes is one mistake and that's the end. This is one of those cases.

Meanwhile, I'm processing a new application at BHD.

--

 

[XTraveller]

OP Update #2:

Today I went to BanReservas to apprise them of the fraud, specifically, the money withdrawn from my account that was not my transaction. To my surprise, to file a claim ("reclamen") I ended up on a phone giving much detailed information and receiving a claim number.

I can expect to receive a result within 89 business days via an "affirmed" or "denied" SMS text. That's more than four months with the implication that I'll learn nothing about the reason for the fraud. Barring the small chance that I'll get my money back, this process is a waste of time and will not solve my problem.

To explain why, let me make an analogy to U.S. banking. About 15 years ago, on my Wells Fargo account, $500.00 was withdrawn four times by an unknown entity. I filed a fraud claim and my account was credited $2,000.00 Unfortunately, a few months later I was in Shanghai, China when I found out that my account had a zero balance and was overdrawn. I learned that my claim was denied and that $2,000.00 credit was withdrawn from my account. That gave me serious travel problems, I had to find other money, etc. I later received a snail mail form letter that gave no explanation for the denial, only that the claim was denied.

I then called customer service, escalated, and got the ear of a supervisor. The explanation that Wells Fargo gave me made me so furious that I called on a regular basis to argue with them about their hubris and stupidity." I can recall the explanation verbatim: "Since you were the only one who knew the password to your account, you stole the money!" Everyone I spoke with told me the same thing.

Meanwhile, I received a snail mail letter from an electronics company where I had bought items with my WF debit card. They had a data breach which matched the dates of my account withdrawals. I called that company and the CEO was very gracious. When I explained the problem with WF, she said that if I have any further problem, she will call the bank on my behalf. I went in person to a bank office, showed them the letter, and they immediately refunded me. I explained to that person and to others the arrogance of their claim that it could only be that I stole my own money.

Here's the point relevant to BanReservas and to why I'm making this comparison. Since WF was finally able to evaluate precisely why this fraud occurred (a one off event), evidence based, I maintained my account. If I had never received that letter from that electronics company, a solution to the mystery, I would have closed my WF account.

If BR can evaluate precisely why this fraud occurred, a specific example with evidence as in the case of WF, I will keep my account open. If they cannot, I will close it. It's highly doubtful that they have the granular control necessary to exactly evaluate the fraud such that I could safely dismiss it as a one-off event. If that's the case, adios BR.

My advice: If you have an BR account, remove your funds: "Forewarned is forearmed," ; "Better safe than sorry," ; "Better to err on the side of caution." For some things in life, all it takes is one mistake and that's the end. This is one of those cases.

Meanwhile, I'm processing a new application at BHD.

--

Let us Know how it goes opening a new bank account with BHD.

 

[Buffness]

I review all of my accounts on a daily basis.

That part 👆.

Our solution for banking in the DR ? ....maintain low balances ....we learnt this lesson from a poster here in DR1 some years ago ....after having a similar experience to the OP....and after BanReservas sucked up hundreds of our US dollars ...in savings accounts....as " bank charges and fees" ...slowly over 5 years . ...long story.

Our DR bank accounts now are only for local small purchases only ...nothing over 5000 pesos....and if you must have a high balance ...make it temporary ....and get to your money before the ladrones banks do ... ! 👈 that part , we learnt from our Dominican friends ...😁🇩🇴... .when in DR ...do as ....

 

[josh2203]

I can expect to receive a result within 89 business days via an "affirmed" or "denied" SMS text. That's more than four months with the implication that I'll learn nothing about the reason for the fraud. Barring the small chance that I'll get my money back, this process is a waste of time and will not solve my problem.
--

I might be wrong but I believe that 90 days (not 89 unless I'm wrong) is the standard and not DR related, as I a couple of years back I had an incorrect withdrawal at Ahorros y Prestamos Nacional in POP with a foreign card and the card issuer told me it was 90 days as first they needed to report the incident back to the merchant (La Nacional) and then they had a certain amount of time to respond etc. So 90 days would be 3 months and not 4.

What happened was that in a hurry, I was very stupid and used the Nacional ATM at the entrance of Sirena in POP as the other one was out of order. I took out 30k. I entered my pin so gave them full access to the card and then the ATM very nicely informed me that transaction cannot be completed. I panicked, went straight home and checked account. Sure enough, 30k was taken... I contacted the bank and they assured me that no need to worry, they will take care of this, just that they need to wait until the charge is settled before they can do something. If not settled, then the ATM noticed that something was off and the transaction was indeed cancelled. No such luck, the transaction was settled. I did go back to Nacional branch to report this and they said they would check the ATM transactions and report back to me in a week. I definitely did not trust this, so I reported back to the bank that I went to the ATM owner but nothing further came out of that...

Long story short, I had to do nothing else, the foreign back took care of this and exactly 90 days after, the money was fully back on my account. Obviously Nacional did not get back to me... I have not used that ATM since...

I have said this in this forum previously, I had several accounts in several currencies with BHS/Leon/Banreservas in the past (many years ago) and my wife still obviously has her account in BPD, but I have not had any active account in the DR for close to a decade, despite living in the DR... I have had no need for that and piece of mind... Cash out of Scotia ATMs, then check the account and then pay bills with the cash, has worked like a charm for years...

 

[JD Jones]

I might be wrong but I believe that 90 days (not 89 unless I'm wrong) is the standard and not DR related, as I a couple of years back I had an incorrect withdrawal at Ahorros y Prestamos Nacional in POP with a foreign card and the card issuer told me it was 90 days as first they needed to report the incident back to the merchant (La Nacional) and then they had a certain amount of time to respond etc. So 90 days would be 3 months and not 4.

What happened was that in a hurry, I was very stupid and used the Nacional ATM at the entrance of Sirena in POP as the other one was out of order. I took out 30k. I entered my pin so gave them full access to the card and then the ATM very nicely informed me that transaction cannot be completed. I panicked, went straight home and checked account. Sure enough, 30k was taken... I contacted the bank and they assured me that no need to worry, they will take care of this, just that they need to wait until the charge is settled before they can do something. If not settled, then the ATM noticed that something was off and the transaction was indeed cancelled. No such luck, the transaction was settled. I did go back to Nacional branch to report this and they said they would check the ATM transactions and report back to me in a week. I definitely did not trust this, so I reported back to the bank that I went to the ATM owner but nothing further came out of that...

Long story short, I had to do nothing else, the foreign back took care of this and exactly 90 days after, the money was fully back on my account. Obviously Nacional did not get back to me... I have not used that ATM since...

I have said this in this forum previously, I had several accounts in several currencies with BHS/Leon/Banreservas in the past (many years ago) and my wife still obviously has her account in BPD, but I have not had any active account in the DR for close to a decade, despite living in the DR... I have had no need for that and piece of mind... Cash out of Scotia ATMs, then check the account and then pay bills with the cash, has worked like a charm for years...

I wonder if it had anything to do with the physical quantity of bills. On some Nacional ATMs, I could not withdraw 20k because the slot wasn't large enough. I could take out larger quantities, but 10K at a time.

 

[Lucas61]

Let us Know how it goes opening a new bank account with BHD.

I certainly will. I did have my first interview. I only need to present four items: passport, a second U.S. identification, three months "account movement" both for BanReservas and for my U.S. bank where I receive my pension and SSA. I have the name of that bank employee so I can return to her. There were only three people waiting besides me yet I waited two hours for service! What a joke! But the service was good once I received it. At first she balked when I told her that I did not have Dominican residency but then she let that pass! After all, immigration here has institutionalized a system here when you can live here permanently without a visa or residency and then pay the exit tax when you leave the country -- and they secure a huge amount of money with that process, so I think she just gave lip service to the residency "requirement."

 

[Lucas61]

O.P. Summary: I went to BHD on Mella in Sto. Dom. I waited for almost two hours with only two clients ahead of me. I thought this was the usual "DRBS." Given my bad vision, I didn't see the tiny sign for "Negocios" or the sign for "Servicios" which was actually at the counter--where it never is at most banks.

A woman working in a back office came to help me for reasons I don't understand. She took me under her wing and gave me great service, even allowing us to communicate via my personal email as I procured documents for account setup.

This is what I needed: 1. three months of account activity from my U.S. bank where I receive my pension and from my previous D.R. bank, 2. an original SSA card, 3. two identifications from the U.S. I used my passport plus my California I.D. She peppered me with tons of KYC questions. She seemed to think that I was not eligible for an account because I don't have Dominican residency but finally shrugged her shoulders on that one.

I finally had account approval and made a small deposti. But the branch had no passbooks and no debit cards, rendering my account useless. For that I had to go to another branch and I chose the one on Independencia. There I secured both and made another desposit. This accoiunt exists for one piurpose--a medical emergency, and I carry it in a secret place on my person whenever I go out. I decided that my ultimate savings goal will be less than I had anticipated. Probably I'll keep no more than 45K DOP in this account. That should get me over the hump in an emergency. The balance in savings will be on a U.S. debit card.

If this bank makes one mistake that is not through any fault of my own, I will never bank in the D.R. again. I trusted Banreservas and my money was wiped out through no fault of my own . . . If you have an account there, I'd think twice. We now have a second family member who has had money disappeared from his account for no known reason . . .

 

[NanSanPedro]

O.P. Summary: I went to BHD on Mella in Sto. Dom. I waited for almost two hours with only two clients ahead of me. I thought this was the usual "DRBS." Given my bad vision, I didn't see the tiny sign for "Negocios" or the sign for "Servicios" which was actually at the counter--where it never is at most banks.

A woman working in a back office came to help me for reasons I don't understand. She took me under her wing and gave me great service, even allowing us to communicate via my personal email as I procured documents for account setup.

This is what I needed: 1. three months of account activity from my U.S. bank where I receive my pension and from my previous D.R. bank, 2. an original SSA card, 3. two identifications from the U.S. I used my passport plus my California I.D. She peppered me with tons of KYC questions. She seemed to think that I was not eligible for an account because I don't have Dominican residency but finally shrugged her shoulders on that one.

I finally had account approval and made a small deposti. But the branch had no passbooks and no debit cards, rendering my account useless. For that I had to go to another branch and I chose the one on Independencia. There I secured both and made another desposit. This accoiunt exists for one piurpose--a medical emergency, and I carry it in a secret place on my person whenever I go out. I decided that my ultimate savings goal will be less than I had anticipated. Probably I'll keep no more than 45K DOP in this account. That should get me over the hump in an emergency. The balance in savings will be on a U.S. debit card.

If this bank makes one mistake that is not through any fault of my own, I will never bank in the D.R. again. I trusted Banreservas and my money was wiped out through no fault of my own . . . If you have an account there, I'd think twice. We now have a second family member who has had money disappeared from his account for no known reason . . .

Thanks for the write-up. I'm with you. There is absolutely no reason to open a Dominican bank account. I can't think of even one, even in an emergency.

 

[josh2203]

Thanks for the write-up. I'm with you. There is absolutely no reason to open a Dominican bank account. I can't think of even one, even in an emergency.

While I fully agree on many points here, I'm not saying that there is no reason to open a bank account in the DR, as situations may change. I can say though, that the longest time we've ever lived as a family in the DR (5+ years), we have not had the need for one. Yes, this limited us to paying our bills in cash, as certain utility companies do not accept foreign payment methods, but even more secure so.

It's good point that you mention emergencies. Here I fully agree with you, why? Because if you have an emergency, I would only rely on the following things:

1. Cash in DOP at hand
2. Foreign cards that I can use in (almost) any ATM there is out there. Not tight to a specific bank. More precisely, a foreign card that I can use with peace of mind, so a debit card with a certain amount there or as mentioned earlier by other members, a credit card where I can simply report false transactions. If I'd have a card from one DR bank and where I'm based in, there ATMs of that given bank would be out of order in that location, it would not matter if I had funds in that bank, as I would not be able to access those. I have seen problems occasionally even with what we most trust in POP, Scotiabank. If all their 3 ATMs in POP are out of order, I cannot get to the money quickly. Emergency or not...

 

[bob saunders]

Thanks for the write-up. I'm with you. There is absolutely no reason to open a Dominican bank account. I can't think of even one, even in an emergency.

Depends on how invested you are in the country. I have rental income here so require a Dominican bank acct for clients to deposit into. I have a BHD International CC so I don't have to use my Canadians ones. I have a peso acct and a $US dollar acct. I can send money online from my Royal Bank acct in Canada to my BHD dollar acct at low cost and have the money within 3 days. My Canadian CC has a limit of 25,000 $US so that would cover most emergencies. I haven't used my debit card for years.

 

[SKY]

Having an account here also means you can easily pay most of your bills directly from your peso account. BHD online is excellent at this................

 

[USA DOC]

Dominican Banks are to leakey a vessel to put your faith in..............

 

[JLSawmam]

The OP mentions receiving a passbook and a debit card. If this means having two accounts, and both are in pesos, keeping most of the money in the passbook account would lessen the fraud/theft concern, as the debit card is what is most commonly exploited.

 

[chico bill]

When you have an issue with your bank, like I did with them deducting money from my account when their ATM was unable to dispense money (8,000 pesos in my case at BSC), you can file a reclamacion until your testes shrivel to the size of peas and you will not be compensated for their failed equipment or their failure to keep it stocked with funds. It's your loss, because Dominicans never ever refund money or honor "guarantees" for any reason.