He just might. For now, we will have to do with this one:
[video=youtube;rePNxfPA9ok]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rePNxfPA9ok[/video]
- Thread starter william webster
- Start date
North Coast Upgrade
He just might. For now, we will have to do with this one:
[video=youtube;rePNxfPA9ok]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rePNxfPA9ok[/video]
To attract serious investment, tourism and eliminate the bad reputation the gov.do needs to focus on:
Hospitals
Ambulances
Paramedics
911 service
24/7 electricity
Tap drinking water
Municipal road repair/ upgrade
Sidewalks
Street lighting
Policing
Honest courts and judges
Education for Dominicans
Stop pretending that a few mongers and prostitutes are the real problem.
Forget forever about honest courts and judges, drinking water from the tap, and real paramedics. Education for Dominicans is highly doubtful.
911 service, 24/7 electricity , fixing roads, side walks, street lighting are possible. Although 24/7 power everywhere is unlikely.
For even the possible things to happen, the few mongers and prostitutes that exist at any given time are being driven as far from public view as possible in order to attract investments that will help with some, but not all, of the missing things.
I don't think it's "a few" mongers. The town only only attracts mongers of late and not high quality mongers - cheap sweaty and unsophisticated groups..
Men who think they can do anything to a woman, degrade her, take video and post it online on porn sites. Google Sosua and sex and you will see what you can find including one man who claims to have had sex with 31 women in a week.
And some other idiot called Cuba Dave who boasts of all his conquests with photos.
Sosua is gaining a reputation like Phuket, Thailand and read about some of the recent murders and the crime syndicates from Russia
ruining the vibe. If you let a place deteriorate as has Sosua, with crime against tourists increasing, as it has done in the past 4 years it will be forever tainted as dangerous and dirty. If the beach was not so nice Sosua would loose it's attraction for most non-monger tourists altogether.
What might really help is if they actually developed the golf course that has been planned. But developing or doing anything in the DR has become too expensive and too frustrating with bribes and rip-offs.
One thing for certain the town doesn't have just a few mongers - it has a way too many and they are very loud, cheap and are ruining the town for all others.
Simply stated chico, Sosua was the undisciplined child...
What I mean is, if you have a child, and then never discipline it, it will eventually misbehave more and more until finally it becomes something you can no longer tolerate/deal with. Same holds true for the whole puta story in Sosua and all the guys who came down and made videos, wrote all about the exploits on websites/Facebook, and god knows where else.
The funny part of it is, the town turned a blind eye to it for a long time and now are trying to discipline the child that was left to its own devices. They had decades to "cull the herd" and keep things to a dull roar, but let it blossom.
They also had decades to try make the town into a family tourist town, but did nothing in regards to try to get investors to build more AI's or attractions to convert it.
The proverbial fire brigade is showing up after the fire...
What I mean is, if you have a child, and then never discipline it, it will eventually misbehave more and more until finally it becomes something you can no longer tolerate/deal with. Same holds true for the whole puta story in Sosua and all the guys who came down and made videos, wrote all about the exploits on websites/Facebook, and god knows where else.
The funny part of it is, the town turned a blind eye to it for a long time and now are trying to discipline the child that was left to its own devices. They had decades to "cull the herd" and keep things to a dull roar, but let it blossom.
They also had decades to try make the town into a family tourist town, but did nothing in regards to try to get investors to build more AI's or attractions to convert it.
The proverbial fire brigade is showing up after the fire...
I think they think if they break it and kill Sosua then investors will come... Really? Why do people think these crazy things? It certainly could happen in our imagination and maybe it will, but that is far far from certain. Given the old infrastructure here that is dysfunctional and the effort and costs required for gentrification and the lack of any city plan/planning, the city will likely have an uphill battle to hold its head above water and keep going. Some people seem to think there is a grand plan for re-investment. Maybe, but I sure don't see any evidence of it.
This is still hilarious that some people think the prostitution, drug and crime are only the problems of Sosua, and once that is cleaned up the whole NC or even DR can become a magnet for investment and prosperity.
Well, it's laughable form those who don't know DR at all, but really sad that the delusional government seems to think this as well... !
Well, it's laughable form those who don't know DR at all, but really sad that the delusional government seems to think this as well... !
You almost had me, all the way to this point right here.. lmao..
Maybe you are speaking of a very specific type of Monger. .lol
Are Norwegians loud ? maybe Aussies..lol i dont know, not gonna go there.
But, Do you even know what the Average Daily " Budget " of a monger is ??
Not arguing for or against..
I will clue you in , because I know... Its around $200 a day... and that's hard cash SPENT.. some go much higher to well over $300/ Day
show me one other group that spends that kind of cash , per day..per PERSON.
( dont care if you believe in Reagan Economics, but that Son , is a LOT of Trickle down $$)
again, not arguing for or against the whole scene.. cuz i really dont care..
but show me.. cuz this I DO know as a Mathematical Fact..
Sweeping statements.
No doubt therefore that you have travelled extensively and visited all parts of the North Coast between Monte Cristi and Nagua and speak with an authority and understanding of this tourism market far better than those within the Ministry of Tourism, the regional Tourist Boards and the regional hospitality operators let alone central government.
Fact is that they have done exceptionally well in generating successful tourism nationally and a projected 6 million plus visitors excluding cruisers and domestic visitors this year. Perhaps they know very much more about DR and the North Coast than you?
Suggest you pick up the phone and talk to them personally about your assessments.
Well fill us in on the rest of the problems , perhaps ones that are unique to the north coast and dont exist in the rest of the country.
I think maybe you misunderstood..
My take on Uzins post was that Prostitution, Drugs, and Crime are NOT Unique to Sosua, just more in your face perhaps ( which is what attracted all the unwanted attention + the Internet, videos and all that) , but definitely not unique, and certainly not caused BY the type of tourists being attracted Yester year, today or tomorrow
Boca chica was a Carbon Copy of Sosua at one time.. and here was Literally NO Internet back then
it was quite literally Sosua South.
that right there proves his point most effortlessly.
Point is , These problems have been alive and well in the DR for many Decades. They just getting a lot of the wrong kind of attention now and harder to sweep under the rug ..
and so its easier to blame one group of Travelers, than to actually FIX the problems..
I have been in the tourism industry for over 8 years and have a project which puts me in constant contact with the Ministries of Tourism & Culture, CESTUR and AMET.
I also deal with international travel agents on a consistent basis.
One observation regarding gubmint function in the DR: they may be slow, but they are NOT stupid.
Tourism will pick up on the North Coast when TRAVEL AGENTS refer their clients there. And for many years, through today, they refer virtually none of their clients to the Sosua area. None. I won't go into the reasons because they have been beaten to death here.
I don't understand why anyone is surprised with bar closings, barriers put in place, and a general cracking down on certain activities aimed at certain groups. The message has been very clear for some time. The future has been broadcast loudly. Whether or not you agree with it is irrelevant. They have *zero* concern with businesses who cater to certain groups, none, nada; if nothing else, those very people---the powers that be---may be real estate vultures, picking the flesh off the bones when those businesses become insolvent. And, for better or worse, the powers aren't that concerned about what those who have chosen certain career paths do, although educational programs are available to all. Call it what you wish: mean, uncaring, heartless, etc.: it is what it is.
The travel agents will not begin sending clients until things change, period. Investment won't come until the area is cleaned up. Consider the situation just another case of urban renewal for the purpose of regentrification. And seriously: the powers that be, hypocrites or not, truly don't care what certain Sosua constituents think. Not one bit.
And for every monger who drops the princely sum of $200 a day, there are maybe 25 non-mongers who drop $150+ a day who don't come because their travel agent won't make referrals. What do I base my numbers on? Conversations with travel agencies.
And one more comment: The DR is strongly beholden to the World Bank and IMF. Few have any great insight into how such groups dole out financing to countries in need. I happen to know from my educational background. When a loan is approved, pretty much all we hear is the $$$ involved. What is rarely made public---and neither group pushes transparency with those documents---are the "side deals", some of which are social engineering components that become benchmarks for future financial assistance. One such component in many deals to the Third World (yes, I know the DR is not "Third World", per se; however to urbane international "high-bred" bureaucrats it might as well be...) include a "human trafficking" benchmark. And make no mistake: these PC bureaucrats consider prostitution "human trafficking" and exploitation of poor women. So the DR must demonstrate efforts to meet these benchmarks for future financial assistance. Effectiveness is secondary to appearance of effort.
Once again, not passing judgement, but "it is what it is."
I also deal with international travel agents on a consistent basis.
One observation regarding gubmint function in the DR: they may be slow, but they are NOT stupid.
Tourism will pick up on the North Coast when TRAVEL AGENTS refer their clients there. And for many years, through today, they refer virtually none of their clients to the Sosua area. None. I won't go into the reasons because they have been beaten to death here.
I don't understand why anyone is surprised with bar closings, barriers put in place, and a general cracking down on certain activities aimed at certain groups. The message has been very clear for some time. The future has been broadcast loudly. Whether or not you agree with it is irrelevant. They have *zero* concern with businesses who cater to certain groups, none, nada; if nothing else, those very people---the powers that be---may be real estate vultures, picking the flesh off the bones when those businesses become insolvent. And, for better or worse, the powers aren't that concerned about what those who have chosen certain career paths do, although educational programs are available to all. Call it what you wish: mean, uncaring, heartless, etc.: it is what it is.
The travel agents will not begin sending clients until things change, period. Investment won't come until the area is cleaned up. Consider the situation just another case of urban renewal for the purpose of regentrification. And seriously: the powers that be, hypocrites or not, truly don't care what certain Sosua constituents think. Not one bit.
And for every monger who drops the princely sum of $200 a day, there are maybe 25 non-mongers who drop $150+ a day who don't come because their travel agent won't make referrals. What do I base my numbers on? Conversations with travel agencies.
And one more comment: The DR is strongly beholden to the World Bank and IMF. Few have any great insight into how such groups dole out financing to countries in need. I happen to know from my educational background. When a loan is approved, pretty much all we hear is the $$$ involved. What is rarely made public---and neither group pushes transparency with those documents---are the "side deals", some of which are social engineering components that become benchmarks for future financial assistance. One such component in many deals to the Third World (yes, I know the DR is not "Third World", per se; however to urbane international "high-bred" bureaucrats it might as well be...) include a "human trafficking" benchmark. And make no mistake: these PC bureaucrats consider prostitution "human trafficking" and exploitation of poor women. So the DR must demonstrate efforts to meet these benchmarks for future financial assistance. Effectiveness is secondary to appearance of effort.
Once again, not passing judgement, but "it is what it is."
One of the first Buffett songs I learned. Never really understood what it really meant until I spent time in Luperon meeting the expats from different nations who left everything behind, bought a boat, and sailed into Luperon harbour never to leave. I met a few of them at the marina, shared stories and beers with them. I admired their sense of adventure but there was always an aura of sadness about them. Thanks for the video. Much appreciated. Makes me miss the DR.
See post #22, although many of the problems stated in that post do exist in other parts of the country.
Attention has also been elevated by high profile mongers like Senator Mendez, Congressman Charlie Rangel keeping a paramour pad and Rush Limbaugh smuggling Viagra without a prescription .
It's one thing when is it Joe Blow, but when real sex exploitation hits the headlines with stories of young Dominicans being trafficked.
If Sousa can be cleaned up (dirty streets, crime and the in-your-face putas, then prostitution would be allowed to continue on a low key basis without groups of street walkers flaunting their "assets" on display aggressively badgering tourists.
Clean up the drugs and crime then discourage the roving groups of men and women who have turned Sosua in to a Tijuana red light district.
But corruption probably can't be cleaned up.
It's one thing when is it Joe Blow, but when real sex exploitation hits the headlines with stories of young Dominicans being trafficked.
If Sousa can be cleaned up (dirty streets, crime and the in-your-face putas, then prostitution would be allowed to continue on a low key basis without groups of street walkers flaunting their "assets" on display aggressively badgering tourists.
Clean up the drugs and crime then discourage the roving groups of men and women who have turned Sosua in to a Tijuana red light district.
But corruption probably can't be cleaned up.
I agree with your post , except this part here..
this is pie in the Sky... please show me these Tourists who are dropping $150 a day... in another part of the Dom Rep ??
Just to clarify, my $200 figure did NOT include Hotel or any type of Air Travel whatsoever.
Im talking strictly CASH spent on the street.. In restaurants, for drinks, and entertainment. ( you fill in the blanks)
if you can show me who besides perhaps someone who gambles that spends that kind of money, per person per day ??
I would love to see it..
I respectfully say your $150 figure is completely fabricated. as is your "25 more people /vs 1 monger " who will magically appear out of no where .
Have had the pleasure of hanging with a couple guys whos money would make most people blush.. they dont spend that per day, except maybe at the AI.
and they have no problem spending $300 a night and letting their wives Go nuts with all the extras.. all spent INSIDE the AI or perhaps on Guided Tours..
And as was clearly outlined before that kind of AI money does NOT trickle down to the average person with a job, like in Sosua..
I dont know where you get this false Narrative from. but there are no 25 people for every monger waiting to just buy tickets to go to Sosua Beach.
that is pure fantasy.
with all respect to your Industry..
but then again, Travel Agents make their Money on Commissions selling Packages , no ?
So I can clearly see how you would feel this way.
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What I don't get is this, why I can go to Caberete a 15 minute ride from Sosua and to the biggest cat house with 20+ chicas, get propositioned on the street and on the beach, and also get the offer of weed in the street, but no clean up or curfew is done there.
How Crsytal one of the most famous whore-houses in NC in Puerto Plata can still operate, and my friends can get iron bars on their head walking the malecon during day and be rubbed, but they are not doing anything new there, new security measures, curfew, clampdown etc.
Check the crime reports nationally and in NC (dv8 post some), compare to Sosua and say if it's unacceptably high/different here.
But they say we (only we !) really have problems here in Sosua with prostitution, drugs and crime .... !? (and why, because a bunch of un-elected rich boys, ADSS and their friends, would like to take over the town for their real state projects, they raise these issues, lobby and pay up and get their way !)
As for Tourism Ministry and other ministries, no doubt they have done well the last few years, so why don't they just carry on, small little town like Sosua has nothing to greatly offer their tourism plans nationally, why waste time to kill a small town ... they are not really interested, they are being lobbied and paid, hence the interest, see above.
For one, they do so with my company where they spend, on average, around $350 a day.
Secondly, I am given information by several resort corporations in the DR with which I work.
Thirdly, I am given stats compiled by the Ministry of Tourism.
I only will post a fact, not anything "made up."
I am not responsible for another man's fantasies, excuses, rationalizations or demons, nor do I require another man to believe me.
I do understand why some would need for the facts to not be accurate, and will no longer debate them as I have done so in detail in the past.
Additionally, as the resort and tourism industry is notoriously low-margin, even if a corporation sends cash distributions offshore, close to 90% of all cash that arrives in the DR stays in the DR, contrary to your assertion.
Every time I have tried to book at the Casa Marina the agent on the phone will try and talk me out of it. I have to explain I have been there several times and happen to like the location. Only then will they proceed to book it. They always seem quite surprised I want to go back, even more surprised when I add the wife's name to the booking.
Understandable as reputation is a bitch......why create more headaches for yourself ( the agent I mean )