Observation from the Frontier. US Troops

[Mirador]

Do you have a problem with that? If the DR GOVERNMENT OKed it, what's the problem? So here you have a guy that lives there and reports that there haven't been any demonstrations and you have a leftist newpaper saying that 1000s are demonstrating, you would think that the bigger newpapers would be covering it.

Bob, yes, I have a problem with that... You don't expect me to share your neo-colonialist perspective on this issue, do you? By the way, the DR government/congress has not authorized the presence of US military personnel in the DR, it has only condoned it, for obvious reasons...
What I'm saying is that the presence of US military personnel in the DR is ill-boding, and the feeling is not lost in the general population, whether the mainstream media reports on it or not. And for DR Southwesteners the feeling is more overwhelming, where the symbolism isn't lost to the fact that US military personnel have taken over one of their most sensitive historical site, the 'Sierra de Mart?n Garc?a - Loma del Curro' mountain, which was the site of the only successful rebelion by the indigenous Taino against Spanish conquerors in the XVI century. It is the place where Taino chieftain Guarocuya held off the Spanish in a lengthy guerilla campaign, until a regime change in Europe (Charles V), , offered him good terms of surrender. Guarocuya (Enriquillo) died in Azua, a landowner, and lietenant in the Spanish colonial army, circa 1532.

 

[kfrancis]

End of this Observations from the Fontier !

Well it seems it took you all only three ( 3 ) pages to get completely off the subject this time.

As I started this thread with the hope of giving a " local " perspective, which I found missing in the previous eleven ( 11 ) page debate, I would like to close this one now. If that is OK with you Hillbilly ?

In closing:

Not sure what to say about the " thousands " protesting.

What number is, " thousands " ?

Now I admit I did not read the article, but let us say the number has to bigger than 1,000, for sure. Because if the was less we would be in the " hundreds ". And it suggest it was more than 2,000 because that would be a " couple of thousand ". So let's go with 3,000 for what Mirador says his paper calls " thousands " in protest.

Tell you what, if that is the number of " thousands " involved then you have nearly 5% of the population out burning tires and yelling " yankee go home ".

Think that we would have even be heard of such protest here in Cabral.

Mirador, do enjoy your passion for your convictions but I see no "overwhelming feeling of ill boding " amonst the SW population. In fact, I can assure you the majority do not even know they are here, or care.

The fact that the US troops are running around the " hills " across the bay is of no real concern. Might be of concern, if the undefensible " Loma Del Curro " was the site you profess it to be.

Final Observation on History of the area.

Sorry to say, but no one could carry out a " lengthy guerrilla campaign " out of the Sierra de Martin Garcia. I am sure they were not quite as barren as they are now back in CC's time but they were not " the " stronghold of Enriquillo". Loma Del Curro was an important " high ground " observation point overseeing the land access route into the area. It also offers " line of site " visability ( communication ) to another site further west across the valley of the Yaque del Sur.

It is here that one needs to look, in the Sierra de Bahoruco's, for the center of Enriquillo's succesful campaign against the Spanish. Enriquillo's stronghold was a 7km by 4km hidden mountain valley entered through a 2km river gorge with 1000m walls. The floor of the valley is at 600m with a fairly flat enclosure 4km by 2km with the surrounding walls being between 1150m to 1600m. It was from here that he left to fight ( harrass might be a better word ) his enemy and to here he returned to hide ( never found ).

The Sierra de Bahoruco was also the land given given to Enriquillo and his followers, by treaty from the Spanish after their defeat, I think " retired from the field of battle " was the term used. I have no knowledge of this great Tanio warrior, retiring to Azua to be a landowner and soldier for those who he defeated. I do have knowledge that the Spanish let Enriquillo and his people live in peace until his death in the Bahoruco's then broke the treaty with his people.

In their way the mountains still protect us from the outside and we like it that way.

Fin

kFrancico de Cabral

 

[Chris]

Thanks kfrancis, for answering the question that I asked in the beginning of the 11 page off-topic thread. Don't despair, some of us can stick to a topic.

 

[Mirador]

Francisco, before I go over-and-out on this thread...

Your only facts on Enriquillo are derived from a XIX century novelist, Manuel de Jes?s Galv?n, who wrote a romantic fictionalized novel about Guarocuya, titled "Enriquillo", without any documented historical references to base his story on. My own references are from unpublished local traditions and my own research from the Archives of Seville, Spain. By the way, Azua and La Loma del Curro was a lush tropical forest before the Spanish completely deforested it, in part to build the ill-fated Spanish Armada. This thing about the Hoyo de Pelempito being the realm of Enriquillo is a new fiction, created to sell tourist to visit the place.. I saw the sign: 'Enriquillo was Here'...


-

 

[kfrancis]

Pelempito "nice" but not location mentioned !

Mirador,

Give you the deforestation of that area.

Never read or researched your given source. Have read every volumn of the CC body of work, although skipped some what through the times in Spain.

My research on Enriquillo and the Tanio's in particular is quite extensive also. The site research of the " much talked about through history " stronghold location is more personal.

I'll give you the hype on Pelempito being the " stronghold " but you did not read the site specs mentioned closely or have never been to Pelempito to have known the difference between the two.

Let's close this one out. Will look for your thoughts down the electronic highway.

kFrancisco de Cabral

 

[Larry]

kfrancis

Thanks for the first hand information. I hope you can continue to keep us posted.

Larry

 

[Rick Snyder]

kfrancis

Once again thank you for some very worthwhile posts. Once again let me reiterate that which has previously been posted, please keep us informed.

Rick

 

[bob saunders]

Bob, yes, I have a problem with that... You don't expect me to share your neo-colonialist perspective on this issue, do you? By the way, the DR government/congress has not authorized the presence of US military personnel in the DR, it has only condoned it, for obvious reasons...
.

How do you come up with neo-colonialist perpective, you don't know me, or anything about me.
American troops are there with the permission of the government, who probably welcome them and as Francisco has observed there isn't this huge outpouring of outrage that you talk about. I receive Dominican TV by satellite, and haven't seen or heard anything about the big-bad American troops. Perhaps in your outrage you have imaged that the rest of the Dominican population is/should be as outraged as you are. Do I think you have reason for concern, of course, based on past history, but are you crying wolf. I think so.

 

[bienamor]

Any thing new??

Any thing new on this? All I have seen in Santo Domingo is a few Yanqui fuera phrases painted on walls and the sign at the communista party head quarters.

No protests nothing? and no new news from Barahona

 

[Rick Snyder]

I've only seen this is the past few days;

US troops in Barahona
http://www.dominicantoday.com/app/article.aspx?id=10975

Rick

 

[kfrancis]

Confirmation of Clinic Activity !

Can give confirmation to clinic activity, as they have been passing through Cabral the past few days going to the West. They are using mostly civilian transport but it is not hard to miss some twenty or so white guys with shaved heads loaded in the back of a large truck, even in civies.

Today, some earthmoving equipment ( again local government stuff ) was being moved within the convoy. Again, mostly civilian vehicles with a Hummie here and there. Low profile to say the least but they are moving through with no problems or real attention. Problems only seem to happen when the US boys are going one way and encounter the CeMex yeso trucks coming the other way from La Salinas. Tight fit in downtown Cabral and Cachon one might say. Also today we had a low over flight of Cabral by one of the helicopters flying in advance of the groups movements.

Observation: All still quite here on the Frontier. Some building does seem to be going on in " one location ". Clinic when built will be appreciated but staffing and supplies even more so. A clinic is just a building !!!

The troops are making a special effort to be low key. The use of civilian transport is evident throughout the operation. IE. a line up of eight new grey pickups at the Costa Larimar Hotel with " drivers in civies again " waiting the " brass " who are at a breakfast meeting. One thing you can always tell about troops on the move, even in civilian transport, is the spacing portocol taught the drivers in a convoy movement. A right smart procession down the Malecon it was.

kFrancisco de Cabral

 

[bienamor]

Thanks

Can give confirmation to clinic activity, as they have been passing through Cabral the past few days going to the West. They are using mostly civilian transport but it is not hard to miss some twenty or so white guys with shaved heads loaded in the back of a large truck, even in civies.

Today, some earthmoving equipment ( again local government stuff ) was being moved within the convoy. Again, mostly civilian vehicles with a Hummie here and there. Low profile to say the least but they are moving through with no problems or real attention. Problems only seem to happen when the US boys are going one way and encounter the CeMex yeso trucks coming the other way from La Salinas. Tight fit in downtown Cabral and Cachon one might say. Also today we had a low over flight of Cabral by one of the helicopters flying in advance of the groups movements.

Observation: All still quite here on the Frontier. Some building does seem to be going on in " one location ". Clinic when built will be appreciated but staffing and supplies even more so. A clinic is just a building !!!

The troops are making a special effort to be low key. The use of civilian transport is evident throughout the operation. IE. a line up of eight new grey pickups at the Costa Larimar Hotel with " drivers in civies again " waiting the " brass " who are at a breakfast meeting. One thing you can always tell about troops on the move, even in civilian transport, is the spacing portocol taught the drivers in a convoy movement. A right smart procession down the Malecon it was.

kFrancisco de Cabral

Thanks for the information, nice to get the real scoop!

 

[Larry]

terrific info

Thanks for the update!

Larry

 

[kfrancis]

Troops enjoy a little R&R before rotation.

It would seem that the US Government is showing the troops a little R & R before they rotate out of the area. Others, however, do seem to be replacing those who first arrived ( the high tech guys ) and this contingent from PR and Utah are on the way out and were treated to a weekend at the Coasta Larimar Hotel. Will try to process some photos of the crowed pool and bar and pass them along. I remember time in a tent when I was on assignment in a past life.

More to follow as it becomes evident.

kF

 

[Rick Snyder]

Sorry, I posted this to the wrong thread;

Did you nay -sayers read this latest article? ;

http://www.dominicantoday.com/app/article.aspx?id=11386

kfrancis can you give us a first hand update? Thanks.

Rick

 

[kfrancis]

Very Interesting !!!!!!!!

Had lunch in Paraiso on Tuesday. Only word on the street was the Canadian's doing the work on the Hospital.

7am and I have to get to Barahona for a meeting with my construction engineers on a new house but will check this article out. Something just not right.

Did I read the article right ? It starts out with saying 400 people and animals were seen and then later states that 500 to 1000 people, each day in each city were " helped ". LOt of difference in these numbers !

More through Observation from the Frontier later today.

kFrancisco de Cabral

 

[Rick Snyder]

Yes it was the offset of these numbers that I construed as typical Dominican media reporting and the reason I asked for a report from you kFrancisco de Cabral. That is the reason I am anxiously awaiting your report from the people of that region and your observations.

I knew it would come to pass as that was the published intention. The US soldier is very versatile and can always find time aside from his construction of weapons of mass destruction to help the local population of those regions of the world that he wishes to destroy, (he he he he he).

I made a joke, I made a joke!!!!

kfrancis excuse me for using your whole name in the first paragraph but I'm intrigued by it as it, to me, is very regal, sophisticated and I like it. Sorry.

Rick

 

[fatratpass]

The remarks I made were not made viciously nor in mockery, however the censureship and prejudices against well meaning comments are. The idelogies of both extreme right and left, to me are hate doctrines, which do not involve thought or reason. Censureship based on ediologies are just as repugnant from both ends of the political spectrum. If any comment has been made elsewhere that I personally did not make appears you may consider it under the conspiracy theory model, but not from me.

 

[Rick Snyder]

Fatratpass,
As you seem to be new to the board, and if it hasn’t already been done, then let me welcome you to DR1.

Everyone knows or has an opinion on the presence of US troops in this and other countries. As you seem to be new then let me direct you to the following thread for your reading pleasure;

http://www.dr1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47707

Rick

 

[Chris]

US national guard and reserve units constantly do civil actions, which are training missions that envolve good works for the nations they visit all around Latin America. This goes on constantly, and I am surprised more of them have not been done in the Dominican Republic.

Welcome to DR1 and thanks for the private mail. I do appreciate your sentiments although we reason differently.

More to the point, we've had one thread go bust over this issue. I hope that this thread does not go the way of the previous one.

fatratpass, please let us leave this thread simply with our good first hand reports from the border area and not with a bunch of stuff telling us how innocent, good and excellent the soldiers are. I'm sure they are fine people.

Can we leave it at that and not mess up this thread as well? And give our esteemed kFrancisco de Cabral the space to tell us first hand his observations.

I just had a thought, if this thread goes bust, I'm gonna start believing in conspiracy theories...