Ex-pats (3 or more years in the DR), any change of heart?

[mountainannie]

And just to be clear on the Clash.. this is not any Moslem Christian thing but a British American thing.... I am very familiar with the value system that you speak for since I was raised partially in it on my paternal grandmother's side...

The "old school British system" has very rigid class lines and a firm line between black and white.. It preserves the aristocracy and heriditary rule through inheritance to the eldest son. It is patriarchal and heirarchical. Whereas the American system ,,, while certainly also based in that.. as India Pakistan was for 200 years of British Imperial Rule....has had the last 200 years to wiggle and shake about in the world, freed from this rigid strictures.

The closed class system based on heridity does not appeal to me.
That is why I chose to live in Spanish Catholic nation rather than a British former colony.

 

[aarhus]

Maybe we should get this thread back to the topic. "Ex-pats (3 or more years in the DR), any change of heart?" I think the DR is a great place. There are so many things you can do and places to go. It is important to travel around the country though. If not in a car then with buses. Different types of beach areas. Areas with mountains and rivers. And the cities of Santo Domingo and Santiago has so much to offer. The difficult part is getting a well paid job and starting a business. In the job market it is hard to compete with Dominicans unless you have some skills that they dont have. Starting a business is difficult anywhere. On the one hand it is easy here as you can start a business really in any area. And it is not to hard to start up. But there are a lots of laws and regulations that you have to respect. The hard part I find is that it takes a lot of time reporting taxes etc. and taxes are quite high. At the same time you see lots of people you dont care about it. They work informal and pay no taxes and get away with it. My business is in real estate and sometimes the last year we have had low activity but you still have to carry on of course reporting monthly to the DGII. At the same time I see these independents agents working from their homes reporting nothing. Even some of the big US franchises just charge monthly their agents and then the agents do whatever they want. At least that is how it appears to me. So the part of running a business is frustrating. Getting into property management is improving the situation for our business though. And we hope to invest in 2-3 apartments in the Capital and rent them out to our clients that are constantly coming in for rentals via dr1.com and other sites. So at the end of the day I am probally staying long term. So my answer is no then. No change of heart. I still find it the most interesting hearing the reasons for why people have left. And if they are still here and their answer is " Yes I have had a change of heart and I will leave or would leave if I could". It seems the other thread about Colombia could be a latent result of that change of heart. Why else speculate in the difference between the two countries and think about going there instead of the DR.

 

[mountainannie]

I think that there are just walls that one hits.. or at least I did.. the one at 6 months.. then two years.. then five... but I would suggest that the real future for this country lies in seeking out those individuals who have made their money and are not going to be financially dependent on the local economy... folks who either have sound investments or pensions (remember that many federal employees can retire at half pay after 25 years... so they have a solid income underneath them by age 50....)

LT benefited from a lot of very savy Europeans who developed it as a tourist destination. If you search on the web you will find lots of sites in many languages .. message boards, the local paper (in French and Spanish).. but Juan Dolio only has juandolio.com.do which is run by one villa owner. There is no effort to market the entire area.. no center, if you will.. just a lot of developers who went out individually and made a mish mash....

The pueblo of JD.. could revitalize its center with a core group of businesses setting up a good multilingual web page (see Samana.net) , sponsor events and festivals... develop a "brand", if you will...

Multilingual internet marketing is the key to attracting people to this place, I think.

 

[mountainannie]

I would not read too much into the comings and goings... that is just life in the expat world.. lots of us are perhaps just "travellers" and want to see the next horizon.. had our fill of the Island life and want to move on.


Like "in my mind Im gone to Carolina" except it is Chile. The information on those threads is also of interest to Dominicans who may wish to immigrate to another country.

These threads come up periodically.. a few years back there was a big wave of Europeans who went to Costa Rica, I know.. ok.. so now we have folks talking about Colombia...

Finances are always going to play a part and these past years in the market have been a wild ride. Those of us who live from investments are having to reconsider what our money is going to buy and figuring out if they should downsized to another less expensive country now, while their roots here are still tender.... to settle in another place.

The question to my mind is rather.. how do we make the DR an attractive and welcoming place for "settlers" rather than just "tourists"?

 

[aarhus]

I would not read too much into the comings and goings... that is just life in the expat world.. lots of us are perhaps just "travellers" and want to see the next horizon.. had our fill of the Island life and want to move on.


Like "in my mind Im gone to Carolina" except it is Chile. The information on those threads is also of interest to Dominicans who may wish to immigrate to another country.

These threads come up periodically.. a few years back there was a big wave of Europeans who went to Costa Rica, I know.. ok.. so now we have folks talking about Colombia...

Finances are always going to play a part and these past years in the market have been a wild ride. Those of us who live from investments are having to reconsider what our money is going to buy and figuring out if they should downsized to another less expensive country now, while their roots here are still tender.... to settle in another place.

The question to my mind is rather.. how do we make the DR an attractive and welcoming place for "settlers" rather than just "tourists"?

True most Expats often have that traveller/explorer mentality. So Colombia is interesting now as it is a country progressing. Yes how can we make the DR more attractive for "settlers"? And how can the government make it more attractive ? A tax reform would be good lowering taxes and at the same time collecting more efficiently and in that process treating everybody as equal as possible.

 

[MikeFisher]

we are still far off Topic.
the Subject been about Expats who are down here in the DR since 3+ years and why they stay or why some did after such a long time leave???
Mike

 

[aarhus]

we are still far off Topic.
the Subject been about Expats who are down here in the DR since 3+ years and why they stay or why some did after such a long time leave???
Mike

Most of the answers have been positive saying they are glad they came here.

 

[william webster]

Due to the increasing crime rate in the DR and some of it being perpetrated on ex-pats with extremely violent consequences, I am curious as to the answers to the following question:

Expats that made the Dominican Republic their full time home 3 or more years ago.

Would you do it now?

As a refresher..... here is the original topic.

Nothing about why they left..... but that is an interesting corollary that has been raised.... and would be interesting to address.

WW

 

[aarhus]

As a refresher..... here is the original post.

Nothing about why they left..... but that is an interesting corollary that has been raised.... and would be interesting to address.

WW

Actually the orignal post is directed to current residents only. People who still have not left.

 

[mountainannie]

Yes,, sorry,, never answered The Veggie's question...

Yes, absolutely I would do it again.

I am much wiser and have a much broader cultural perspective on the world than I had 6 years ago. My best friends now are French and Dominican.or various blends with a couple of Yanks in the mix... When I have been back to visit my friends, it seems that they are having the same conversation as when I left.

Also .. I live MUCH better on my fixed income here than I ever could in the States.. far more comfort, far more ease--- I mean... the very fact that the colmado and grocery store deliver and I have a maid puts me in the life styles of the rich and famous in the States.

I would not have made it without the folks here at DR1 who encouraged and advised --- even though I have only met a few of them in person..

But through a posting here I met an American woman who lived in LT and we corresponded for about six months before I got here so we already felt we were friends.. which we remain,

Ginny in particular was a great mainstay and made me feel that I was a bit "watched over" and safe.....

 

[william webster]

Due to the increasing crime rate in the DR and some of it being perpetrated on ex-pats with extremely violent consequences, I am curious as to the answers to the following question:

Expats that made the Dominican Republic their full time home 3 or more years ago.

Would you do it now?

Actually, this is the first post.... VERBATIM....

I pulled it to help you

WW

 

[MikeFisher]

right WW,
and the OP related the leaving or staying to a increasing Crime Rate in DR.
so we should stick to the OP/Topic of a theme.
who left or is planning to leave due a increased Crime Rate in DR during the last 10 years???
and also Who will stay with or without a increasing Crime rate??
and also related to that Topic:
does the DR have a increasing Crime Rate compared to the rest of the Globe???
Mike

 

[AZB]

We would shape her up and raise the kid with great love and affection.......
it is that you carry a value system that is steeped in a tradition of another culture and I am a product of American
Mongrelization
from back to the Mayflower

So any street hooker in Sosua is my sister

And has as much right to be in the family as the rest of us

it is just a clash of culture

Clash of culture, my arse. We are certainly coming from different backgrounds and I don't think any of my american friends in USA would call a sosua hooker their sister. You are just culture-less and devoid of any family values. I often thought, what kind of families these porn stars have? Where do they come from? Now I think I am beginning to understand.
Reading what you wrote, I certainly pray to god your sons and grandchildren marry up hookers, and motoconcho guys. Then you will be proud to exhibit your american values to everyone who are just like you.
American-british values, hahahaha. yeah right. tell that to someone else who is from katmandu, not to me. I know different kind of americans and they certainly don't share your mentality.
AZB

 

[mountainannie]

Now as opposed to then, then?

Well I first moved to Las Terrenas in 2004 and it was like Dodge City with all the streets of caliche and various foreigners walking about with pistols in their belts..... They went through a real rash of break ins and robberies,,, had to fire the police, get a grip on the town.. Now all the streets are paved and I hear of very few break ins.

As for the Capital.. never once have had a problem (unless you can count the battle to get Ferriterria Americana to replace my new fridge:ermm

So even though there may be reports of some crime.. I certainly do not think that it is WORSE than it was six years ago. Perhaps the "gangs" move to other areas... but LT is much safer..

It does seem that JD is worse... and perhaps some other towns, but not the country as a whole.

And I travel all about the country alone... on buses and guaguas and conchos as well as rental cars

Admittedly, I do not go out to clubs at night and so am not involved in that scene which may be getting more dangerous... but I doubt it.

So yes.. Now I would do it again. And I am glad that I went to a smaller community first before coming to the Capital since it was much easier for me to meet people and make friends with them so that I felt that I really had a bit of a support structure in place when I made the move to the Big City.

 

[william webster]

right WW,
and the OP related the leaving or staying to a increasing Crime Rate in DR.
so we should stick to the OP/Topic of a theme.
who left or is planning to leave due a increased Crime Rate in DR during the last 10 years???
and also Who will stay with or without a increasing Crime rate??
and also related to that Topic:
does the DR have a increasing Crime Rate compared to the rest of the Globe???
Mike

All of those are good questions Michael, but the OP simply asked "Would you do it again?" Your questions are extras .... corollaries.

The corollaries are all good questions too..... proceed with them.

Threads develop with the help of people like you..

WW

 

[william webster]

Due to the increasing crime rate in the DR and some of it being perpetrated on ex-pats with extremely violent consequences, I am curious as to the answers to the following question:

Expats that made the Dominican Republic their full time home 3 or more years ago.

Would you do it now?

Here it is again....... one simple question..

"Would you do it now?"

WW

 

[BushBaby]

Here it is again....... one simple question..

"Would you do it now?"

WW

I understand the 'simple question' WW but I really do think it needs a couple of ancillary provisos
"If you had the knowledge about the country you now have ........"
OR
"If you were to come with the same level of knowledge & preparation you first came with......."

If the former then undoubtedly (& ignoring any/all other criteria to crime & violence) YES I would.

If my knowledge was limited to research on the web & a couple of holidays, probably not as the English speaking media does not do justice to the true safety of the country ....... which generally equates with the safety of my country of origin! ~ Grahame.

 

[Lambada]

Our crime rate in Puerto Plata seemed to surge at the end of 2006-2007 with regard to rival drug groups exterminating each other on the street. Interestingly this was shortly after Fiscal Ceballos in Sosua was taken out by law enforcement from Santo Domingo. By 2008 that seemed to decrease, or they moved further down the coast to Sosua & Cabarete, or the crimes changed to home robbery, or General Then was making himself felt but my perception is that the street shootouts over puntos, certainly in PP is far less now that 3 years ago. And when we take the dogs for their late night walk, we hear far less of the musical background of intercambios than we used to.

Other types of crime might well be up, robberies for example.

When we arrived here the DR was altogether a kinder, gentler, no-crack-in-the-barrios country so we luckily have had many years in which to observe the changes and educate ourselves on handling them.

Here it is again....... one simple question..

"Would you do it now?"

WW

With the knowledge I have now, yes, unhesitatingly. Would I do it with the little knowledge I had 18 years ago? H'mmm. But the answer is probably 'yes' because I wouldn't be aware of what I didn't know.............:cheeky:

Bingo, BushBaby and I didn't know you were posting until after I had...

 

[MikeFisher]

Clash of culture, my arse. We are certainly coming from different backgrounds and I don't think any of my american friends in USA would call a sosua hooker their sister. You are just culture-less and devoid of any family values. I often thought, what kind of families these porn stars have? Where do they come from? Now I think I am beginning to understand.
Reading what you wrote, I certainly pray to god your sons and grandchildren marry up hookers, and motoconcho guys. Then you will be proud to exhibit your american values to everyone who are just like you.
American-british values, hahahaha. yeah right. tell that to someone else who is from katmandu, not to me. I know different kind of americans and they certainly don't share your mentality.
AZB

Bite my Tongue,
been really close to agree at least a lil bit with ya this Time,
but Noap.
what is a Sosua Hooker here on the Isle can easily be a US american mid class family daughter on the other side of the River,
a drug small cases trafficking or/and using Cocaine user can be the Motoconcho guy down here and the same the Son of a B>>$$ of a US mid class Family over there, and like we all know very well, often are.
and that's not any kinda US american bashing, the same Valid for a German mid and even high class family, for the Queen's Land on Da North and for every place else,
I mentioned it as US american only because AZB is always claiming that his "good roots" and education come from that side of the Pond.
Hey,
I am myself born in Germany,
raised with brits in the mid East, that's where the passports come from,
'traveled'/worked Latin America,
I spent over 6 Years in the USA without the need to work for a living there(just to have a good Time with some collegues who not been from the European Side) before I came down here to the Isle,
I am a bad mannered basta$d, Yes,
I also passed without any probs all visited schools til highest degrees as a electrotechnician at Univercity, darn, those countries paid me well enough for the need of my services so I could retire by the ole age of 30 in the DR, just 16 years after the early received scholarship, MY decision.
did My education make me a better behaving Person?
I don't think so, even that Mom is proud on her eldest and Dad would shoot ya just for answering 'wrong',
am I a Hooker addict due my working class Birth?
I guess No, at least til today I did not feel much interest in that kinda Life.

the Hookers and Drug Idiot$ and low brainers you will find throuout all the social classes of this Globe, doesn't matter what family they been born in to, doesn't matter what schools they visited,
unless their Parents take care of their growing up from the beginning and take care that something 'good' will come out of the breed, nothing valuable will happen.

Mountainannie has Her Way,
a Way I like a lot,
your Way AZB is different and will never go along with other 'ways',
it is Your Choice to stick with classes over your own born-in-class and feel good on that, everybody is free to do so, and it is Annie's Way to care about the people of this world.
believe me or not,
we need both on the Planet,
the Ones who really Care
and also the Ones Who show us the bad and ugly by Not Caring.

otherwise there would not be any Balance.

no Balance,
No Life

 

[aarhus]

Our crime rate in Puerto Plata seemed to surge at the end of 2006-2007 with regard to rival drug groups exterminating each other on the street. Interestingly this was shortly after Fiscal Ceballos in Sosua was taken out by law enforcement from Santo Domingo. By 2008 that seemed to decrease, or they moved further down the coast to Sosua & Cabarete, or the crimes changed to home robbery, or General Then was making himself felt but my perception is that the street shootouts over puntos, certainly in PP is far less now that 3 years ago. And when we take the dogs for their late night walk, we hear far less of the musical background of intercambios than we used to.

Other types of crime might well be up, robberies for example.

When we arrived here the DR was altogether a kinder, gentler, no-crack-in-the-barrios country so we luckily have had many years in which to observe the changes and educate ourselves on handling them.



With the knowledge I have now, yes, unhesitatingly. Would I do it with the little knowledge I had 18 years ago? H'mmm. But the answer is probably 'yes' because I wouldn't be aware of what I didn't know.............:cheeky:

Bingo, BushBaby and I didn't know you were posting until after I had...

Yes that is also how I see it. I may not have gone to Cuba and then here to DR if I had planned it better. But I still have not regretted it. And I may end up concluding that is was the best thing I ever did. I did not even know about the DR before I went to Cuba. I learned about the DR in Cuba talking to other foreigners. Then I travelled here a few times and decided to stay. Regarding crime going to DR from Cuba is like going from a frying pan into a fire. But of course Cuba is only safe because there is a pliceman on every corner. A Danish friend I had in Cuba was just here on a visit and for business. He left Cuba 2 years ago. I left 4 years ago. Since he has travelled a lot to Nicaragua/Guatamala/Honduras for business. He lives in Mexico with his wife. He thought the DR was much safer than any of those countries.