Do expats feel accepted by Dominicans?

[Lambada]

Lambada, don't let a few fragile egos bother you. I think the majority on dr1 are interested in knowing as much as they can about life here, and it is important for them to understand the changes that have taken place over the years. If people make dumb comments, that is their problem, not ours.

OK I'll be back later. Just off to see the latest horror movie in Puerto Plata. :ermm: Did they have a cinema anywhere near you when you first arrived? Daft question probably.............

The movie is called Depletion Of The Expat GenePool. Gringo & I colloborated on the screenplay...............:laugh: :laugh:

 

[jackieboo]

OK I'll be back later. Just off to see the latest horror movie in Puerto Plata. :ermm: Did they have a cinema anywhere near you when you first arrived? Daft question probably.............

The movie is called Depletion Of The Expat GenePool. Gringo & I colloborated on the screenplay...............:laugh: :laugh:

I thought it was a double feature.....

The second movie being a heart wrenching drama called 'On the Golden School Bus'.

If I'm not mistaken it stars Henry Sofondapast and Kathreen Hepmeimburnt.

.......: terrible acting, but a real tear jerker.

 

[CFA123]

Acceptance to me means that when I go in to a store I?m treated and given the same respect as any other customer, it means that when I engage a person I?m not patronized or made to feel like an outsider.

Assimilation to me means that one lives as a Dominican.

I think this is a very valid point, although to me assmilation means you're largely indistinguishable from the population at large.

While I felt accepted in Santiago, I would never suggest I was assimilated into the community. I think very few are whose cultural upbringing and first language wasn't Spanish.

Much easier, I think, to assimilate into a diverse cultural environment such as the U.S. A Dominican moving to the U.S., for example, can and eventually will be considered a full member of the 'American' society even though they are of foreign birth. In contrast, I suspect there are few gringos in DR who are ever considered to be truly Dominican no matter how long they've lived in DR.

Anyone who's claimed acceptance in this thread also feel they've truly been assimilated into the Dominican community?

 

[Squat]

Anyone who's claimed acceptance in this thread also feel they've truly been assimilated into the Dominican community?

Well, no... And I honestly don't want to... I now live in a "gringo infested area", and it suits me just fine... I had my years away from that, but the truth is, as much as spanish is not a problem, I am happier when I can engage in more interesting conversations (in any language)...

I am more satisfied talking to other westerners, as they have more to say... With most Dominicans (sorry guys, don't want to generalize...) it is always the same pointless basic conversations, with primitive sense of humor, and primitive views on everything...

Back in the days, I use to socialize a whole lot more with dominicans, but it was either in Luperon or in Santiago... Now I don't really feel like doing it anymore... Maybe it is because of the Saman?/LT mentality...

I am very happy down here, and I respect the locals. I deal with them often, but I don't socialize a great deal anymore with them...

 

[keepitsimple]

Much easier, I think, to assimilate into a diverse cultural environment such as the U.S. A Dominican moving to the U.S., for example, can and eventually will be considered a full member of the 'American' society even though they are of foreign birth. In contrast, I suspect there are few gringos in DR who are ever considered to be truly Dominican no matter how long they've lived in DR.

Man I couldn't have said it better myself ! But hey even thats ok as long as I'm accepted enough so that when I go into a store I'm not being over charged because of my accent .

I sure big reason that alot of us are on this board is that we secretly crave westren conversation ,hell why is that a bad thing? Its like some people would want us to be closet Expats.

Keepitsimple

 

[Lambada]

Anyone who's claimed acceptance in this thread also feel they've truly been assimilated into the Dominican community?

Is it 'been assimilated' or is it 'assimilate oneself'? Either way for me the answer would be no and I don't see how it could be done in a society which is not culturally pluralistic. I think assimilation conjures up notions of integration into the host culture i.e. all part of one culture, whereas what I think the 'acceptance' question with which Chip started, is more about is accomodation i.e. us expats modifying our behaviour to adapt to living in the DR.

I don't want to divert this thread but it would be interesting to hear the views of Dominicans living in non-Dominican cultures because in a sense it is the other side of the same coin.

 

[CFA123]

Is it 'been assimilated' or is it 'assimilate oneself'?

When I wrote that I knew the wording was awkward & thought you might call me on it. A little later I also realized I had misspelled it as well! aranoid:

...it would be interesting to hear the views of Dominicans living in non-Dominican cultures because in a sense it is the other side of the same coin.

Agreed.

 

[cobraboy]

What's the difference between a gringo living around other gringos in the DR, and Dominicans living around other Dominicans in the US.

We associate with those we feel most comfortable with.

Seems to me the DR is a much more "closed" society than the US or other Western societies are. Much harder to enter the mainstream.

 

[Ken]

Did they have a cinema anywhere near you when you first arrived?

Yes, there was one in Samana when I arrived in 1986. Old equipment that didn't always work. Going to one of the films was like going to a Saturday matinee when I was a young boy. The audience would should, cheer and boo the action and throw things at the screen. It was more fun to watch the audience than the crappy films they showed.

jackieboo, I like your definition of acceptance. I don't feel I have gone native, so to speak, I feel like I am accepted.

Lambada, in an earlier post you agreeed with my comment about when living in Samana during my early years here that I was living a life similar to that in the US in the old days by reporting what your grandmother told you about neighborliness in the 50s. The fifties was not what I had in mind I was thinking about the "really" old days. I know this dates me, but I graduated from high school in 1950, spent 4 years in the military during the Korean War and got married. The 50s are not the old days to me.:cheeky:

 

[marliejaneca]

This is what I meant by...

assimilate:

8. to conform or adjust to the customs, attitudes, etc., of a group, nation, or the like: The new arrivals assimilated easily and quickly.

So when I said this:

I could be wrong, but I also tend to think for an ex-pat to become accepted, they would have to first assimilate themselves in the Dominican way of life. At least, that is how I felt when I moved to the DR.

I should have said:

I could be wrong, but I also tend to think for an ex-pat to become accepted, they would have to first assimilate themselves to the Dominican way of life. At least, that is how I felt when I moved to the DR.

Sorry Chip00 - I know that you are talking about acceptance, but I had to explain myself !

Marlie

 

[Chip00]

Is it 'been assimilated' or is it 'assimilate oneself'? Either way for me the answer would be no and I don't see how it could be done in a society which is not culturally pluralistic. I think assimilation conjures up notions of integration into the host culture i.e. all part of one culture, whereas what I think the 'acceptance' question with which Chip started, is more about is accomodation i.e. us expats modifying our behaviour to adapt to living in the DR....

Part of the intention of my original question was to see if expats had been made to feel as outsiders by the locals and I think the majority answer is no. The question wasn't meant to imply if discarding one's "western(for lack of a better term)" thinking and likes/dislikes in order to be part of the Dominican society was thought to be necessary.

I think a lot of people agree that there are many things lacking in this society that we crave, such as critical thinking, healthy debates, efficient systems, relative transparency in gov't politics that aren't necesarily valued to the same degree as in our society and for that we like to associate with others who have the same interests and for that reason so many enjoy coming to this forum.

In summary it appears that to be accepted doesn't or shouldn't mean that one has to discard all likes/dislikes and certain ways of thinking only that one may have to add or modify some to be accepted.

 

[jackieboo]

In summary it appears that to be accepted doesn't or shouldn't mean that one has to discard all likes/dislikes and certain ways of thinking only that one may have to add or modify some to be accepted.

Well said...

 

[cobraboy]

Part of the intention of my original question was to see if expats had been made to feel as outsiders by the locals and I think the majority answer is no.

Being made to "feel" an outsider is very different from ~them~ thinking you are an outsider, or acting toward you as an outsider in your presence. Dominicans, overall, aren't particularly confrontational bunch with "outsiders". They are a cordial bunch of folks in general.

Like I posted before, there are different levels of acceptance. Being warm and cordial as neighbors is entirely different than then wanting "outsiders" to participate in the criticism of their politics, culture and society.

I can call my sister ugly. I can be very cordial toward you as a neighbor and acquaintance. But don't think for a moment YOU can call my sister ugly.

Apples and oranges.

 

[Lambada]

Lambada, in an earlier post you agreeed with my comment about when living in Samana during my early years here that I was living a life similar to that in the US in the old days by reporting what your grandmother told you about neighborliness in the 50s. The fifties was not what I had in mind I was thinking about the "really" old days. I know this dates me, but I graduated from high school in 1950, spent 4 years in the military during the Korean War and got married. The 50s are not the old days to me.:cheeky:

Nor me Yes I mentioned my grandmother but I think it was Chip who mentioned the 50s. My grandmother's early life in Ireland was in the 1860's, she died in the 1960's when I was in my early twenties, so I'm catching up with you fast Ken. :cheeky:

Getting back to Chip's point about how much we may or may not have discarded/ modified/ added to our ways of doing things, could I ask an adjunct question? How much have people retained a way of doing things themselves whilst happily adapting to the more local way? For example, although it took a little while initially I now never expect punctuality when I have an appointment with a Dominican (although sometimes I'm surprised ). However, I still tend to turn up relatively on time, more or less, myself. Others' lateness stopped being a problem for me years ago yet I still am fairly well on time myself. Anyone else? Or any other examples of adaptation to a local way whilst retaining one's own ingrained methods?

 

[Squat]

How much have people retained a way of doing things themselves whilst happily adapting to the more local way? For example, although it took a little while initially I now never expect punctuality when I have an appointment with a Dominican (although sometimes I'm surprised ). However, I still tend to turn up relatively on time, more or less, myself. Others' lateness stopped being a problem for me years ago yet I still am fairly well on time myself. Anyone else? Or any other examples of adaptation to a local way whilst retaining one's own ingrained methods?

Same here... I am much more laid-back, since I don't expect things to work as planned... Then every once in a while, I am up for a pleasant surprise, because things did work as planned !!! It is rare, still...

 

[Ken]

I think lateness is one you have to accept quickly if you are going to make it as an ex-pat. Also, no point in noticing the lack of squared corners in the construction of your house and apartment. That seems to be how things are done here.

One trait of many Dominicans I refuse to accept is pushing in ahead of me in line. It may not change anything, but I make a loud,vocal protest. Likewise, if I am one of 4 persons in the back seat of a publico and the driver tries to squeeze in a 5th person, I make it clear that I am not going to squeeze over to make room, even though Dominicans seem to accept this abuse without protest. (In these instances, the looks I get from similarly abused Dominicans makes me think they like me to protest)

Something else that you must adjust to quickly is the fact that if you see something in the store that you are likely to need soon, you better buy it while you can. There is a good chance the store won't have it when you need it.

 

[jackieboo]

You're right some things have really taken getting used to...

I've adjusted to most everything and now I have very little expectations and get surprised all the time.

The is one thing that I still have a problem with.... High beams at night...and yes I understand about the roads and the fact that many of the cars have tinted front windscreens....

So about a week after I arrived I went to Puerto Plata and and had two 'big daddy' spot lights put on my Jeepta. Now when I'm blinded it's a two way street (literally)!

 

[Matilda]

I am the same re lateness, I accept it now even though I am always on time myself. In our house we have two time zones. When my husband calls to say he will be 20 minutes he always states if it is 20 dominican minutes or 20 english minutes. 20 english minutes is half an hour and 20 dominincan minutes is up to 3 hours. One of the problems is that dominicans have no idea how long a minute is. 5 minutes is usually up to an hour and 20 minutes up to 3 hours!!!! It is never longer than 20 minutes even if it will be half a day!!

And I am slowly getting less wound up about all the scratches t our new ish camionetta. In the UK I would go ballistic. Here it has been hit by 2 motoconchos and numerous cars in cars parks and I am pretty sanguine about it.

As a generalisation taking care of things doesn't apply here - and I am slowly getting less wound up about that. And I hate to say it, but as I can't shout I do occasionally do the dreaded pssssssss when I want to get someone's attention! Sorry!!!!!! I hate it too.

Matilda

 

[Gringo]

One trait of many Dominicans I refuse to accept is pushing in ahead of me in line. It may not change anything, but I make a loud,vocal protest.

Ken, you have been here a few weeks just like me.........You can not change this trait.

I go through this almost every day
and It is not going to stop soon.

I have found that even when you take a ticket there is someone in front of you asking for service. When my number comes up I yell "BINGO" and that gets a good laugh from every one and I get served.

You have been here long enough to know you can't beat the system so go with the flow!

Only my theory and I stand to be corrected............

 

[Ken]

I have found that even when you take a ticket there is someone in front of you asking for service. When my number comes up I yell "BINGO" and that gets a good laugh from every one and I get served.

You have been here long enough to know you can't beat the system so go with the flow!

Only my theory and I stand to be corrected............

Gringo, you are not going with the flow any more than I am. By calling "bingo", your are asserting your right to be served next. If you were going with the flow you would wait until somebody waited on you.