The "NORTH SHORE", Is Coming BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!

[cobraboy]

There are no such things as "comparables" in the DR from my research. The folks/sages who preach "live here for at least 5 months before you buy" are wise, indeed.

My experience says that renting/leasing in the DR has significant advantages over buying in many cases anyway...

 

[sylindr]

lmao....that road to costambar has been resurfaced at LEAST once a year since i have been going there....that is nothing new....just wait for the next rainy season and we will be back to square one...until they deal with the drainage problem it will never be fixed

 

[snowbird44]

You are absolutely right about the importance of the location. Every single piece of real estate does have a value though but owners know nothing about the correlation between the location and the value of their property. Without the honest knowledge of a real estate agent, owners will only guestimate the value, often inflate.
If the agent inflates the price then, he is the problem. That is why I said those people had the wrong agent.

To answer another question:
No, I do not know a good agent here. It seems like the local brokerage industry is milking the pre-construction inventory like crazy at the moment. Not a surprise as it is the easiest thing to sell in the world.
Why bother going after exclusive listings!!

Exclusive listings? That the whole problem. If they had a system here where all the agents could share like in a multiple listing service, agents might be willing to share their listings with buyer agents. Just a thought, but this is a little revolutionary since all Real Estate transactions are completely unmonitored and you don't know who you get.

 

[AK74]

For me it has always been a total mistery why expats who relocate to Dominican Republic in their fifties-sixties buy houses. I have no explanation.

With the current huge inventory of rental properties and very low rent to pay artificially inflated astronomical prices for homes or condos, why? To see any substantial saving of purchase over rent those folks will have to live until 110-120 at least. Will they?

At most they will stay in this country for ten-fifteen years and then being in their seventies-eighties will have to relocate back to US or GB for a better healthcare that they will need by then or to go back to work due to inflation and corporate greed eating up their fixed retirement benefits.

A simple arithmetics show that financially or logically purchase vs rent makes no sense at all.

On the other hand those Russian guys in their thirties-early forties with their quick made millions are a different story. They will live in their houses in Sosua Village for thirty-forty or fifty years. And for them coming back to their country is out of the question under no circumstances. They know that. So for them buying is the right thing.

Indeed, Dominican Republic is a country of misterious and unexplainable human actions , logics, decisions and events.

!Camarera, una mas cerveza, por favor!

Exclusive listings? That the whole problem. If they had a system here where all the agents could share like in a multiple listing service, agents might be willing to share their listings with buyer agents. Just a thought, but this is a little revolutionary since all Real Estate transactions are completely unmonitored and you don't know who you get.

 

[Lambada]

AK74, there are those expats who have made this land their home, who intend staying here until they die (hopefully of old age ) and who then intend the property to become part of a foundation devoted to helping the indigenous population in one way or another. It isn't all about taking out or making savings by renting. Sometimes it's about putting back in.

 

[AK74]

AK74, there are those expats who have made this land their home, who intend staying here until they die (hopefully of old age ) and who then intend the property to become part of a foundation devoted to helping the indigenous population in one way or another. It isn't all about taking out or making savings by renting. Sometimes it's about putting back in.

good point. counts.

 

[catcherintherye]

Everyone has a different way of looking at their investment in a home. If, as AK74 points out, one is looking just for a place to stay for 5-10-15 years and re-retire back home, then perhaps renting is a logical option. But for those who have done the math, and know the consequences for staying here for life, then buying is absolutely the right thing for them. They will have equity to leave their children, to do with as they wish. For many of us, this is the place we have chosen to live and die. It is inevertible that dying will occur. I for one do not wish to artificially extend it in some north-side nursing home, thanks. When the time comes I want to be warm and moving. I'll take my chances here, in the place of my choosing.

 

[rio2003]

Renting v Buying at a "certain age"

For me it has always been a total mistery why expats who relocate to Dominican Republic in their fifties-sixties buy houses. I have no explanation.

With the current huge inventory of rental properties and very low rent to pay artificially inflated astronomical prices for homes or condos, why? !Camarera, una mas cerveza, por favor!

Very interesting observation AK74 - As my working years begin to show an end in sight (!) I have certainly been contemplating buying a place over on the North Coast but I do agree it is a major capital outlay for what could possibly be only 10 - 25 years. There is also the hassle of dealing with the property in the event of my demise for which my family (non DR visitors) would not thank me for giving to them.

I honestly hadn't considered long term renting as a viable option - silly really, considering I have lived there and done it twice before. In the UK we are conditioned to thinking that we must buy property rather than rent it and coupled with my Dominican friends forever saying "comprar un apartamento" I have always had that at the back of my mind.

My thoughts are changing......

Presidente para mi tambien, gracias!


:laugh:

 

[DRob]

AK74 does make a good point. Generally, the financial analysis for owning vs. renting breaks down into three general categories. Ownership often makes sense if you wish to:

live in the house long enough for the CBA to be in your favor usually between 7-20 years, depending on tax treatment, transaction costs (the cost of buying and subsequently selling the house), and home appreciation/depreciation;

receive favorable tax treatment (meaning interest and home office deductions, popular in the U.S.); and

have something of value to leave to others when your time comes.


I don't know whether interest on mortgages are deductible in the DR, though I suspect not, as the interest rates are sky high, LTV is very low, and true mortgages are a bit of a rarity over here (actually, that would be a good thread, discussing why, prior to the lending crisis, Dominican banks have been hesitant to lend money for long terms at reasonable rates for homes).

 

[catcherintherye]

DRob, I understand your point, and in strictly economic and financial terms no one could argue. However there are considerations beyond strict economics. The satisfaction and security of ownership are intangibles, which some might take into consideration. The ability to create something, even the humble gratification of redoing a condo for example, makes owning an attractive option for me. If all I wanted is a place to live, without the hassle of ownership, then I would definately rent. But, for me at least, I like the feeling of being able to do what I want to do with the place I am living.

 

[John Evans]

isnt rental money just dead money whereas a property you own will always be worth something to your survivors

 

[retiree]

I agree with catcherintherye. When I am renting it feels like somebody else's home and when I own it is my home. I can renovate, decorate and have comfortable furniture (I have rarely heard of a rental with comfortable furniture). It is a quality of life issue.

 

[cobraboy]

isnt rental money just dead money whereas a property you own will always be worth something to your survivors

Not necessarily.

There are many variables that go into the equation. One must analyze the total real cost of owning or renting, and factor in the opportunity income from capital if one rents.

It also depends upon the area.

The key factor to me is not having clear, perfect knowledge of the DR real estate market, and RE law. A mistake could be extremely costly. One axiom I have always used in RE analysis: if it's easy to buy, it'll be really hard to sell. The horror stories I hear about buying property in the DR seem to be more on the selling side than the buying side (scams and bad, crooked lawyers aside). Because there are no real comps around, generally speaking, it would be really easy to overpay out of emotional exuberance, and comparing the local market to the one "back home"..

But I also agree about the intangible benefits in "pride of ownership".

 

[rio2003]

Renting v Buying?

isnt rental money just dead money whereas a property you own will always be worth something to your survivors

In the UK definitely, because rents are so high, but I would have to weigh up the pros and cons of renting or buying if and when I seriously am looking at relocating (again) to the DR.

If there is a capital sum to be invested perhaps it would be better to look at a home for it in the UK where it will still be there to be passed on to my kith and kin without the hassle of them having to sell something on the other side of the Atlantic. From what I read on this board properties can take quite a while to sell - it would be empty in that time. Security? (please dont recommend any new local firms - LOL) ?

I could then use the interest to enjoy my hard earned retirement in the DR.
Perhaps? (daydreaming at this point)

:cheeky: Rio

 

[rio2003]

I agree with catcherintherye. When I am renting it feels like somebody else's home and when I own it is my home. I can renovate, decorate and have comfortable furniture (I have rarely heard of a rental with comfortable furniture). It is a quality of life issue.

I have never rented anywhere WITH furniture in the DR. I have painted apartments to my taste, furnished and negotiated a fair priced long term rent. I can also move a lot quicker if need be.



Rio

 

[DRob]

Not necessarily.

There are many variables that go into the equation. One must analyze the total real cost of owning or renting, and factor in the opportunity income from capital if one rents.

It also depends upon the area.

The key factor to me is not having clear, perfect knowledge of the DR real estate market, and RE law. A mistake could be extremely costly. One axiom I have always used in RE analysis: if it's easy to buy, it'll be really hard to sell. The horror stories I hear about buying property in the DR seem to be more on the selling side than the buying side (scams and bad, crooked lawyers aside). Because there are no real comps around, generally speaking, it would be really easy to overpay out of emotional exuberance, and comparing the local market to the one "back home"..

But I also agree about the intangible benefits in "pride of ownership".

Well said, Cobra.

 

[AK74]

isnt rental money just dead money whereas a property you own will always be worth something to your survivors

It will not be worth anything to your survivors. When you pass away and your home is empty it will be looted within a week. By dominicans and by your fellow expats neighbours. Again I can present you numerous examples. Everything is looted. Including doors, window frames, light fixtures, inverters and toilets.

You will do much better to your children with giving them high quality education so they make good money themselves and not be vitally interested in your shack in the middle of nowhere that they will never be able to sell or to live in.

In DR you are totally unprotected and defenseless. Against crime, RE agents - predators, lawyers, corrupted police and government. And the older you are - the more unprotected and defenseless. An unbelievably easy target to get easy money. Leave your savings in NY or London banks better.

The only possibility to leave Dominican Republic with a million is - to come here with ten millions first.

(I say "you", "yours" etc not meanning you personally but as a general reference. All this equally applies to myself too.)

 

[rio2003]

It will not be worth anything to your survivors. When you pass away and your home is empty it will be looted within a week. By dominicans and by your fellow expats neighbours. Again I can present you numerous examples. Everything is looted. Including doors, window frames, light fixtures, inverters and toilets.

You will do much better to your children with giving them high quality education so they make good money themselves and not be vitally interested in your shack in the middle of nowhere that they will never be able to sell or to live in.

In DR you are totally unprotected and defenseless. Against crime, RE agents - predators, lawyers, corrupted police and government. And the older you are - the more unprotected and defenseless. An unbelievably easy target to get easy money. Leave your savings in NY or London banks better.

The only possibility to leave Dominican Republic with a million is - to come here with ten millions first.

(I say "you", "yours" etc not meanning you personally but as a general reference. All this equally applies to myself too.)

There is a lot of truth in what you say AK74.

Rio

 

[catcherintherye]

I think it is a good idea to keep in mind those possibilities AK74 describes. I'm sure those things have happened, and will happen again.

However,that is not not to say the worst case scenario happens in every instance. Knowing the possibilities offers you (collective 'you', as was AK74's) the opportunity to circumvent some of those pit-falls. Just as the best-case scenario would be foolhearty to assume, one should not be defeated by assuming the worst-case in inevitable.

As with everything, one should hope for the best and prepare for the worst.

 

[DavidZ]

It will not be worth anything to your survivors. When you pass away and your home is empty it will be looted within a week. By dominicans and by your fellow expats neighbours. Again I can present you numerous examples. Everything is looted. Including doors, window frames, light fixtures, inverters and toilets.

You will do much better to your children with giving them high quality education so they make good money themselves and not be vitally interested in your shack in the middle of nowhere that they will never be able to sell or to live in.

In DR you are totally unprotected and defenseless. Against crime, RE agents - predators, lawyers, corrupted police and government. And the older you are - the more unprotected and defenseless. An unbelievably easy target to get easy money. Leave your savings in NY or London banks better.

The only possibility to leave Dominican Republic with a million is - to come here with ten millions first.

(I say "you", "yours" etc not meanning you personally but as a general reference. All this equally applies to myself too.)

Why do so many people, basically a core group of posters here, constantly feel the need to scare people away from this country or at a minimum, paint it in such a bad light?

I am sure the VAST majority of people who would consider buying a home here to retire will do quite a bit of researcjh, or at the very least spend enough time here to decide where they feel comfortable purchasing, given the pros and cons of that area.

To infer the moment you pass away, you're house will be looted...by locals, and ex-pats alike (!?!) is ludicrous. Sure...maybe...if you live in a non-secured community, and die suddenly...with no friends, neighbors who know you, homeowner's association, lawyers, etc... *maybe* the WORST CASE SCENARIO would happen. But to think someone would make zero plans for what becomes of their property when they are not there to take care of it is silly.

And to suggest that leaving your money in a US or European bank will ultimately provide a better long-term return on your investment, than a well-chosen home in the Dominican Republic, is equally laughable.

I don't know anyone, including myself, who would try to paint the DR as anything close to perfect or 100% safe, or a "sure-bet" investment-wise, but come on... lighten up on the doom and gloom... this place is pretty damn nice!!! Go scare the people who are trying to find a place to retire in the US real estate market...or London's for that matter.