The Structure Of A Barrio

Mar 21, 2002
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Snuffy, good thread. The barrios are alive with life and America is as sterile as a hospital. Isolation is the norm in the US. People meet their future spouse through match.com instead of actually going outdoors and meeting in person.

Don't worry Snuffy, the barrio will be here as long as we are alive.
 

dv8

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Sep 27, 2006
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am i a leper?

in poland i lived in a huge block of flats. five separate entrances, eight storeys high, 36 flats in each entrance. built by russians, as an answer to the housing problem. in 20 years i did not find out the names of people that lived in the same entrance, save for the families of kids i went to school with. i do not mention folks living in other entrances, i don't think i could even recognize their faces. faces of my generation - yes, we all used to play outside, communism, you know, no games other than cheap board ones or chess, no computers, no electricity, and even if there was - no cartoons. the answer to the shortage of living space was... well... short. my family of four lived on 41 sq meters, two rooms, kitchen, bathroom, toilet. my biggest dream was MORE SPACE.

i will honestly say, i did not care about my neighbours and i still don't. i am not a very social person, one could even say i am socially impaired. as i grew up i managed to learn the basic social behaviour, some form of mimicry. i do participate in all the social occasions with my new family, i dress and behave accordingly. but all this friendliness is foreign to me.

on the rare occasions when we drive through the barrio first thing i notice is people. they are outside. they walk. they sit outside, do their washing outside, eat outside. in the rich people quarters you see none of that. it's empty, save for the armed security guy on a single chair. and i prefer that. i hate people prying into my things, knocking at my door to chat. can't they see there is a reason why i keep my doors shut and locked? that's because i don't WANT visitors. and then, there is the music. very loud, always. i don't like music much, maybe because i am completely tone deaf, i can live without it, thank you very much.

one thing is miss about life in a big city is a sense of anonymity. of being just a face in a crowd. being oudeis.

yes, barrios are interesting and colourful. but i'd prefer to see all this on tv than have it outside my door.
 

Celt202

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May 22, 2004
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one thing is miss about life in a big city is a sense of anonymity. of being just a face in a crowd. being oudeis.

yes, barrios are interesting and colourful. but i'd prefer to see all this on tv than have it outside my door.

oudeis..........I like it

I think that is one of the positives of living in big city for many. You can pursue your interests without having to endure nosy neighbors. We can romanticize small town life but American cities are full of people who have fled the small towns. We can romanticize barrio life but many who live in barrios are yearning to get out.

my 2 złoty
 
Sep 19, 2005
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well...if you have nothing, and little money...you live in one of those small houses lined up close, where everyone is so friendly....they dont steal from you, because YOU HAVE NOTHING TO STEAL!!!!!...so no one threatens you.....if you get some money and want to improve your life by having more space in your house, and more things in the yard....you have to MOVE...because those houses are not built where the houses are 30 feet from each other...NOW people know you have money and maybe things...so you are a target....but you KNOW that..so you build the house far from the perimiter of the lot.. and you build a wall. and you put bars on the windows.....because you are smart enough to know, that everyone else knows you have something......how do you get out of that cycle...YOU CANT.

because the people who are lazy, and wont or cant work.....COULD be nice to you if you have nothing they want...BUT as soon as you do...you are a target.

everybody loves johnny...he never locked his doors and no one ever stole is crackers in the barren cubbard... and no one ever stole his 20 year old motor scooter that seldom ran.....but now you have a refridgerator full of food and a new TV, and a new stereo, and you have a new toyota cambry... and some cash in your pocket......now poor old "buddy" may just think you OWE him something...or you can afford to get robbed...heck you dont NEED all that stuff

and the kicker is you only need a half of one percent of the population to be this type of lazy careless thief........to ruin it for everyone...because you DONT KNOW who he is.....

MAYBE thats why it looks so peaceful in the Barrios......

just an opinion

bob
 

Snuffy

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May 3, 2002
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For DV8...I would say the dire isolation of life growing up has made him more comfortable with the isolation that the modern world has to offer. I grew up in a small southern town. We played outside all day long with the neighborhood, until as Texas Bill said, we were called in. We had huge fields in which to play football, fly a kite, etc. I am a product of that and so when I see the isolating...it bothers me...not so much for myself...but it is something that I consider moreso for my children. I know that if you grow up in a healthy social environment you have more an opportunity to be a happy person. Indeed, I believe that even if they may think they want to flee the barrio...they are happier for living in it. They sure look happy. Something gives them those big smiles. You can have your sterile city life. And they fled the small town USA...many...out of necessity...to find a job. That is normally what moving to the city is about...chasing a job. Of course the suburbs of the USA are no different anymore. In fact, in many areas you will not find sidewalks. That cuts down on people walking. They gotta have the car. Get in car with tinted windows, put on sunglasses, drive down road and don't wave to a soul, oh yea...there are no souls to wave to.
 

Snuffy

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May 3, 2002
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laura...that is part of the question. What is better, to have all this stuff and need to isolate in order to protect it....or not have it....and have the healthy socialization of living close together? Do we need all that stuff? Are we aware of what is happening to us? When we go inside and turn on the TV or computer versus sitting outside in the front lawn or playing a game of catch or dominoes...do we realize what is occurring? We don't appear to be in control of what is happening to us...it is just happening and we are being pulled along?
 

Snuffy

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May 3, 2002
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So I want to design a big expat barrio. There will be a small zocalo and in this zocalo will be a couple food stands, a hair salon, a barber shop, a colmado, and lots of places to sit. And the houses will be small but nice and they will be close together and all surround the zocalo. You have to park in front of your house. Each house has a porch that you can sit out on. You look out over the zocalo and at the other houses. You walk to the colmado or the food stand and interact with other neighbors. It is designed for interaction...for seeing your neighbors.
 

Camden Tom

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Dec 1, 2002
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So I want to design a big expat barrio. There will be a small zocalo and in this zocalo will be a couple food stands, a hair salon, a barber shop, a colmado, and lots of places to sit. And the houses will be small but nice and they will be close together and all surround the zocalo. You have to park in front of your house. Each house has a porch that you can sit out on. You look out over the zocalo and at the other houses. You walk to the colmado or the food stand and interact with other neighbors. It is designed for interaction...for seeing your neighbors.

Interesting concept, I like it. Don't forget to include a kick a$$ BBQ joint.
 

dv8

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Sep 27, 2006
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why the cage?

we have plans for the house. i dream about BIG windows. lots of light, let the wind in. minovio says big windows are out. big windows mean the thieves can get in. i say, i hate those tiny holes in walls people here call ventanas, with those small panels of dark glass, behind thick bars. minovio says bars are necessity, bars are against thieves. i say, in europe we have rich people too, they also have houses. guess what, those houses have big, BIG windows, with no bars. and we have thieves too, plenty of them. we also have freaks who will break into your house to hurt you for fun, to torture, to mutilate, to kill. yet still, no bars and big windows.
why is here different? why, if poor juan in a barrio has nothing, he still puts those bloody bars in? why people make their houses look like prisons? why even in the poorest of barrios people are caged in, like animals?
maybe i just have a bad day. is there always someone poorer than juan who lives in his barrio cage, someone to whom juan's 20 pesos is live-or-die?
 

cobraboy

Pro-Bono Demolition Hobbyist
Jul 24, 2004
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IMO, the loss of the "small town" social mentality in the US went with the advent of several things:

-increase of taxes necessitating both parents working to support the kind of home that one working parent used to be able to support

-the destruction of the "local" school via busing. Parents can no longer be part of the school community, with parents and teachers living close by. When I was a kid, the schools were a common focal point for ALL families in the neighborhood

-the huge impact of television images which fuel the "keep up with the Jonses" mindset, and distrust of people for fear of violence on kids and people

-drugs and pornography, and the fear of exposing oneself and family to their influences.

-the increasing influence of government into our lives, i.e. the Nanny State. I don't know how I made it through childhood riding my bike everywhere without a helmet

Almost to a person, when folks are able, economically, to leave the barrio (or ghetto) or a small town, they do.

The "romance" of a barrio or small town is more fantasy than reality. While folks may be friendly, etc., and know each other, life there is tough. Nobody really likes a tough life. For every person who waxes romantically about the Good Life there, there are 100 trying anything they can to get out.
 

Matilda

RIP Lindsay
Sep 13, 2006
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I lived in London for 15 years. In all that time the only people who came to my house without phoning before hand were Jehovahs Witnesses. Never did anyone just 'pop in'. here I cook for 10 every night - there are only 4 of us - because people always just 'pop in'. And I love it. I love feeling part of a community. When I was in hospital after being shot - 300 people came to see me from all over the country. They made a massive effort in time and money. In the Uk when last in hospital there, I was lucky to get 2 visitors, but lots of flowers. People just don't make the effort - too busy with their lives. Yes people are poor in the barrios, but they have a richness to their lives which we have lost in the richer nations. We may have more money, but they have the ability to laugh and care more for their fellow man. I left Uk as I wanted to wake up every morning smiling. I do that now. I am poorer in terms of cash, but my life is a million times richer.

Matilda
 

Snuffy

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May 3, 2002
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My point is and even you say this...the 'reality' is being imposed on you and you have no control over it. The title of this thread is what the structure of a barrio might teach us. Perhaps it is the running away from it that we so land in the opposite extreme. Perhaps we can look at the barrio and learn how to take certain aspects that may allow us to design better living communities. Maybe a view of the ocean is wonderful or of the mountains but perhaps what we need more is a view of one another. I'm not saying that an exact duplicate of the barrio is ideal. I'm saying we can learn something from it. There is something there that we really need.
 

Snuffy

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May 3, 2002
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Matilda...what is your secret that people come from all over the country to see you? Is your cooking that good? Where are you located.
 

dv8

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Sep 27, 2006
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backwards or forwards?

russians had poor ideas about the use of space but they did make huge windows. almost a third of our block walls were windows. my parents live on the ground floor, or first floor in DR count, accidentally also pierwoj etaz (first floor) in russian count. low enough for the cat to jump in and out, even with the fat pigeon in his mouth (on a way in). low enough for people to climb in as well, i have done so many times, so did my mum, with the help of two stools and two people, but you have to take into the account that my mum is almost sixty and two said people, namely me and my brother were ****ing themselves laughing.
but no bars. and my parents sleep with the balcony doors open. even thou once we had unwanted visitor in a shape of a drunk man who miscalculated balconies and got into ours instead of his lover's.
i lived in london for four years. small windows. no bars. no bars needed, windows are protected by a thick layer of dirt, matilda, have you noticed how no one EVER washes their windows in london, especially in council estates?
i do not progress, i go back, back to big, communist windows from times when people TRUSTED each other and believed in the police.
hey, didn't you say that the trust and friendliness were a thing of barrios? but still the bars, yes? the trust, it does not go far, does it?
 

Matilda

RIP Lindsay
Sep 13, 2006
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Snuffy my cooking is fabulous!!! Indian curries, thai noodles, paella, great roast chicken!!! But seriously my Dominican husband says that you know who your real friends are when you are in hospital, prison or when you die. He has many friends and I think it was respect for him as much as for me that they came to see me. The difference here is that friendship means putting yourself out for people more than in Europe or US. dv8 - true about windonws in London. Here I have no glass - just bars!!!!
 

Snuffy

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May 3, 2002
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TRUST is not what exist in the barrios here and that is why the bars exist. If you leave the door unguarded someone will come in and steal what you have. Even guest will pick up things along the way. That is what I have seen. Perhaps others have experienced something different. In russia trust existed. Where I grew up trust existed. We were confident no one would come into the house uninvited. So that is why you probably should not put in big windows without the bars. You could write a book about growing up in Poland.