Well put TB! These dreamers get brainwashed into believing that the principles of socialism actually transfer well into the real world, but in the long run, the air comes out of the balloon when the human factor is inserted into their "perfect" scenario.
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Action platform of the Dominican Republic Branch of the Free People's Movement
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drbill said:Worth reading twice, Texas Bill!
Socialism is a fascinating philosophy, but brutally inhumane and dehumanizing in its application. I believe that the DR has come too far to ever slide back into that happy crap.
drbill
The DR cannot ever slide back into socialism, because it has never been socialist, we've only experienced some crappy political system disguised as democracy, and of course mostly dictatorship.
LUMUMBA said:Ok, let's compare..
Life expectancy before the revolution in Cuba: 59.4 years
Life expectancy after: 77 years
Literacy before the revolution in Cuba: 59%
Literacy after: 97% (the only folks who can't read are those with disabilities or learning disorders)
Infant mortality rate before the revolution in Cuba: 60
Infant mortality rate after: 5.8
Literacy in socialist Cuba: 97%
Literacy in capitalist DR: 82%
Infant mortality in socialist Cuba: 5.80
Infant mortality in capitalist DR: 33.41
Infant mortality in imperialist US: 7.00
Persons per doctor in socialist Cuba: 290
Persons per doctor in capitalist DR: 795
Persons per doctor in imperialist US: 470
Unemployment in socialist Cuba: 1.9%
Unemployment in capitalist DR: 15%
Unemployment in imperialist US: 5.8%
Human Poverty Index in socialist Cuba: 4.1%
Human Poverty Index in capitalist DR: 11.8%
SOURCES: UNESCO, UNDP, UNSD, EPICA, CIA World Fact Book, UNICEF.
My father is Dominican and my mother is Colombian. I was born in Colombia, lived a while in the U.S..
Are you Dominican? Most of the people that post here aren't, but yet they have an awful lot to say about how the country should be run (usually in the interest of foreign business owners)..
I haven't been planning with any ideas... nice try though.
I don't have regular access to the internet. Sorry. I'm thankful for the help though.
I didn't "preach" anything. I posted the program of a political organization I support. Why is it okay to promote the corrupt puppets in the PLD & PRD but not groups like the MGL or FR?
That makes alot of sense.. wouldn't want a thing like free speech or advocacy of a real, grass roots democracy to get in the way of the beloved Dominican democracy that exists now..
Have you lived in Cuba?
Go to cuba and live there for a least 6 months and then come back to us with your finding. And by the way,
while you are there, please read the book "Manual del perfecto Idiota Latinoamericano" Manual of the perfect
Latin American Idiot.
A spy? Yes!
Elchino you three eyed cyclops are you still here? You're still an idiot regardless of what you post.[/QUOTE
Rick Snyder. you are the idiot and not a friend of the Dominican people and you know it, you dirty dog, you are a typical American hypocrite. Why don't you tell everybody who you really are? A spy!
Rick Snyder is a true cyclops and a true spy: Greek Mythology pl. Cy·clo·pes (s-klpz)
Any of the three one-eyed Titans who forged thunderbolts for Zeus.
Any of a race of one-eyed giants, reputedly descended from these Titans, inhabiting the island of Sicily.
Are you Dominican? Is your favorite identifier, its it?
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RickRick Snyder said:Elchino you three eyed cyclops are you still here? You're still an idiot regardless of what you post.
I guess he thinks if he doesn't call you Rick Pixx Snyder nobody will realize it's the same schizophrenic three headed hydra.
I thought he had gone off to write poetry......
Moronic Pentameter
Lic. Celt :laugh:
To Lumbago and Elchino
Even China has abandoned most of its Communist philosophy, but still maintains a dictitorial government. The transition of China into a pseudo-capitilistic economy has amazed the world with their inborn business acumen.
In societies where there is "rule by committee" there can be no democracy, per se. Look at all the historical examples that pack the history books, elchino and lumbago and you'll see where your mis-guided dreaming is leading.
Texas Bill
Even China has abandoned most of its Communist philosophy, but still maintains a dictitorial government. The transition of China into a pseudo-capitilistic economy has amazed the world with their inborn business acumen.
In societies where there is "rule by committee" there can be no democracy, per se. Look at all the historical examples that pack the history books, elchino and lumbago and you'll see where your mis-guided dreaming is leading.
Texas Bill
A Cyclops, A Spy
THE FACT CONTINUE TO BE THAT YOU, AMONG OTHERS, LIKE THE SOCKS CELT202, ARE MANIPULATING THE PROCESS AND THE OPINIONS OF MANY MEMBERS OF THIS BOARD.
NONETHELESS,THE MODERATOR DON'T LIKE DOMINICANS AND HE IS A TRUE CYCLOPS AND A SPY- AND THE OTHERS, LIKE CELT202, ARE JUST KISSING A$$.
Rick Snyder said:See, I rest my case.
Edited to add;
No, no, no you dummie! The reference to three eyes has to do with what Celt202 mentioned. You remember. elchino, jguerrero and the non-spelling, grammatically flawed idiot rtejeda.
THE FACT CONTINUE TO BE THAT YOU, AMONG OTHERS, LIKE THE SOCKS CELT202, ARE MANIPULATING THE PROCESS AND THE OPINIONS OF MANY MEMBERS OF THIS BOARD.
NONETHELESS,THE MODERATOR DON'T LIKE DOMINICANS AND HE IS A TRUE CYCLOPS AND A SPY- AND THE OTHERS, LIKE CELT202, ARE JUST KISSING A$$.
And might I ask, just what are you attempting to do???
It is very clear that since your posts have not been well received, your childlike vanity is injured and you revert to the junenile methodology of invective and rage.
When you decide to "grow up" see if you can be a bit more civil in your commentaries. If you can't, we, collectively, would rather not hear from you.
BTW, I would strongly suggest that you read and absorb Niccolo Machiavelli's "The Prince" in which he gives very good advise to aspirants of political leadership. You could learn a lot from that rather short dissertation on a variety of subjects regarding politics.
But, then, perhaps not, since you have obviously convinced yourself that you "know best" what is good for a Nation.
Texas Bill
It is very clear that since your posts have not been well received, your childlike vanity is injured and you revert to the junenile methodology of invective and rage.
When you decide to "grow up" see if you can be a bit more civil in your commentaries. If you can't, we, collectively, would rather not hear from you.
BTW, I would strongly suggest that you read and absorb Niccolo Machiavelli's "The Prince" in which he gives very good advise to aspirants of political leadership. You could learn a lot from that rather short dissertation on a variety of subjects regarding politics.
But, then, perhaps not, since you have obviously convinced yourself that you "know best" what is good for a Nation.
Texas Bill
Breathtaking stupidity....elchino said:THE FACT CONTINUE TO BE THAT YOU, AMONG OTHERS, LIKE THE SOCKS CELT202, ARE MANIPULATING THE PROCESS AND THE OPINIONS OF MANY MEMBERS OF THIS BOARD.
NONETHELESS,THE MODERATOR DON'T LIKE DOMINICANS AND HE IS A TRUE CYCLOPS AND A SPY- AND THE OTHERS, LIKE CELT202, ARE JUST KISSING A$$.
Got to change my socks and get back to manipulating opinions and kissing major butt. So much to do, so little time. :tired:
LUMUMBA said:This is a translation.. I can post the original in Espa?ol if anyone wants..
http://freepeoplesmovement.org/fpm/page.php?138
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The following is a list of immediate demands which must be met in order for the most basic problems of the Dominican Republic to be solved. We strongly encourage all Dominican people to unite with us in the fight for the fulfillment of these demands.
1. Unite all who can be united ? under the leadership of the poor and oppressed ? to throw off the political and economic stranglehold of the US imperialists.
The main task facing the Dominican Republic today is the need for National Liberation. Our country is completely dominated ? both economically and politically ? by the North American imperialists through neo-colonialism. None of the needs of our people can be met as long as our entire country is run in the interests of US business owners.
All patriotic Dominicans of all sectors must unite under the democratic leadership of the poor and oppressed masses ? the only group capable of successfully leading such a struggle ? to free our country from Yankee domination by any means necessary.
2. Immediately withdraw from CAFTA and end all other unequal relations with foreign countries and companies.
As a part of establishing our national independence, we must break free of CAFTA and all other agreements with foreign countries and companies that benefit those countries and companies more than they benefit the Dominican people.
3. Forge a truly democratic government by placing control of communities in the hands of those who live in them, workplaces in the hands of those who work in them and farms, ranches and plantations in the hands of farmers and farm workers who work them. Replace the Congreso Nacional with a federation of councils whose members are elected at the community and workplace levels.
Once we liberate ourselves from Yankee domination, we can began to solve our problems. But in order to do so, we must create a truly democratic society in which the people make the decisions and can act in their own interests.
For this to occur, the people must take control of their communities, the workers must take control of their workplaces, and the farmers and farm workers must take control of the farms, ranches and plantation they work.
As well, the Congreso Nacional must be replaced with a federation of councils whose members are elected at the community and workplace levels.
4. Guarantee full political and economic equality in law for all, regardless of nationality, gender, age or skin color.
To establish a truly democratic society, we must guarantee full political and economic equality for all, regardless of nationality, gender, age or skin color. Only after this guarantee has been made can we solve the problems of the Dominican people.
5. Raise the monthly minimum wage to 6400 pesos for all workers. Eliminate child labor by sending all child workers back to school with a living wage. Work to eliminate prostitution by closing all known houses of prostitution and offering free education and a living wage to all known prostitutes. Make full employment available to all who want it.
In order to establish a truly democratic society, the people must be able to fully participate in all aspects of decision making. In order for the people to be able to do so, their basic needs must first be met. It is for this reason that the monthly minimum wage for all workers must be raised to 6400 pesos.
For a truly democratic society to operate, the people must also have access to a political and academic education. As a part of guaranteeing that access, all child workers must be sent back to school with a monthly allowance of 3200 pesos.
To ensure the full economic and political equality of our people, all known houses of prostitution must be immediately closed and all known prostitutes must be offered free education and granted a monthly allowance of 3200 pesos.
When the Dominican people take control of society into their own hands and make decisions their selves, they can implement a policy of guaranteed employment to all who want it.
6. Advance the liberation of women. Abolish all laws that discriminate against women and replace them with laws that guarantee the full equality of women in all aspects of life. Create childcare, meal preparation and delivery, and cleaning and maintenance services to free women from household slavery. Provide a living wage to all stay at home mothers.
No society can call itself democratic while women hold a lesser position in society than men. As a part of establishing full economic and political equality for all, all laws that discriminate against women must be immediately abolished and replaced with laws that guarantee the full equality of women in all aspects of society, and all stay at home mothers must provided an allowance of 6400 pesos a month.
As long as women are forced into household slavery, our society cannot be called a democratic society. Therefore, community based childcare, meal preparation and delivery, and cleaning and maintenance services must be created.
7. Abolish all taxes on the incomes of workers and farmers. Establish a sliding tax scale to insure a heavy taxation of the rich and zero taxation of the poor.
To insure full economic and political equality for all of our people we must establish a sliding tax scale under which the rich are taxed heavily while the poor aren?t taxed at all. For the same reason, all taxes on the incomes of workers and farmers must be abolished.
8. Place control of the electricity, water and communication systems into the hands of the Dominican people.
The only way to insure that the electricity, water and communication systems of our countries are being run in the interests of the Dominican people is for the Dominican people to take control of them.
Once the Dominican people take control of these systems 24 hour electricity service can finally be restored, and clean water and phone services can be extended to all parts of the country.
9. Freeze the prices of food and all other necessities, and abolish all taxes on necessities.
Because of the disastrous neo-colonial policies of our government, the prices of food and other basic goods and services have continued to raise drastically over the last few decades. To ensure the health and lively hood of the Dominican people. The prices of food and all other necessities must be frozen immediately, and all taxes on goods and services the people need should be abolished.
10. Lower all household rent to no more than 10% of the monthly wage of the occupants. Cancel all renters debt under 1,600,000 pesos.
To bring an immediate end to the housing crisis in our country, all household rent must be lowered to no more than 10% of the monthly wage of the occupants. To assure full economic and political equality among our people, all debt owed by renters under 1,600,000 pesos must be immediately canceled.
11. Place control of the hospitals and clinics into the hands of the Dominican people and make all healthcare absolutely free and available to all. Cancel all medical debt.
We must take control of the hospitals and clinics in order to use them in our own interests by extending free quality healthcare to the entire population. As a part of the new, democratic and just system of free, guaranteed healthcare for all, all medical debt must be cancelled.
12. Place control of all schools and universities into the hands of the Dominican people and provide completely free education ? from primary school to the university ? for all. Cancel all student debt and give all university students a living wage.
To establish the basis for a free and democratic society, all Dominicans must have access to academic and political education. To make this possible we must take control of all schools and universities and operate them in our own interests. We must make education ? from primary school to the university ? available to all completely free of charge. To ensure the political and economic equality of our people, all student debt must be canceled, and university students must be granted an allowance of 3,200 pesos a month.
13. Extend the right to vote to all Dominicans beginning at the age of 16.
To ensure the democratic character of our country, we must extend the right of participation in decision making to as much of the Dominican population as possible. This includes allowing members of our country?s armed forces to vote.
14. Launch extensive social projects to eradicate curable disease, eliminate illiteracy and otherwise benefit the Dominican people.
To solve the problems of the Dominican people extensive social projects need to launched immediately, including the establishment of mass literacy and medical programs, the expansion and improvement of our roads, electricity, communication and water and sewage systems, and the construction of thousands of housing units.
15. Place control of the Central Bank into the hands of the Dominican people. Cancel all private debt below 1,600,000 pesos.
To ensure that our country is ran in the interests of the Dominican masses, we must take control of the Central Bank and use it to our benefit. As a part of finally establishing full political and economic equality for all, all debt owed by individuals under the amount of 1,600,000 pesos must be immediately canceled.
16. Terminate all special privileges and protection from the law for elected officials. Lower the wages paid to all elected officials to levels no higher than the wages of skilled workers. Establish the right to recall any elected official in law. Abolish the party-appointed Supreme Court of Justice and replace it with a court elected directly by the Dominican people.
To insure the democratic nature of our country, all special privileges and protections for elected officials must be immediately terminated.
To insure political and economic equality among the people of our country and to end corruption, elected officials must not receive a higher wage than the average skilled worker receives, and must be recallable at any time by the voters.
A necessary part of establishing a truly democratic system is the abolition of the Supreme Court of Justice appointed by the main political parties, and its replacement with a court elected directly by the Dominican people themselves.
17. Abolish all pro-business and anti-worker laws. Abolish all laws that give businesses the same rights as citizens. Abolish all anti-union laws and replace them with laws guaranteeing the right to form unions.
Our country can never be run in a democratic fashion while it is operated in the interests of businesses rather than the interests of the Dominican people. As a part of creating a truly democratic society in which the people rule, all laws that put the interests of businesses above the rights of the Dominican people must be immediately abolished.
In any truly democratic society, the workers, farmers, students and other oppressed people must have the legal right to form unions and federations without interference from the government, business owners, armed forces or police; and that right must be fully upheld and protected.
18. Democratize the armed forces. Kick all US troops, advisors and agents out of our country for good. Combine the Army and National Police into one body of national defense under the control of the Dominican people, and restrict the use of this body in our country to disaster relief, public works and defense from outside aggressors. Immediately demobilize and recall all Dominican soldiers on foreign soil. Arm the Dominican people and train them in national self-defense.
As a part of finally establishing our national independence once and for all, we must kick all US troops, advisors and agents out of our country for good. We must also demobilize and recall all Dominican soldiers serving on foreign soil in the interest of foreign countries and businesses.
As a part of the democratization of our society, we must also democratize our armed forces. This means transforming the army and police from instruments of oppression of the people into instruments of national defense. To do this, the Army and National Police must be combined into one National Defense Force which is put under the command of the body of national councils. The use of this National Defense Force on Dominican soil must be limited to disaster relief, public works projects and defense from outside aggressors.
Finally, once a truly democratic society under the control of the masses is formed, it must be vigorously defended. Therefore, the Dominican people must be armed and trained to defend our country and our hard won gains at any cost.
The more of this that I read, the more I'm convinced that it should never have been allowed publication on this board. And though we all are strong advocates of the Freedom of Speech, an in-depth analysis of this document reveals an overt attempt to bring about the overthrow of the existing Government of the Dominican Republic, an abrogation of it's laws and administrative procedures, and an underlying advocation of force to effect the changes proposed.
While it is not for me to do other than recommend, I would strongly recommend this be brought to the attention of the Dominican Attorney General in the Ministry of Justice for review and/or action by him.
In the meantime, this "document" should be preserved in place, the commentaries thereto preserved and the threaad locked from further comments.
Texas Bill
Since the OP claims to be an American citizen residing in the US report his IP to Homeland Security for good measure.Texas Bill said:The more of this that I read, the more I'm convinced that it should never have been allowed publication on this board. And though we all are strong advocates of the Freedom of Speech, an in-depth analysis of this document reveals an overt attempt to bring about the overthrow of the existing Government of the Dominican Republic, an abrogation of it's laws and administrative procedures, and an underlying advocation of force to effect the changes proposed.
While it is not for me to do other than recommend, I would strongly recommend this be brought to the attention of the Dominican Attorney General in the Ministry of Justice for review and/or action by him.
In the meantime, this "document" should be preserved in place, the commentaries thereto preserved and the threaad locked from further comments.
Texas Bill
G
gary short
Guest
Don't go creating a whole sh!tload of trouble for some poor chap that has some far left ideological views by putting him underneath the microscope of those freaks at homeland security. Shame on you.Celt202 said:Since the OP claims to be an American citizen residing in the US report his IP to Homeland Security for good measure.
gary short said:Don't go creating a whole sh!tload of trouble for some poor chap that has some far left ideological views by putting him underneath the microscope of those freaks at homeland security. Shame on you.
The ideas he espouses put dozens of millions of people in common graves in the twentieth century.
Shame on him.
G
gary short
Guest
Celt202 said:The ideas he espouses put dozens of millions of people in common graves in the twentieth century.
Shame on him.
No sir, leaders that disagreed with each others ideological veiws and had the weaponry put millions of people in their graves.
Stalin and Mao put untold millions of their own people to death.gary short said:No sir, leaders that disagreed with each others ideological veiws and had the weaponry put millions of people in their graves.
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