Amnesty International Report: SEXUAL VIOLENCE AGAINST WOMEN INCREASING

greydread

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I guessed you missed the second part where I said to defer to those...



Well no guessing involved actually. Try reading my whole post next time. I try to make them short for those who bore quickly, like myself.

I read your whole post. My comment was limited to the part which I quoted. Unlike you, I don't find the subject of this thread boring at all, in fact I find it very disturbing.

I also find it somewhat disturbing that I actually agree with you on the theory that the flight from Haiti by many who have managed achieved middle class status elsewhere in the World is a major contributing factor to the decay of Haiti's social order. Unlike you however I don't blame "these types" for their decisions because after working very hard toward establishing themselves in jobs and communities which offer decent living conditions for themselves and their families, and developmental opportunities for their children as well as a constant revenue source through remittances for their less fortunate family members back home I can understand their reluctance to risk the fruits of their labors on an uncertain and very risky future should they decide to return to their homeland.

That would be a decision that expatriated Haitians would have to make on a case by case basis and I, for one respect their decisions. I feel the exact same empathy for expatriated Dominicans, Serbs, Phillipinos, Salvadorans and every other displaced member of any ethnicity or nationality who has had to make the gut wrenching decisions involved in choosing between their homeland, friends and families and success, even you, Chip.
 

getthesenets

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BACK to the topic....


"Any group on the ground in Haiti dealing with women's issues" means just that. Contrary to what some think, there are Haitian run organizations and groups that deal with these issues. Some religious based, some not..that Haitian expatriates support and fund. We've never looked at them as NGOs or whatever alphabet soup acronym other groups in Haiti are going by.
the implication that NGOs..(read foreign or international groups or whites) are the only such groups is the thinking and viewpoint of a person that is an outsider to Haiti and not qualified to speak about how to tackle problems in Haiti.

If a government recognized NGO is more efficient, better run, more visible and can help curtail some of these attacks, by all means contact that group.

I've asked mods politely to silence these voices because they add nothing to discussions and only (check the records) derail threads. and it's counterproductive at this point to have to keep correcting the false and misguided information time and time and time and time again.


L'etat..or the state in Haiti doesn't do much for the people, haven't done much for the people, and won't do much for the people in any TANGIBLE way. We do for ourselves or things just won't get done. Several other outside groups do a great job of helping Haitian people in MANY different ways. And I'm extremely grateful for every bit of it, but the paternalistic John Wayne mentality of some of these posters has to be called out.
 

greydread

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Haitians are judged by an entirely different set of rules than other human beings by some on this board...with the implicit approval by moderators to derail threads.

I wouldn't blame the mod's. But you're right about the thread busters. There's no discussion with them. How the discussion of a society in decay just as it's people are hurting the most can turn into a soap box for one's political and religious agenda is beyond me.

Most of us read about Haiti's latest problem of sexual violence being heaped upon a people beset with every other imaginable woe and felt profound sadness. Some felt opportunity. It's called the missionary mentality and it's 500 years old. Time for us all to rise up and find a new paradigm before they go back to burning books and torturing suspected Witches, Jews and Heretics. The inquisition is over and they lost. Torquemada has been defeated and some will never accept it.
 

Chip

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Haitians are judged by an entirely different set of rules than other human beings by some on this board...with the implicit approval by moderators to derail threads.

Nice try, I also mentioned other LA countries and the DR.

I also recommend if you feel that people here on DR1 are prejudiced and not interested in helping Haiti that you go to HaitiXchange where I'm sure you will be very well received and you won't have to worry about anyone disagreeing with you.
 

Chip

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Most of us read about Haiti's latest problem of sexual violence being heaped upon a people beset with every other imaginable woe and felt profound sadness.

Amazing that you claim the sexual violence issue one "heaped upon" the Haitian community by what will can only insinuate to be "foreign" forces then lament the foreign communities involvement when in fact they have not probably had any time even to react to this issue. Talk about prejudice.

One thing's for sure, the victim mentality approach has little usefulness other than giving people a warm feeling of righteousness for a short time. Unfortunately, this won't help the Haitian people get out of the situation they are in.
 

bob saunders

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I wouldn't blame the mod's. But you're right about the thread busters. There's no discussion with them. How the discussion of a society in decay just as it's people are hurting the most can turn into a soap box for one's political and religious agenda is beyond me.

Most of us read about Haiti's latest problem of sexual violence being heaped upon a people beset with every other imaginable woe and felt profound sadness. Some felt opportunity. It's called the missionary mentality and it's 500 years old. Time for us all to rise up and find a new paradigm before they go back to burning books and torturing suspected Witches, Jews and Heretics. The inquisition is over and they lost. Torquemada has been defeated and some will never accept it.

You seem to imply that the sexual violence is from an outside source. Perhaps I'm mis-reading. There are several organizations, one Haitian and one not that have been trying to make a different and force what little there is of Haitian authorities to provide night time patrols, improved lighting....etc. Unfortunately until people are in proper housing and have an organized government, it is hard to believe things will improve much,
HAITI: Women Wonder if They'll Ever Feel Safe Again - IPS ipsnews.net
 

getthesenets

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anyway Back to the actual topic...


next week marks one year since the quake. My uncle was missing at one point during the quake and I used the CNN page to post his info and our contact information. He was discovered alive. CNN contacted me , and the others who used their site to find the status of loved ones, and asked me to fill out a brief survey about the year since.


The report by amnesty international coming out when it has is hopefully going to move this disturbing issue front and center when all the media coverage starts next week.


Going to force the presidential candidates and others claiming to be leaders in Haiti to have to sit down and address that it IS occurring and what steps are or aren't being taken to STOP and PREVENT this from taking place, treat the victims and apprehend the savages out there doing this.

I think many Haitians living abroad may hear about this evil stuff for the first time when the coverage starts. hopefully we'll start mobilizing resources to help prevent the circumstances that lead to this evil.



We've been talking about how under used solar technology is in places like Haiti..people send generators down there all the time, because like I said L'etat doesn't do anything or much for the people....may have to look into shipping some more solar powered lamp posts down there.

If anybody has ties to a company that sells them...the camping or the industrial sized ones...please pm me....we haven't sent a truck in over 2 years but hopefully we can send one out and the ports will let it through in the next 3 months.....you pay a lot to ship the truck but you can load the cab with whatever you want.

if anybody reading this gets that email from cnn, please fill it out...let your voices be heard about this and other important issues.
 

mountainannie

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elizabetheames.blogspot.com
Haiti's Women Rise From the Rubble - International Crisis Group

Rape was not illegal in Haiti until 2004 or 5 // nor was it that prevelant before 1990 when it was used as a weapon during political conflicts, according to Myriam Merlet, former minister of Women's Rights who was one of the nation's three top feminist leaders who were killed in the Quake.

It was only a few years ago that there was a march in PauP of women who had been victims of rape. They were able to actually come forward and speak to what had happened.

This attitude - that rape is the "fault" of the victims.. is also present here, from what I heard from a subdirector of PLAN.

here are some links of groups which are working on this issue
Kay Fanm - Accueil
V-Day Initiates Haiti Rescue Fund, Preparing To Help Our Sisters On The Ground | V-Day: A Global Movement to End Violence Against Women and Girls Worldwide.
and here are some voices of Haitian women
PotoFanm+Fi: MESSAGE DE LA SOLIDARITE FANM AYISY?N - SOFA A L’OCCASION DU NOUVEL AN
 
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Chip

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A tragic story, and yet with hope. This is quoted from the mother who had a child from being raped:

“I should not like him. When he came out of me, I began to love him,”
 

greydread

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How do you get that from this: A tragic story, and yet with hope. This is quoted from the mother who had a child from being raped:

?I should not like him. When he came out of me, I began to love him,?

It's pretty easy to suspect an "anti-choice" undercurrent even though I don't think that's what was meant. By the same token there are only two posters in this thread who took my reference to the addition of these acts of violence among Haiti's own people as the inference that it was perpetrated directly by outsiders rather than evidence of the further unraveling of Haiti's already fragile social order. Everyone else understood what I meant just fine.

Are you guys sharing the same computer?
 

bob saunders

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It's pretty easy to suspect an "anti-choice" undercurrent even though I don't think that's what was meant. By the same token there are only two posters in this thread who took my reference to the addition of these acts of violence among Haiti's own people as the inference that it was perpetrated directly by outsiders rather than evidence of the further unraveling of Haiti's already fragile social order. Everyone else understood what I meant just fine.

Are you guys sharing the same computer?

Hardly, perhaps it fools seldom differ or great minds think alike. More likely it was the choice of words YOU chose to use. Haiti will never move ahead until the people of Haiti accept responsibility for their poor choice of leaders, and rise up against their own criminal element. The unraveling of Haiti's social order seems to have started a number of decades ago. Who's everyone else?
 

greydread

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Hardly, perhaps it fools seldom differ or great minds think alike. More likely it was the choice of words YOU chose to use. Haiti will never move ahead until the people of Haiti accept responsibility for their poor choice of leaders, and rise up against their own criminal element. The unraveling of Haiti's social order seems to have started a number of decades ago. Who's everyone else?

Haiti will have to choose its own goals and ultimately they will be the only ones who can or will execute the moves that it makes toward reaching them. Other Nations can only assist but the fuel for the engine of change must be 100% Haitian. The "words that I choose" clearly indicate that we are in agreement on this point so I really don't understand why you guys feel the need to quote and double up like cojoined twins on my every post. Jeez! Some people will try to start a fight in an empty room.



"Everybody Else" knows who they are. It's everybody except these guys

greydread-albums-greypix-picture387-bigdog.jpg
 

Chip

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I think the best and most realistic scenario for Haiti is the international community will construct housing and infrastructure and create businesses and in spite of the fact the many Haitian politicians will do their best to rob the blind they will not be able to stop the progress or no longer blame the international community for their problems. The positive effect is that with infrastructure in place and a feeling of hope for the future Haitian professionals will return to manage the infrastructure. I expect the latter to happen in significant numbers in 5 years or so. Along the way the Haitian gov't needs to address the foreign owned property issues and property rights in general to include surveying law.
 

Chip

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not that this has anything to do with the thread topic

but

what are you talking about, specifically?
i know nothing about surveying law

Without adequate surveying laws and practices property cannot be properly delineated; which makes it very difficult to buy property which therefore would limit all but the most persistant and dedicated foreign companies from wanting to set up shop there. In order to attract foreign investment this will have to change.