- Thread starter viguy007
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I May or May Not have a big problem
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I'm not a particularly religious person so I don't approach this concept from that perspective. In my life, I have found that doing the right thing is often a better choice from the outset. Tell one lie, you will need to tell another to cover the first. Get known as the gringo who hands out propinas and people will approach you with their hands out. As HUG has said, start down a questionable slope and you may well find yourself on a very steep grade in a situation you no longer control.
From an individual perspective and a practical point of view, I see a logistical difference (not a moral difference) between handing out a couple 100 pesos on a dark road somewhere to the NP/Amet and handing over a cash stuff passport in an airport that is well covered by surveillance cameras.
I don't know how long a US passport is valid for, but there will be an issue date and an expiry date printed somewhere. The OP has probably changed his passport at least once or twice over the 13 year period. The most immigration can ask for is the fine from the date the passport was issued up to the date of departure. Just paying that is easier than running around getting false entry stamps and much easier than risking missing a flight for a fraction of the cost of the airline ticket.
There seems to be a bit of hypocrisy at play here. I've noticed that some of the biggest and loudest proponents of the exit fine option for living here are also the one's who seem work the hardest to avoid paying those fines. Don't want to get legal residency, your choice. Prefer to pay an exit fine instead, no problem, just accept the consequences of your choices and pay the appropriate amount. For goodness sake, if you bribe an official, lie or procure a false entry stamp, don't talk about doing so on a public forum and one certainly should not be assuring others that if they too break the law or act in a less than honorable way that they will get away with it guaranteed. There is no way to guarantee a successful outcome for someone else who follows that type of advice. The OP having been here for 13 years can probably fend for himself. However, an infrequent tourist just coming off a 12 week stay who reads this crap may not fare quite so well when they insert a page or two in their passport.
Wish to hold classes on how to break the law, take it to PM or email. Want to announce to everyone else that you are just like the locals you criticize, carry on as normal.
My comment was an acknowledgement to Tom that I approved of his comment and support his lifestyle choice. If you took that to be a judgement directed at you, that's because your guilty as charged and have a guilty conscience. If you did not engage in this type of behavior, then my comment would not have struck a nerve.
Yes, that certainly is an option. We're just giving the OP some suggestions.
If it were me, I'd pay the fine because I'm pretty much a 'rules' person [even though I do fantasize about breaking them, LOL]. If I went through immigration and they didn't notice how long I'd been in DR, I wouldn't point it out to them. But I'd never do the "pesos in the passport" thing.
Must be that Catholic school upbringing I had. That and the fear of getting caught
Just for clarity I have never had a fake stamp always paid my overstay fee (accept when the immigration officer asks me if I want it cheaper). Also gringo is right they can make him pay from the date the passport was issued I think that is the best case scenario.
My US passport expired over 2 years ago.
He may not have renewed his either.
I plan to just show up, if I ever get a new passport, at immigration at the airport, and "negociable" them to death, till they just want me to LEAVE!!!!!!
Life is much more fun that way!!!!
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He may not have renewed his either.
I plan to just show up, if I ever get a new passport, at immigration at the airport, and "negociable" them to death, till they just want me to LEAVE!!!!!!
Life is much more fun that way!!!!
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I seriously doubt that anyone would perceive the above as anything other than what it is.
<Not specifically addressed to you Bermy, just a generalized comment>
Eg. You are driving down the interstate in Florida. You get pulled over. "Good afternoon officer, it's hot today isn't it? You look hot and can probably use a cold drink." You hand over your license, registration, insurance and a $50 bill and see what that gets you. Apples to Oranges I know, but the principle is the same. If one hands cash to an official while they are performing their duty, one is offering a bribe in the eyes of the law in NA and here in the DR. There is no wiggle room for interpretation and no judge will ever say "yes it was hot and you are a great guy for offering to refresh that poor souls palette."
The law is very clear. If one chooses to offer a propina, they should know that there is an element of variable risk associated with that behavior. A very small risk in some circumstances and a much greater risk in others. The exit fines are public record. If one pays what they owe, there is no risk at all.
I saw a pay off at sdq entering. I can't imagine what it was for? Paying to enter?
Of course I am a big believer in law and order. It just depends on which law and whose order.
Of course I am a big believer in law and order. It just depends on which law and whose order.
If banks in DR are charging you RD$300 pesos for a bounced third party check that was deposited into your account from a closed account at another bank, then that should tell you all you need to know about the 'rules' in DR-There is money to be made off crime and fraud by everyone-everyone is complicit in their actions to make money off whatever-this the law here.
You completely missed my point - a bribe is a bribe. Here in the DR , or elsewhere. Just because you don't call it a bribe doesn't make it "not" a bribe. Bribes are illegal here in the DR and elsewhere.
The frequency of prosecution or occurrence of the act itself is not at issue. People are talking about morality and doing the right thing. If it's illegal to do something it doesn't matter if we are talking about the DR, Florida or in Benin. If it is considered an acceptable practice then it wouldn't be defined in the legislation as a criminal act.
Just because it is perceived as a common place, or often overlooked or even widely accepted doesn't change the facts. My point, those who make the conscious choice to not commit crimes should not be chastised or ridiculed for their choice by those who choose to follow a different path.
Given a choice to befriend one of two people. 1) a person who demonstrates a proclivity to conduct themselves in an honorable fashion whenever possible and 2) someone who on occasion demonstrates a willingness to act in their own self-interest above all other considerations...I'll pick #1 everytime. Not everyone would do the same and I accept that. However, there are people about who do value integrity, honesty, fair play etc. We may be perceived as naive but these people do not deserve to be called out just because they choose to not compromise their principles to save $50.
Except these fines are levied retrospectively they were not in place during the years the OP overstayed his visa.
Being applied retroactively is one of the the realities one accepts when choosing to make use of this option. If the OP doesn't get out of here before the end of June, it's probably going to cost him a lot more. Those fines are going to be raised again soon.
Talk about a "Square Canadian Peg",...in a "Dominican Hole"?????????????????????
It looks to me that your "Holier Than Thou" posts are just "Chest Puffing" for your own self agrandizmont!
Do you ever leave your "Ivory Tower" here in the DR and see what living here actually is all about????????????
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Bermy,
I had a problem a while back and reported it here.
I picked up my wife and daughter at POP... one from USA, the other from UK........... not having seen each other in several months, you cannot imagine the noise in the car as we passed thru Sosua Abajo..........
and thru a red light with an AMET first in line opposite me.
His head snapped around at the car and i hit the gas for my getaway.
I was still 'getting awaying' at the next light atop the hill (Caribe tour stop) right behind a bus..... yellow light.
The Abajo AMET had called ahead..... they pulled me over and declared that was my second red.
Trouble for me with a capital "T"
He tried to get in the car to take me to the station but it was full.... luggage, women , etc.
I ditched the no Espanol approach quickly and began pleading.... family arrival, need to drive an hour more to cabrera..
yak, yak, yak.
Finally, I suggested that I give him the 2,000 pesos fine and asked him to pay it for me.... por favor, senor
A young guy, who had been called to catch me by his superior......... he scratched his head and we talked more.
Finally, he said OK.... but I was to understand this -
he was letting me go and was going to take the money as a gift for himself. was I OK with that.?
Yes sir , I am..... and muchas gracias..... I was on my way.
Point being-
He did not stop me for a propina...... that isn't always the case
sometimes they're just doing their job.
Heres How I look at it PN stops you its for a propina Amet I feel if you run a red light or no seat belt then you deserve your ticket.
I do not trust the PN G2 M2 what ever else stops you for nothing ! If they insist on searching my vehicle I am right behind them watching their hands so they do not plant anything in my car to further extort meso In my years of being here all of that can be avoided by just being nice having the 100 pesos ready and be on my way.
Cdn Gringo if you think your morals law and order are going to help you when they take your car to the station saying they found some coke in your car your gonna wish you just handed over 100 peso.
Easy better than hard 100 peso today better than frustration of waiting in a police station waiting to pay more money because of your Laws that only you follow.
I do not trust the PN G2 M2 what ever else stops you for nothing ! If they insist on searching my vehicle I am right behind them watching their hands so they do not plant anything in my car to further extort meso In my years of being here all of that can be avoided by just being nice having the 100 pesos ready and be on my way.
Cdn Gringo if you think your morals law and order are going to help you when they take your car to the station saying they found some coke in your car your gonna wish you just handed over 100 peso.
Easy better than hard 100 peso today better than frustration of waiting in a police station waiting to pay more money because of your Laws that only you follow.
I think people are taking opinion out of context here. I think what is trying to be said, by me at least (and I think others) is know the time and place to play the game. The roadside with Amet or PN, you can pretty much always move on stress free yet slightly thinner in pocket, if you so choose to. The airport clueless is not.
A superiors card with number in your wallet always avoids any sh1t with PN. Know your neighbours, you will probably have a high ranker somewhere close who will be your friend.
A superiors card with number in your wallet always avoids any sh1t with PN. Know your neighbours, you will probably have a high ranker somewhere close who will be your friend.
This is a strange concept to me - if a govt wants to penalize behavior going forward - fine but retroactively punishing behavior does not provide a very secure environment at all. In any country, not just the DR.
In most Western countries retroactive punishment is not the order of the day as far as I know... imagine raising property taxes retroactively?
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