I understand. My question is if you believe that the project will suceed given that Trump just pulled his name?
- Thread starter Kemo
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Trump pulling out or Cap Cana?????
I understand. My question is if you believe that the project will suceed given that Trump just pulled his name?
Well Trump Farallon Estates at Cap Cana is just one many of the projects that Cap Cana have like Green Village, Golden Bear Lodge, Altabella Fishing Lodge, Punta Palmeras, Sotogrande and recently announced Ritz carlton at cap Cana if Cap Cana's problems are just loosing Trump that is not to worry what it is to worry the Financial trouble's that they are going thru right now.
Do you think they are over developing in Cap Cana or that they went too ambitious with this project.
Cabarete seems to be doing just fine with smaller developments and private homes.
Cabarete seems to be doing just fine with smaller developments and private homes.
Let's get this in focus
Kimo---can we get this question off the table please?? You are throwing a lot of "stuff" on the table. Some of it needs-what is the source? some of it is--that's your take on it.
So lets re-group. Gives us some hard facts we can check to get the real story.
Thanks in advance
john
Can you post your source please?!
Kimo---can we get this question off the table please?? You are throwing a lot of "stuff" on the table. Some of it needs-what is the source? some of it is--that's your take on it.
So lets re-group. Gives us some hard facts we can check to get the real story.
Thanks in advance
john
Gives us some hard facts we can check to get the real story.
john
You mean you wanna be spoon-fed ? It's all in the last 10Q filing...
You mean you wanna be spoon-fed ? It's all in the last 10Q filing...
LOL-but I make my money in other ways other than reading disclosure statements! For placer I read novels which I am going to do right now. Good nightttttttttttttt.
john
Kimo---can we get this question off the table please?? You are throwing a lot of "stuff" on the table. Some of it needs-what is the source? some of it is--that's your take on it.
So lets re-group. Gives us some hard facts we can check to get the real story.
Thanks in advance
john
In post #7 i said where i got the Source. I have been a developer and investor for over 15 years my job is to know if my money is safe or not. I cannot come here and put down the name of the person that not only told me showed me the Figures. Since November Bloomberg financial has been posting Cap Cana's financial problems due to the fail 500 million bonds . Cap Cana's is a very ambitious project but the problem relies that the developers have been putting land as collateral to develop all this projects and now because of the World Financial and Credit crisis investors are stuck because they cannot get financing from any bank and they have to save any liquid resource the have to go thru the storm. Cap Cana is going thru a very difficult time right now they just simply finance this whole project all wrong they want to do many projects at once without putting their own money. The decision if trump leaves or stays has to do that Trump does not want to be associated with projects that may pose a risk regarding bankruptcy and so on this creates a bad perception for his brand and developments. Like i said before i know bankers in the D.R, U.S and all over the caribbean this has been a topic of conversation for a while. Now we have to see if hazoury could save again his project as you know in 2003 Cap Cana was Bankrupted but somehow it revive and this situation is even worst.
Do you think they are over developing in Cap Cana or that they went too ambitious with this project.
Cabarete seems to be doing just fine with smaller developments and private homes.
Like i said Cap Cana is doing too many things at once. Maybe if the world was not going thru a credit crisis Cap Cana development will be fine. But things have change in less than a year and now banks are not lending anymore to projects like cap cana that put land as collateral with no private investments. A year a go Hazoury could call any bank and ask them for 20-50 0r 100 million and banks will fight to give him the money now is a totally different story it goes back to fundamentals and how you must develop in a responsible way financially.
most developments are financed via land collateral. But I believe that this project was too enormous to begin with. Like I said smaller projects ($10-20 million) are probably more attractive to finance at this time. Large gordy projects like this one are slow and don't move as fast on the ROI.
what's the cost of money Saturday?
and further to this post--Heck we don't even know what the cost of money will be tomorrow morning let alone months and years out.Not a good atmosphere to say the least for lending long term on projects such as this. (I think?)
most developments are financed via land collateral. But I believe that this project was too enormous to begin with. Like I said smaller projects ($10-20 million) are probably more attractive to finance at this time. Large gordy projects like this one are slow and don't move as fast on the ROI.
and further to this post--Heck we don't even know what the cost of money will be tomorrow morning let alone months and years out.Not a good atmosphere to say the least for lending long term on projects such as this. (I think?)
and further to this post--Heck we don't even know what the cost of money will be tomorrow morning let alone months and years out.Not a good atmosphere to say the least for lending long term on projects such as this. (I think?)
What group Abrisa should have done from the beginning is let a well known development company of years of experienced to develop the project conjunctively like Starwood- Roco Ki developers are doing. For example Starwood hotels & Resorts is 3erd largest hotel Corporation in the world they are putting almost 50% of their own money to develop Roco ki. Cap Cana has rely too much on Bond Issue and recently included Marriott International to develop a Ritz carlton Property in Cap Cana. Roco ki is not as big as Cap Cana but they have been very smart in developing the Westin Hotel golf Course and residences in a Manner that is more organized being backed by Starwood own money and International financial institutions that trust Starwood 100%.. Cap Cana's model is to bring this people as partners but they own the rights of the land and simply own the development pretty much in the case of Ritz Carlton managing the development but realy not owning it!!! Ritz carlton making money on the operation the same goes for NH Hotels, Sotogrande and so for other developments.
Johne my impression is that you are angry about this info coming out somehow i have a feeling about that???? To tell you the truth i am not happy at all i have an investment in Cap Cana Green village and i am very much afraid of loosing my money. But i think this info should not be keep under the covers people need to know what is going on. In the D.R there is a custom that i hate very much that is hiding the truth under the covers specially when it could affect tourism main industry in the D.R. In my native Puerto rico we call this amapucheo and it is so broad in all levels in Dominican society is like they are afraid to tell you something negative ( But true) about their country.I Understand perception is very important for business but you must be realistic and true when you are dealing with people's investment. I have so many examples that is incredible when i was 17 my father let go by myself to the D.R with some freinds we hire a taxi from the Airport to el Jaragua this guy told me that el jaragua was the biggest and most luxurious resort in Latin america. I have been there before and one of my friends too we look at each other and we wanted to laugh !!!! recently i was in the la Capital and people everywere were seeing for the first time the first rail cars of el Metro de Santo domingo one guy turn to me and told is the most modern and biggest in latin america and the world and i look at him knowing for a fact Puerto rico is way more modern that el Metro de santo domingo and lines of el Metro de Caracas and Chile are way superior that i just put my head down and said that is your truth. When i went to the Grand Opening of la Marina in Cap Cana Hazoury and others telling everybody that Cap Cana's marina is the largest in the caribbean i turn to the Vice president of sales of Cap Cana and in private i told him what about Puerto del Rey In Fajardo 1,100 boat slips and you are saying this and that he looked and me and said Puerto rico is U.S is not Caribbean i said come on!!!! i got so angry that i send a letter to Hazoury telling him to change that slogan he then started saying that is the Largest inland marina in the Caribbean which i really doubt because Palmas del mar in Humacao has had the title for over 20 years. i am not angry at progress what i am angry is at the exageration and lies they tell people over there in order to keep a perception that things are better that actually are.
The preception you get is true no doubt, but the mechanism behind them is different. For example, many poorer Dominicans are ignorant of things going on outside of their country and even in. The richer ones who are owners or partners in development are no doubt aware of the claims they make are false, yet realize they will have little resistance in getting people to believe them - such is true of the politics in this country as well unfortunately.
An example is a recent conversation I heard at the golf course the other day between the assistant caddymaster and one of the girls that works in the front office. He was complaining about the rates the golf courses were charging were too low and as well as what the caddies were being paid. I remember his final statement saying something like, we need to charge what they do in NY. No doubt this guy has never been to the US nor much less played golf there. He probably heard a cousin that lives in NYC saying that golf is expensive but the cousin more than likely doesn't realize any golf course close to NYC will be expensive. However, there are many hundreds of golf courses not in NYC that charge US20 something a round, which is less than the US40 that they charge here at the local course.
An example is a recent conversation I heard at the golf course the other day between the assistant caddymaster and one of the girls that works in the front office. He was complaining about the rates the golf courses were charging were too low and as well as what the caddies were being paid. I remember his final statement saying something like, we need to charge what they do in NY. No doubt this guy has never been to the US nor much less played golf there. He probably heard a cousin that lives in NYC saying that golf is expensive but the cousin more than likely doesn't realize any golf course close to NYC will be expensive. However, there are many hundreds of golf courses not in NYC that charge US20 something a round, which is less than the US40 that they charge here at the local course.
In my opinion, the bottom line is that in this economy the smaller lighter projects will do better than these enormous ones.
In my opinion, the bottom line is that in this economy the smaller lighter projects will do better than these enormous ones.
That would seem to make good sense.
BTW, on a different note, I sure like the new color scheme on the Real Estate section.
The preception you get is true no doubt, but the mechanism behind them is different. For example, many poorer Dominicans are ignorant of things going on outside of their country and even in. The richer ones who are owners or partners in development are no doubt aware of the claims they make are false, yet realize they will have little resistance in getting people to believe them - such is true of the politics in this country as well unfortunately.
An example is a recent conversation I heard at the golf course the other day between the assistant caddymaster and one of the girls that works in the front office. He was complaining about the rates the golf courses were charging were too low and as well as what the caddies were being paid. I remember his final statement saying something like, we need to charge what they do in NY. No doubt this guy has never been to the US nor much less played golf there. He probably heard a cousin that lives in NYC saying that golf is expensive but the cousin more than likely doesn't realize any golf course close to NYC will be expensive. However, there are many hundreds of golf courses not in NYC that charge US20 something a round, which is less than the US40 that they charge here at the local course.
Amen, Thank You but i believed this perception could be reversed if their is more accountability for those who lie and fraud people in the D.R. In Puerto rico Businessman and politician will never get away with the lies and things they say in the D.R. I thank everyday of my life for the Commonwealth status of Puerto rico being a U.S territory because the FBI, FCC, FTC, FDIC, Real State Board all federal regulatory agencies are there to guaranteed truth and transparency to avoid this Info Corruption that goes on in the D.R. In Puerto rico we all blessed that Communication penetration is one of the highest in the world even poor people here could afford Directv and have Fast internet either at homes public libraries or Public Schools information is way more broad here. I think the first thing in the D.R is that Press like Newspapers and TV have to be completely independent from the government it seems like Newspapers dance to the music the government puts and its become an accomplice of the misinformation in the D.R.. Also the government needs to stabilize the problem with the Power and then bring upon the private industry to provide Free internet to remote and poor areas. I think a less ignorant population will be the future for a better country.
No truth what so ever to your opening line
I am a U.S. citizen. I own no real estate in the DR nor do I care to. I look and read about real estate in the DR as well as world conditions since the food that I eat is put on the table thru my real estate work in the U.S.
I became impatient with the thread because I felt you were not relating factual information. I asked that you substantiate your facts. That's all. Well, one more thing. I think you have an agenda of some sort but I have yet to figure out what it is.
JOHN
Johne my impression is that you are angry about this info coming out somehow i have a feeling about that???? To tell you the truth i am not happy at all i have an investment in Cap Cana Green village and i am very much afraid of loosing my money. But i think this info should not be keep under the covers people need to know what is going on. In the D.R there is a custom that i hate very much that is hiding the truth under the covers specially when it could affect tourism main industry in the D.R. In my native Puerto rico we call this amapucheo and it is so broad in all levels in Dominican society is like they are afraid to tell you something negative ( But true) about their country.I Understand perception is very important for business but you must be realistic and true when you are dealing with people's investment. I have so many examples that is incredible when i was 17 my father let go by myself to the D.R with some freinds we hire a taxi from the Airport to el Jaragua this guy told me that el jaragua was the biggest and most luxurious resort in Latin america. I have been there before and one of my friends too we look at each other and we wanted to laugh !!!! recently i was in the la Capital and people everywere were seeing for the first time the first rail cars of el Metro de Santo domingo one guy turn to me and told is the most modern and biggest in latin america and the world and i look at him knowing for a fact Puerto rico is way more modern that el Metro de santo domingo and lines of el Metro de Caracas and Chile are way superior that i just put my head down and said that is your truth. When i went to the Grand Opening of la Marina in Cap Cana Hazoury and others telling everybody that Cap Cana's marina is the largest in the caribbean i turn to the Vice president of sales of Cap Cana and in private i told him what about Puerto del Rey In Fajardo 1,100 boat slips and you are saying this and that he looked and me and said Puerto rico is U.S is not Caribbean i said come on!!!! i got so angry that i send a letter to Hazoury telling him to change that slogan he then started saying that is the Largest inland marina in the Caribbean which i really doubt because Palmas del mar in Humacao has had the title for over 20 years. i am not angry at progress what i am angry is at the exageration and lies they tell people over there in order to keep a perception that things are better that actually are.
I am a U.S. citizen. I own no real estate in the DR nor do I care to. I look and read about real estate in the DR as well as world conditions since the food that I eat is put on the table thru my real estate work in the U.S.
I became impatient with the thread because I felt you were not relating factual information. I asked that you substantiate your facts. That's all. Well, one more thing. I think you have an agenda of some sort but I have yet to figure out what it is.
JOHN
I am a U.S. citizen. I own no real estate in the DR nor do I care to. I look and read about real estate in the DR as well as world conditions since the food that I eat is put on the table thru my real estate work in the U.S.
I became impatient with the thread because I felt you were not relating factual information. I asked that you substantiate your facts. That's all. Well, one more thing. I think you have an agenda of some sort but I have yet to figure out what it is.
JOHN
That is were you are wrong about any agenda???? if you don't believe me ask people that are investing in Cap Cana also read bloombergh talk to the workers in Cap Cana that have not got paid yet. I have not agenda i simply call it like i see it and this forum is to discuss real state problems and to make forummers aware of real state situations in the D.R. If you feel so strongly because my information is not factual then bring info that will challenge mine instead of simply desqualifying it.
I am a U.S. citizen. I own no real estate in the DR nor do I care to. I look and read about real estate in the DR as well as world conditions since the food that I eat is put on the table thru my real estate work in the U.S.
I became impatient with the thread because I felt you were not relating factual information. I asked that you substantiate your facts. That's all. Well, one more thing. I think you have an agenda of some sort but I have yet to figure out what it is.
JOHN
So you sell D.R real state in the U.S or simply you are an enthusiast of real state market in the D.R because the Real state market how is run , provisions and laws and market conditions in the D.R are so different from the U.S is like talking about different things.