children having babies??

[Escott]

Unwanted... your joking right?

Nal0whs, you are most probably better off asking the local legal or law enforcement community for those numbers. I'm sure any girl from a low socio-economic background that becomes pregnant to a foreigner is "very" aware of her rights and what she is due. I'm sure in percentage terms, many of those receive some sort of help, either in the form of a one off payment or on-going support.

As has been said in this thread, they key to this Dominican social issue is education.
Actually, I'm sure male foreigners have done a pretty good job in this area, as condom use amongst them is much higher than the local male population. Some of the stories I have heard from locals in regards to contraception, the do's and don't can best be described as very interesting.

Hey, how can you talk to such an educated and sucessful man in this way. You yourself have told me "HE" has a clue. Now you are suggesting he doesn't?

How can you even suggest that anything Dominican is not being done in a right manner? Education? Comon, listen to the wise people here, there is a great education system in most of the country. North Coast of course excluded because this is NOT the real Dominican Republic. I know there are NO problems in Santiago and Santo Domingo! This thread is just referring to UBH's and the north coast of course?

 

[Escott]

I can't even get a straight anwer to what the population of Sosua is. How are they going to find these fathers?

This is funny, they have the exact percentage of people with aides though What a joke this country is.

This is the deal. Because of the greed and corruption Dominicans live in squallor. 4 kids to a bed is not unusual so sex between brothers and sisters isn't unusual either. Hell sex between father and daughter is probably more common than anyone would believe!

Despite all this there are people on this board that think everything is good here and the economy is booming. I am not suggesting that you can't make money here but the economy is in the toilet compared to where it could be if Dominicans would realize that they have problems and start dealing with them. This would be a better solution instead of blaming it on the OTHER GUY even here in this thread which flies against all reason and reality.

 

[rellosk]

Im curious to know at what age/ grade level are the Dominican children taught about sex education in school?

The DR is a Catholic country so the only sex education that's taught is abstinence.

is birth control such as the pill availible at low cost for these young girls?

Most of these girls come from poor families so low cost would have to be free.

and whats a few dollars to pick up some condoms!

It's not about the availability or price of condoms, it's about using them. Many times an older man (or older boy) is able to convince a younger girl not to use a condom. (Although I don't think it takes much convincing).

Are they being taught about diseases?

Yes. But I think it's a recent phenomenon and I'm not sure at what age they are taught, or if it is taught in the schools or by an outside agency.

Are these girls going to school pregnant, then finishing after their babies are born?

I think it's rare that they go back to school. Once the baby comes there's another mouth to feed and if the father of the baby doesn't offer any support, it's off to work for the mother.

 

[rellosk]

... so sex between brothers and sisters isn't unusual either.

An this you know for a fact. Get real!

 

[Pib]

Im curious to know at what age/ grade level are the Dominican children taught about sex education in school? is birth control such as the pill availible at low cost for these young girls? and whats a few dollars to pick up some condoms! Are they being taught about diseases? Are these girls going to school pregnant, then finishing after their babies are born?

I didn't attend an average public school, but if the information is useful here it goes:

At about 12 (which would be 8th grade) we were taught about the anatomical aspects of reproduction, mostly as an introduction to the changes were were already suffering or were about to suffer. Sort of like "you will get hair growing in unsightly parts, boy's voices will change and girls will get their menses". Very clinical, no discussion of the "technical" aspects of the reproductive act or contraception.

In our last year in school (17) we were all carted off to some Catholic center in Santiago (next to PUCCMM) were a priest, a nun and two other people I can't rememmber much of, tried to explain to us about "Sex As It Is Intended by God and Approved by the Holy Roman Catholic Church". That means we were pretty much told that birth control (other than Total Abstinence or the Billings Method) were a big no-no. Obviously we were reminded that abortion was a mortal sin. The rest of it was discussing the "sanctity of our body", "fidelity" and what constituted "sex against nature" and other such nonsense. We were sent home with the feeling that were expected to "forget about it until you are married", then feel guilty about it for the rest of our lives.

The sad part is that we probably receive a much more comprehensive sex-ed than kids in publich schools. :tired:

 

[Pib]

By the way, I have never been on the pill, but about a year and a half ago a workmate asked me to stop at the pharmacy and buy her some on my way from lunch. It was about 750.00 pesos for a month supply, maybe that one brand is particularly expensive, but I don't see how someone with limited income can afford that.

 

[pdimanche]

And your point is?

Here we have a "self proclaimed", well educated Dominican,who makes a post that shows better than I could,using my best sarcasm,what is the biggest hurdle for Dominicans to overcome,BEFORE,they can come to grips with what ails them!!
To even suggest that teenage pregnancy in the DR is the fault of "Foreign Tourists" is beyond belief!But it does fall into the Catagory of "Boiler Plate" responses to criticism of all dominicans,"It's NOT OUR fault!
("If Dominicans are nothing else,they ARE predictable!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Yes it is "Pana"!

Have you seen those babies running around Sosua and Puerto Plata?????
They are 99.9% Black ,AND UGLY!!!
Unless the tourist are coming from Haiti,or Botswana,they are Dominicanos,"De Pura Sepa"!!

Have a happy "Semana Intoxicada"!
CCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCCC

CRISS

I usually find your replies to different quotes interesting, however, your reply saying "Have you seen those babies running around Sosua and Puerto Plata?????They are 99.9% Black ,AND UGLY!!!
Unless the tourist are coming from Haiti,or Botswana,they are Dominicanos,"De Pura Sepa"!!
has no merit.

 

[Criss Colon]

My Wife(Dominicana) Became Pregnant at 13.

By a 23 year old "Tigueraso" from her barrio of "Simon Bolivar".She got kicked out of the local CatholicSchool when the nuns notice that she was spending mornings "puking",and her belly began to swell.Her parents went nuts(A little Too Late may I suggest?) and she moved in with the guy.She soon grew tired of being beaten and burned with cigaretts and moved back home.Sound familiar?She had no money,and only one pair of panties,which she washed at night,and put on in the morning!She was at least smart enough to go to public health and get contraceptive "Tubes" put under the skin of her inner upperarm!
I can only imagine how "attractive" I was when we met 4 years later!!!!!!

Blaming the Catholic Church is an easy out! Dominicans are Catolics,but not "Practicing Catholics"!
The young girls become pregnant for the same reason they become pregnant all over the World.They WANT TO!
THey are lonely,bored,feel unloved and yern for a "Baby" who will give them "Unconditional Love"!The culture here is that the young girls mother gets to take care of her children,until her children have children,then it is her turn,and the cycle repeats it'self.My wife is now 28,and her mother is still taking care of our children,for the most part.My wife remains immature and carefree.Her time is coming,and I see her not wanting it to arrive!
As for "Family Sex",my wife was raped by an uncle,and she claims that it is not "uncommon" for that type of thing to happen.Believe me,I am very watchful in my house!
They actually give you several condoms when you arrive in a cabana.I have never heard of anyone actually using them however.Most "Working Girls" demand that their customers wear a condom.The first few times they are together.After that it is a sign of affection to stop asking!
As to the old arguement that "Sex Tourists Pervert a Country" "Bull$hit"!
I was a "Sex Tourist" for many years.Mostly in Southeast Asia.You don't go to a country and "wait" for the women to see all the foreighn men "waiting" to have sex,who then decide to become prostitutes.You go to a country where the local sex industry is already flourishing.Then you take advantage of that situation.Any country that has "Cabanas" has that culture.In a town like Santo Domingo.90 to 95 % of the men inthe clubs,bars,massage parlors,and houses are Dominicabs.It is closer to 100% in the "Barrios"!We didn't maake the women into "UBHs",we just came to taake advantage of the fact that they are pretty,young,available,aand by "our" standards,cheap!

 

[DRsScarface]

Proof

This shows you that the Dominican government should start spending on education instead of a state of the art Metro system. No matter how much you modernize the country the country will never prosper and become the best it can be because all we will have is a whole bunch of pregnant dumb girls getting on a train. You guys should also know that problems with teenage moms are also very common in the U.S. especially in the lower class population and some of the middle class. However, something that the U.S. has that the DR needs is a very good sex education program in which the students ask question about sex and the teacher(qualified) answers the questionss. The government should concentrate on getting sex ed. teachers all over the the country. If we get drunk the whole semana santa than we are obviously not the most Catholic country in the world so we should just stop avoiding the problem and find a solution.

 

[Larry]

Imagine, that was only in one hospital in Santiago, away from the tourists.

I wonder what the results are at any of the medical centers in Puerto Plata or elsewhere where many lonely European and North American men vacation.

Seriously, how could anyone think that the percentage of underage pregnancies caused by tourists could be anyway significant. I mean, let's be realistic Nal0whs. Just one time. I know you can do it.

Larry

 

[Pib]

Blaming the Catholic Church is an easy out! Dominicans are Catolics,but not "Practicing Catholics"!

Nobody is blaming the Catholic Church. You may have to check your humor-meter. What was briefly mentioned is that due to the Catholic Church influence there is not real sex-ed in schools. You can't argue that.

As with many things teenage pregnancy is a cycle, ignorant un-educated parents raise ignorant un-educated children who perpetuate the cycle. Of course middle-class kids get knocked up too, but the usual reactions are a discrete abortion, a quick marriage or simply keep the girl at home. But most everybody will insist that these girls continue their education and would support them. That is at least my experience.

As I said, comprehensible sex-ed would be a great step forward, but not the quick cure one wish we could find. Maybe it will take a couple of generations for these newly-enlightened teenagers to produce kids that will receive at home the skills and information necessary to have a healthy sex life. Burying the head in the sand won't help.

 

[Larry]

Sex education, the Catholic church and all the rest of the things I am reading here have absolutely no bearing on underage pregnancies. First of all, by the time children are 12 years old, they all know how pregnancies occur. They are aware that condoms prevent pregnancies. Whether condoms may be available to them or not due to their financial situations is a different story. Having a sex ed class where the teacher stands up in front of the room and goes into detail about fallopian tubes and sperm and eggs and cycles and so on really makes no difference because by the time boys and girls are 12 years old....no matter where they are, they understand how pregnancies occur. Girls understand that if a boy cumms in the they can get pregnant and boys understand that if they cumm in a girl, they can get her pregnant. In the grand scope of the topic, thats really all they need to know. And the Catholic church telling kids that premarital sex is a sin has not, does not now and will not keep these children from having sex. The reason why impovershed girls are more likely to have a baby while underage is because in their communities, it is acceptable. Thier mothers or older sister or someone in their family has already done it and it would not be so much of a shock to everyone if they became pregnant underage so there is not so much to fear. Middle or upper class girls, on the other hand, would face alot more 'disapproval' for lack of a better term if they had a child underage. As a result of this backlash of 'disapproval' they are more likely to force the boy they are having sex with to use a condom or as Pib said, get an abortion if they did become pregnant. This not only applies to the DR but any country anywhere. The reason why the DR has so many children having children is because most of the population is poor and in those poor communities, the underage mother is simply a cycle that repeats itself over and over again. Introducting sex education would make no difference and religion means nothing. Having a child is acceptable, plain and simple.

Larry

 

[NALs]

Seriously, how could anyone think that the percentage of underage pregnancies caused by tourists could be anyway significant. I mean, let's be realistic Nal0whs. Just one time. I know you can do it.

Larry

There is only one way to find out and speculating on "let's be real" is not the most efficient way.

 

[la flor]

By the way, I have never been on the pill, but about a year and a half ago a workmate asked me to stop at the pharmacy and buy her some on my way from lunch. It was about 750.00 pesos for a month supply, maybe that one brand is particularly expensive, but I don't see how someone with limited income can afford that.

wow im blown away from this info! I guess in your last year of school when they took everyone to that seminar at the church it must of been too late for many.. too bad they dont do that at an early age.
what is 750.00 pesos in U.S. about for birth control? I assume if this is expensive, then abortions must be out of the question. are there alot of abortion clinics, and would it be common for young girls to get them?

 

[ALB3]

Rest assured that European women all over the place (can't speak for the North Americans) are doing just the opposite to add beauty and color to the paleness of our population.

HA!!

You hit the nail on the head with that one.

 

[ALB3]

I agree with Robert and Don Tomas.
On my first visits to the DR I was amazed by the amount of 'under18' single mothers. But this is not a typical DR problem. I am sure the same goes for poor areas in Brasil, Mexico, etc. Even in Europe, you find regions that are economically lagging behind and are suffering from the same problem. A couple of years ago, I was making a business trip to Northeast England (Newcastle, Sunderland): I was shocked by the number of teenage mothers with babies I saw there in the shopping malls.
I think we pay more attention to it when we are on holiday abroad but often don't realize the social problems that exist in our own countries.
Bartolomeo

You're correct. This problem exists in Puerto Rico as well.

 

[Pib]

wow im blown away from this info! I guess in your last year of school when they took everyone to that seminar at the church it must of been too late for many.. too bad they dont do that at an early age.

Actually that course was of very little practical use. My two classmates that had gotten pregnant during our last year had been already expelled from our school. There was a lesson there: zero tolerance for un-wed pregnancies. Whether that was a good lesson is a matter open to debate.

what is 750.00 pesos in U.S. about for birth control? I assume if this is expensive, then abortions must be out of the question. are there alot of abortion clinics, and would it be common for young girls to get them?

That is about US$25.00. It doesn't sound like a lot, but it is when you are making about 4000.00 pesos a month, or worse if you are a teenager with no income. I know that ProFamilia sells a cheaper version, but I have very little information about that form of contraception to speculate how much it costs.

 

[ALB3]

Where is the Responsibility??

This shows you that the Dominican government should start spending on education instead of a state of the art Metro system. No matter how much you modernize the country the country will never prosper and become the best it can be because all we will have is a whole bunch of pregnant dumb girls getting on a train. You guys should also know that problems with teenage moms are also very common in the U.S. especially in the lower class population and some of the middle class. However, something that the U.S. has that the DR needs is a very good sex education program in which the students ask question about sex and the teacher(qualified) answers the questionss. The government should concentrate on getting sex ed. teachers all over the the country. If we get drunk the whole semana santa than we are obviously not the most Catholic country in the world so we should just stop avoiding the problem and find a solution.

I completely agree with all that the key to breaking this cycle is education and that is a task that falls not only on the government but the parent(s) as well. Yes, the majority of young ladies in this situation come from the lower rungs of the economic ladders but I personally know a handful of middle-class "families" where the father has abandoned his wife and children. Are there any laws or mechanisms in the DR to force some kind of responsibility on the male in any form, not just child support payments? Why is it that some many men who are sin verguenza allowed to get away with getting one or more women/girls pregnant without any repercussions?

 

[Robert]

RD$750 = US$26

The going rate for an abortion is around RD$15,000 (US$500).
This could well be a "gringo rate" as I'm sure in some clinics they do them for less and obviously depends on what stage the girl is at.

The contraceptive injections (DMPA) are around RD$3-5,000 (lasts 3 months)
These are becoming more common.

 

[Robert]

The following quote from another thread sums up the mentality that is prevalent in many families here in the DR.

http://www.dr1.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38404

When she was 15 one of her father's brothers, Ramoncito, introduced her to Luis Alvarez, a 54 year old bachelor (and about 8 years older than her father) from Bani who already had 31 children with various women. Before that Altagracia had had one almost boyfriend who she had kissed on one occasion. She found Luis handsome and liked him and they were quickly married. Her mother, Anna, was only 13 when she herself got married.

I'm sure things will change slowly, but I feel it's not my job to indoctrinate people with my own moral values. This is a problem that Dominicans need to resolve, regardless of how some "foreigners" view it.