Haiti is not DR's Responsibility

NotLurking

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Jul 21, 2003
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Sto Dgo Este
Oh one last thing...

daddy1 said:
The U.S. has it's problem's I did not call it perfect, and as far as welfare benfits to immigrants: if you have children born in America you will recieve govt assistance if you can't support yourself regardless of your migrant status...

This is not correct! The child, now a US citizen by law (8. U.S.C. 1401(a)), will receive assistance. Did you get that? The newly born US citizen is the one entitled to benefits not an illegal alien. In fact the illegal alien is entitled to repatriation and sometimes is.

NotLurking
 

JANET/NJ

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being that im 1/2 dominican

i would have to say that the most prominent problem here is not how many dominicans are illegal in other countries or how many haitians are.
Yes haiti is a poor country, the goverment does not help its people and families are suffering......but has anyone taken a good look at DR's poverty problems?

Dominicans have their own poverty and suffering families. How can DR be expected to provide for haitians ( in means of giving them jobs and accepting them into the country) when most of its own citizens are without jobs, education etc.

DR is receiving both good and bad haitians into the country, like they don't have enough with the "dominican maliantes" that are being deported from here who after having money and good clothes from hustling here find themselves down there with nothing and becoming thieves themselves.

DR has its own problems to deal with.


Janet/NJ
 

Mr_DR

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JANET/NJ said:
i would have to say that the most prominent problem here is not how many dominicans are illegal in other countries or how many haitians are.
Yes haiti is a poor country, the goverment does not help its people and families are suffering......but has anyone taken a good look at DR's poverty problems?

Dominicans have their own poverty and suffering families. How can DR be expected to provide for haitians ( in means of giving them jobs and accepting them into the country) when most of its own citizens are without jobs, education etc.

DR is receiving both good and bad haitians into the country, like they don't have enough with the "dominican maliantes" that are being deported from here who after having money and good clothes from hustling here find themselves down there with nothing and becoming thieves themselves.

DR has its own problems to deal with.


Janet/NJ
Say it loud Janet.
 

sean daniel

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I don't think numbers are the issue here.

rellosk said:
While I agree with your point of view regarding the double standard, I would like to know where you came up with your estimates of illegal Dominicans in the US. They seems kind of high.


Who cares what the correct number of illegal Dominicans are? The point is
that they are ilegal. And if we want equality and fairness across the International community, I think the same priniciple should be upheld
across the board. If DR wants to deport and repatriate Haitians in such
an ugly fashion, then by all means let the Dominican Roundup begin in the
USA!!!! That would be justice. I also feel that all UN nations should boycott
DR as long as the island continues to behave in its current manner towards Haitians.

Enough said.
 

Mr_DR

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sean daniel said:
Who cares what the correct number of illegal Dominicans are? The point is
that they are ilegal. And if we want equality and fairness across the International community, I think the same priniciple should be upheld
across the board. If DR wants to deport and repatriate Haitians in such
an ugly fashion, then by all means let the Dominican Roundup begin in the
USA!!!! That would be justice. I also feel that all UN nations should boycott
DR as long as the island continues to behave in its current manner towards Haitians.

Enough said.
FYI,
Illegal Dominicans do get deported when they are caught.
You must not know about all the dominicans in the USA that are waiting to be deported.
 

sean daniel

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ok

Mr_DR said:
FYI,
Illegal Dominicans do get deported when they are caught.
You must not know about all the dominicans in the USA that are waiting to be deported.

You missed the point.

Yes, Dominicans are deported but not with the swiftness and vigor of Haitians in Dominican Republic. Touche' on your point, however, in the interest of equality, I feel that the US and other nations should boycott
Domincan VISA requests until the Dominican Republic takes a serious internal look at their treatment of Haitians. There's no earthly justification for it. The more I learn of it the more it sickens me.
 

sean daniel

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A prominent problem?

JANET/NJ said:
i would have to say that the most prominent problem here is not how many dominicans are illegal in other countries or how many haitians are.
Yes haiti is a poor country, the goverment does not help its people and families are suffering......but has anyone taken a good look at DR's poverty problems?

Dominicans have their own poverty and suffering families. How can DR be expected to provide for haitians ( in means of giving them jobs and accepting them into the country) when most of its own citizens are without jobs, education etc.

DR is receiving both good and bad haitians into the country, like they don't have enough with the "dominican maliantes" that are being deported from here who after having money and good clothes from hustling here find themselves down there with nothing and becoming thieves themselves.

DR has its own problems to deal with.


Janet/NJ


You think Dominican Republic has problems now?
Picture this:
Send all the Haitians back to their poor country,
and let the Dominicans take care of their own
sugar crops and other field labor in which the majority of
Dominicans currently do not engage.

Then, you'd have even bigger problems than the one's you've described here.
 
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Mr_DR

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sean daniel said:
You think Dominican Republic has problems now?
Picture this:
Send all the Haitians back to their poor country,
and let the Dominicans take care of their own
sugar crops and other field labor in which the majority of
Dominicans currently do not engage.

Then, you'd have even bigger problems than the one's you've described here.
It will not hurt much because sugar is no longer a vital economic factor for the country.....It isn't even 10% anymore.
 
Nov 5, 2004
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Rocky said:
Dominicans in general do not like Haitians, and for good reason.
The Haitians invaded the whole isand at one time and enslaved the Dominicans. That's more than enough reason to not like them.
Why in the world would they want to let illegal Haitians live here, or even legal ones for that matter?
It's tantamount to European countries that were formally occupied by the Germans, being asked to let the Nazis live in their countries.
There's no mystery here.
Let the Haitian government appeal to countries for help that are more receptive to their pleas.

Ok. I admit I haven't read the whole thread..may be writting some stuff that is already covered....don't want to make enemies..don't like to argue here...

But my biggest pet peeve in the WHOLE world is racism..and I didn't like the way this post sounded...no offense Rocky(I am not talking just to u, but to all ppl with similar comments)..but I had to say something..not that you are racists...but I just really *needed* to say something on this post once I read it...

Rocky said:
Dominicans in general do not like Haitians, and for good reason.
The Haitians invaded the whole isand at one time and enslaved the Dominicans. That's more than enough reason to not like them.

It is NEVER EVER a good reason, no matter WHAT it is, to not like a certain race of ppl!!!! You cannot generalize to say something like that ever!!!

You can never base one whole rase of ppl on something that happened in the past, or on a group of ppl from that race!!!!

I know there are things that have happened in history, and make it hard to break a certain mold of thinking.

For example..in Alberta, Canada (Edmonton to be specific..where I grew up). Many ppl look down on natives (aboriginal people) and say they are all drunks..etc.etc.etc. Now there is the "they were here first" argument, first of all....second, there are MANY native ppl who do not fit into this sterotype.

This is the EXACT same as Haitians and Dominicans. (Some of them made it hard for the others..and some just by "habi"t fall into the sterotype and make it even worse)

And I BET you, you can find a similar example anywhere in the world:

A certain group of ppl looked down apon because of what happened in the past (history), and parts of them continuing to make the sterotype worse, by jsut "going along with them", and doing the negative things expected of them. However it is totally unfair to EVER judge one entire race of ppl on this.

Don't EVER forget the ppl who are not like their "sterotype" and have sometimes, a daily struggle to break the views held of them.

Not sure if I really expressed what I mean...but I hope in some way what I'm saying makes sense to some ppl...maybe I will edit and clairfy later today...
 

paddy

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what about the the united states...where everyone is a "foreigner" that lives there..when you think about it...despite that fact that some people seem to forget .blacks were the only people that were forced to come to america..
they prospered ..along with the millions of europeans and asians that came to make a better life for themselves..and did. without them ..the us would probably be another 3rd world country. over the years the united states went to war with almost every country on this planet ...starting with britain..today the us is a much stronger nation because all these differences were resolved...and to make a real long story short...these "warring" people came together and made the us what it is today. what haiti and the dr need to do is "bury the hatchet"..they share a "goldmine"..that beautiful island..so instead of fighting .. and scrambling for the crumbs that the tourists and the foreigners leave them...they should learn how to get along and take advantage this paradise that god gave them.
 

sean daniel

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oh?

Mr_DR said:
It will not hurt much because sugar is no longer a vital economic factor for the country.....It isn't even 10% anymore.

less than 10%, you say?

Well please enlighten me:

IF not sugar, then what other forms of inferior labor
are they involved in? You know, those jobs that
the rest of you all won't do? those jobs that require
exploitation of uneducated and/or undocumented workers?

And be honest, because the truth is already known,
but what comes from horse's mouth is precious, you know?

So, do tell.
 

paul

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www.angelfire.com
not a new issue

http://www.nchr.org/rmp/archive/refouler.htm



"Dominican Republic Launches Massive Deportation of Haitian Residents
NCHR Expresses Grave Concern

February 12, 1997 -- The Dominican Republic has launched a new, sweeping program to detain and deport Haitian immigrants residing "illegally" in the country, a program that has already led to the repatriation of nearly 15,000 Haitians and Dominicans of Haitian descent and could reach levels not seen since then-President Balaguer expelled 30,000 to 50,000 Haitians (and Dominicans of Haitian descent) across the border in 1991. The National Coalition for Haitian Rights (NCHR) has expressed grave concern about the arbitrary and abusive nature of the deportation process, its potentially destabilizing effect on Haiti, and the abysmal failure of both the Haitian and Dominican governments to seriously pursue longer-range solutions to this long-standing migration problem.

"The issue is not whether the Dominican government has the right to deport individuals residing in the country illegally," said Patrick Gavigan, director of NCHR's Refugee and Migration Program, who spent the first week in February in the Dominican Republic investigating the repatriations. "The government clearly has that right. The issues are more complicated and have to do with the arbitrary and abusive way in which the repatriations are carried out and the refusal of the Dominican government to officially legalize the large numbers of Haitians who have the right to reside here. These include the second- and third- generation children of Haitian immigrants who were born in the country and are thus entitled to nationality under the Dominican constitution. These individuals are Dominican, not Haitian, citizens. A second group includes Haitian cane cutters and their families brought into the country legally since the 1950s who never have been given a permanent resident visa or any other immigration documentation. These two groups make up a large part of the Haitian population in the Dominican Republic."

"The greatest outrage," concludes Gavigan, "is the refusal of both governments to face up to the difficult political decisions that each side must make to end this destabilizing cycle. If additional resources and technical assistance are necessary -- and they are -- both governments should jointly seek international assistance. Current aid and investment programs in Haiti should be refocused on migration-related structural issues. It is simply irresponsible to say that only economic growth in Haiti will take care of this problem -- that prospect is decades away. Reasonable steps should be taken now by both states working together on a painful and difficult, but mutual problem that threatens each state equally"


Haiti once ruled the Island- and when war spills over the borders again who knows who will be the victor- common myth says it is he with the most to gain- not the one with the most to lose. Dispell war with equality. Incite it with hostility.
 
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paddy said:
what about the the united states...where everyone is a "foreigner" that lives there..when you think about it...despite that fact that some people seem to forget .blacks were the only people that were forced to come to america..
they prospered ..along with the millions of europeans and asians that came to make a better life for themselves..and did. without them ..the us would probably be another 3rd world country. over the years the united states went to war with almost every country on this planet ...starting with britain..today the us is a much stronger nation because all these differences were resolved...and to make a real long story short...these "warring" people came together and made the us what it is today. what haiti and the dr need to do is "bury the hatchet"..they share a "goldmine"..that beautiful island..so instead of fighting .. and scrambling for the crumbs that the tourists and the foreigners leave them...they should learn how to get along and take advantage this paradise that god gave them.

well said paddy.
 

NALs

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It is NEVER EVER a good reason, no matter WHAT it is, to not like a certain race of ppl!!!! You cannot generalize to say something like that ever!!!
Being a Haitian or Dominican is not a race, but a nationality.

Ah, why am I even bothering.

Too many people here acting as if they hang around with their personal enemies in their day to day personal living...

I certainly avoid any personal people whom "don't click well with me", I suppose an entire country can do that as well with any other country that does not tick too well with them.

The US in the 1940s with their dislike of the Japanese comes to mind, but for much more updated example, let's leave it at US vs. Haitians, for the sake of common ground.

Aside from Africans, Haitians have the hardest time getting into the US of all the peoples and when mass illegal migration swells, Haitians are severely watched by the authorities more so than other immigrants, to the point of US coast guard boats reaching Haitian waters to stop any would be Haitian migrant fleeing to Miami only a few kilometers off the coast of Haiti.

I have not heard of US taking such measures with Cuba, DR, even with Mexico, the US does not crosses into their territory (land and water).
 
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NALs

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sean daniel said:
You think Dominican Republic has problems now?
Picture this:
Send all the Haitians back to their poor country,
and let the Dominicans take care of their own
sugar crops and other field labor in which the majority of
Dominicans currently do not engage.

Then, you'd have even bigger problems than the one's you've described here.
This will force Dominican sugar estates to promote and use the most productive labor for harvesting sugar and in such case, that would mean modernizing the cane cutting process. (ie. Getting efficient machines as oppose to lots of men with machetes).

The problem you claim are just not feasible given the nature of globalization and how quickly simple productivity problems can be fixed, if the Haitian deal is removed as you mentioned.

I say simple, because machines are much more efficient and economically viable if a large low wage labor pool is not available in a given economy. Removing the Haitian from the Dominican equation would put the DR in such position.

This will simply mean modernization in a sector that has lagged behind other sectors of the economy. Our telecommunications sector is worldclass and a leader in Latin America, our infrastructure is the largest in the Caribbean and has improved considerably in the past 20 years, our ports have been modernized to keep up with demand as the economy has expanded through the years, etc etc etc.

Agriculture will simply be one more sector to be modernized if the Haitian section of the equation is removed. This will be so not because of the Haitians being Haitians, but because when you take away cheap labor (labor that is cheaper than operating a machine), the next best thing is machines.

The machines will reduce the number of job positions in the sugar cane cutting sector to a number that would be filled up by those Dominicans willing to do such thing. Afterall, many will like to cut cane - in an airconditioned state of the art agricultural masterpiece of modern techonology and inovation.
 
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Mr_DR

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Nal0whs said:
The machines will reduce the number of job positions in the sugar cane cutting sector to a number that would be filled up by those Dominicans willing to do such thing. Afterall, many will like to cut cane - in an airconditioned state of the art agricultural masterpiece of modern techonology and inovation.
Well said Nal0,
Sugar cane is so far down in the barrel that even the tourist industry surpassed it.
 

sean daniel

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Surely, you guys are not that simple.

Mr_DR said:
Well said Nal0,
Sugar cane is so far down in the barrel that even the tourist industry surpassed it.

Both of you are dancing around the issue.
Sugar production is just ONE example. Just ONE.
The point I'm trying to make is that illegal Haitians
provide cheap, exploitative labor that "real" Dominicans
apparently won't do. That could be anything from Agriculture
to Construction to laboratory guinea pigs. It doesn't matter.
DR benefits greatly from the Haitian cheap labor pool, and OF COURSE, technology can replace any type of human labor. BUT
that doesn't happen overnight and it doesn't come cheap. And in
the meanwhile, if there are no exploited illegals to do the bulk of the work,
then you have the PROBLEMS I was referring to earlier.
So yes, you can live without them, but with the time/money it takes to
replace them with machines and/or other people, the economy
will be affected, and an affected economy affects the lives of
the citizens.
 
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paddy

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thought you guys would be interested in this article...


Migration, as defined by the Webster dictionary, is the action of moving to another country or region to settle. Migratory rates in the Caribbean have been ascending in past years. Many people have left their native countries looking for a better way of life without considering the hardships that they might face when found in a different culture. Racism, as defined by the Webster Dictionary, is the practice of racial discrimination, persecution, segregation etc, based on a claim of racial superiority. Migratory groups are the subject of racism due to the economic and social implications of migration. When women belong to these marginalized groups they suffer an additional disadvantage due to gender prejudice. The effects of Migration and racism in the Caribbean are clearly observed in the islands of Haiti, Dominican Republic, and Puerto Rico.

Since early in the nineteenth century great masses of Haitian immigrants have been crossing the borders between the Dominican Republic and Haiti in the island of the Hispaniola. Haitians migrate to the Dominican Republic with hopes of finding jobs and a better way of life for themselves and their families. Haiti has been the main source of cane cutters for the Dominican Republic?s cane growers since the 1930?s. "Haitian labor is attractive to the Dominican Republic?s cane growers not just for its low cost and plentiful supply. The Dominicans security forces and sugar company labor supervisors can also control the work schedules and mobility of Haitian seasonal migrants in ways that would be considered unacceptable if applied to Dominican Nationals"(Martinez, 2). Haitian cane cutters are forced to work obligatory extra hours of labor, they are denied of a weakly day of rest, and a compulsory relocation to the sugar estates from non-sugar-producing areas of the Dominican Republic is also enforced. In the 1992 population census a total of 500,000 Haitians were documented as living in the Dominican Republic. A great majority of this total is composed of Haitian women that have "crossed the border" along with their male counterparts. Nevertheless, the economic situation of Haitian women is quite different than that of the Haitian men. "It is widely thought in the Dominican Republic that women on the sugar estates are an economic burden on their men. The provision of sexual services for pay to Haitian and Dominican men and the sale of cooked food to cane workers in the fields are virtually monopolies of Haitian women" (Martinez, 120). Haitian women also earn money as domestic servants in wealthy Dominican houses. "Even so, women on the sugar estates do not often earn enough either to gain effective economic independence from men or to make a lasting improvement in their standard of living"(Martinez, 120).

History of Dominican intolerance towards Haitian immigrants goes back to the 1930?s when Rafael Leonidas Trujillo, dictator in power in the Dominican Republic from 1930-1962, killed over 250,000 Haitian immigrants. As payment for his Haitian massacre, Trujillo was forced to pay an indemnity of twenty-five Dominican cents for each Haitian he killed. Haitian immigrants face social discrimination when they are forced to live in the bateyes segregated from other Dominican nationals. Dominicans blame Haitians for the present economic crisis in the Republic due to the lack of jobs for Dominican nationals. Haitians are also blamed for the contamination of the Republic with excessive amounts of trash and for the moral devaluation of the Dominican way of life (Haitian women constitute the majority of prostitutes in the Republic).

To solve the massive influx of Haitian immigrants the Dominican government has conducted a series of massive deportations that have lasted long periods of time. Many Haitians as well as Dominicans of Haitian descent were brutally deported in 1997. Edwin Parison, the Haitian consul in the Dominican Republic, stated that "the Dominican government has not changed the arbitrary way it rounds "Haitian-looking" individuals on the streets or in private homes, often separating family members. Parison also stated that Haitian officials had confirmed that many individuals deported by the Dominican government arrived in Haiti with valid Dominican passports or visas"(NCHR, web page).

Although Dominican nationals discriminate against the Haitian migrants fleeing their native country in search for a better way of life, migrating Dominicans also experience the same fate when escaping the acute economic crisis the country is facing since the 1980?s. Dominican migrants "often risk their lives by journeying across the perilous, shark infested Mona channel by boat (yola) to establish themselves in Puerto Rico"(Angueira, 96). Only forty percent will survive the trip due to harsh trip conditions. Many die due to extreme weather conditions and lack of food and water during the trip. To aggravate the situation, many Dominican "business men" make profit from these illegal trips and overfill the small yolas (boats) to the point where they can?t sustain the great loads and sink before making it to shore, killing all of its passengers. Out of the forty percent that makes it to shore only twenty percent get past the Puerto Rican authorities. The other twenty- percent is put in jail and sent back to the Dominican Republic. The twenty- percent that makes it past the Puerto Rican authorities is left to reside illegally in Puerto Rican suburbs. The majority of yoleros are women. "Dominican women?s migratory experiences entail a continuous struggle to advance and to protect their families. They view Puerto Rico as a place offering job opportunities. After settling, all too often they find that the reality fails to fulfill their expectation. Racial prejudice and stereotypes abound; the women are frequently perceived as strange, untrustworthy, dirty, ignorant, and disorderly"(Angueira, 98). Dominican women are discriminated against because of their darker color and "black characteristics". Sixty three percent of migrant Dominican women work in domestic services. Another small percent work as prostitutes and selling cooked food. As their Haitian counterparts, Dominicans in Puerto Rican are accused of steeling Puerto Rican jobs, increasing the crime rate and declining the "Puerto Rican way of life". "Prejudices against Dominican women is also manifested in the accusation that they are prostitutes, have too many children, and steel husbands from other women"(Angueira, 100). A clear example of this is a press release circulated in San Juan, Puerto Rico titled "The Dominican Plague." It stated: "Now the Dominican population is increasing on the island of Puerto Rico, and no one is talking about Puerto Rico?s overpopulation. Dominican women are giving birth like "guimas" in public hospitals. Prostitution is a Dominican bomb. Thousands of Puerto Ricans have already been trampled down by Dominicans. Dominicans insult them, intimidate them, and have forced thousands of Puerto Ricans to move. They are now taking over San Juan, Santurce, and Rio Piedras!" (Angueira, 101).

"For the Dominican men, migration tends to be less traumatic"(Angueira, 101). Dominican men get higher paying jobs compared to Dominican women as Operators, drivers, repair workers, etc.. Nevertheless, Dominican men show little gender inequality because both men and women confront "intense discrimination base on their scarce economic resources and their national origin"(Angueira, 109). On the other hand, those groups with higher resources tend to have a grater degree of gender inequality. In Puerto Rico, due to the much greater amount of women that migrate from the Dominican Republic, "Female headed households are associated with the feminism of poverty. Nearly seventy percent of female-headed households were below the poverty line" (Angueira, 106).

For those Dominicans that don?t find what they are looking for in Puerto Rico, and have the sufficient economic resources, migration to the United States is commonly an option. Once in Puerto Rico, the migration to cities like New York consists only of a plane trip. Once in the United States, the Dominican immigrant is faced with greater threats due to a more shocking change in culture. A different language and a different way of life prevent these Dominican immigrants from intermingling with the "American dream". Many face harsher discrimination and poverty. "Dominicans are the fastest growing major ethnic group in New York City during the 1980?s and are facing major economic difficulties, according to a study released by Teachers College and the Dominican Studies Institute at City College"(Columbia, WebPage). The Dominican Population is the poorest of all the major ethnic groups in New York. "The low and declining earnings of unskilled workers in New York constitute a formidable barrier for the Dominican population. And the decline of manufacturing as a sector of employment has had a devastating impact on Dominican workers, especially women"(Columbia, WebPages). An average annual salary of 11,347 dollars was reported for Dominican women in 1997, this is compared to 20,489 dollars for the overall female workforce. Dominicans are also underrepresented in the New York City public sector. "Indeed researchers reported that the absence of Dominican workers in government employment should be a matter of immediate attention for policymakers in the city"(Columbia, WebPage).

"During the 1980s the Dominican population in New York City grew from 125,000 to 332,713. They now constitute the second largest Hispanic group in the city; only Puerto Ricans outnumber them"(Columbia, WebPage). Puerto Ricans are the number one minority group in many of the United States (especially in New York) and are growing in numbers. Since the 1900 an annual average of 25,300 Puerto Ricans have migrated to the United States in search of a better way of life and with hopes that they too can achieve the "American Dream". "Today, about two million Puerto Ricans live in the U.S., compared with fewer than sixty thousand in 1935. Puerto Ricans living in the U.S. represent more than one-third of all Puerto Rican people and are the third largest oppressed national grouping in the U.S. after Blacks and Chicanos"(Garza, 28). Puerto Ricans migrate to the "mainland" due to a series of factors that include the island?s recent population increase, economic pressures and the lack of legal or political restrictions on migration. Another major factor influencing migration from Puerto Rico to the United States is the contract farm-working program. In this program Puerto Ricans were introduced to the United States to work in the farm. "The major difficulty surrounding the farm labor program has been the problems Puerto Ricans face when they seek to establish themselves permanently in small towns in farm areas. Complaints regularly arise from permanent residents that small rural towns are not prepared to provide recreational or ordinary community services to a population of different language and ethnic background; color has also complicated the problem, since many Puerto Ricans are defined on the mainland as colored, and meet with concomitant prejudice"(Fitzpatrick, 19). Discrimination is also evident in the big urban towns. Discrimination in employment is very common against Puerto Ricans living in the U.S. "Even when a job does not require complete proficiency in English, a Puerto Rican applicant with a heavy accent will often be turned away. And most civil services examinations are not given in Spanish, making it difficult for many Puerto Ricans to get Government jobs"(Garza, 30). Puerto Rican immigrant usually live in the worst slum areas due to their lower economic position, this in turn segregates Puerto Ricans into schools that receive less funding and are inferior to "white schools". "Racial judges and scandalous inadequate number of Spanish-speaking interpreters weight the scales against Puerto Ricans in the courts. The proportion of Puerto Ricans in jail is higher than their proportion as a whole. Language discrimination not only makes it difficult to get jobs or descent education, it pervades every aspect of social and political life"(Garza, 32).

"Puerto Rican women suffer the added burden of sexual discrimination and abuse characteristic of capitalist society. The are especially the victims of prejudices and traditions of machismo and the Catholic Church"(Garza, 33). One fifth of Puerto Rican women in the U.S. are the principal economic head of their families. Nevertheless, discrimination makes it more difficult for women to obtain and keep their jobs compared to their male and white counterparts. In addition, Puerto Rican women are forced (by subterfuge and blackmail) by racist hospital administrators and doctors who want to prevent the growth of the "Puerto Rican Plague" to consider procedures like sterilization and hysterectomies. "Oppressed as part of the working class, as a national minority, and as women, Puerto Rican women today have a special stake in fighting for the Equal Rights Amendment"(Garza, 34).

In conclusion, migrant groups in the Caribbean are the subject of racism due to the economic and social implications of migration. When women belong to these marginalized groups they suffer an additional disadvantage due to gender prejudice. The social and economic implications of migration for Haitian, Dominican and Puerto Rican immigrants are very similar. These groups? migration patterns present a threat to the inhabitants of the nations they migrate to, putting in jeopardy the country?s jobs and well being.
 

atienoor

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Mar 8, 2004
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Oh yes, Haiti is DR's problem alright!

As long as the political, economic and social instability in Haiti continues, Haiti will be the DR's problem like it or not.

Bottom line, push and pull factors. Haiti has had no stability in many years. Over the last decade it recorded 0.0 per cent economic growth and -2.1 per cent per capita growth. DR on the other hand recorded an average 6.3 per cent per annum economic growth over the last decade and 4.5 per cent per capita.

Haitians want a better life for themselves so obviously, they will cross to the nearest DR and as well as to Guadalupe, Martinique etc.

The DR like other countries and regions which have had unstable neighbors should perhaps lead the international campaign to advocate for better governance in Haiti since amongst all its neighbors, it is the most affected. This has been done by the EU in the balkans through OSCE's efforts to promote peace and growth in former Yugoslavia, Kenya in the the Great Lakes of Africa etc.

And Haitians have to take responsibility for their country to demand for better governance as well.Blaming the ruling elite for bad governance and packing your bags is not good enough. Haitians need to also start taking responsibility and demanding change and better governance vis a vis lives for themselves. Some countries are screwed up because of the greater hand/powers who are interested in oil/gold/diamonds etc which makes it much more difficult for its citizens alone to bring about change. Case in point, Sudan, Angola, Democratic Republic of Congo, Liberia, Sierra Leone etc. This may not be the case in Haiti.

Deportations is a governments right, how it is done is another story all together. In the case of recent deportations, some international laws and human rigts laws have been violated.

Certain myths that people on this board and others hold about the Haitian migration into the DR:

a) That Haitian laborers are "passive victims"
b)The belief that discrimination against those of Haitian descent is uniquely caused by racism and anti- haitinism and that this is separate from the social divisions and inequities that exist in both countries.
c) That all those deported are only hiatians
d) Assumptions behind statements that Haitian immigration is detrimental to the economic development, society, culture and the identity of the DR
e)That los haitianos are an unassimilated and essentially Haitian (and therefore non-Dominican) population which has built up over generations.

Quoting the World bank as well as CIIR and a myriad of other sources. Shoot me if you will but thats my two cents worth!
 

Ricardo900

Silver
Jul 12, 2004
3,269
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Nice informative post Paddy

I've personally seen the discrimination in NYC and what makes it worse is that the Puerto Ricans discriminate against the Dominicans and the Mexicans segregate themselves from the rest. Can you imagine the poltical and economic force they could achieve if they united and helped each other.

Dominicans come to the US and work service oriented jobs at very low pay and they live in the worst areas on NYC. They will work 50+ hours a week for the next twenty years, just to scrape enough pesos to retire back at home. That is no way of living. The average cost of housing in a decent neighborhood in NYC, not a slum, is US$900 a month for a one-bedroom apartment, that means you need an income salary of $35,000 a year to qualify. That is $17 an hour, ha! You will not make $17-hour unless you have a great city job, (forget it, exam in english) skilled technician, (forget it, exams in english for a license) or White Collar, (forget it, need at least a Bachelors Degree). Also, Dominicans have to compete with all the other immigrants who are not willing to help.