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Haiti recalling Ambassador from DR
I do not understand the problem.The haitian already live in the DR like anybody else. I have more haitian neighbors than dominican. I live in Cerro Alto Santiago. Next to me is an abandon big house two dominican are since 5 years in the court about the ownership. Since 6 month living about 20 haitian , women, children and men there. everyday comes more. Nobody cares nobody ask them for the right to live there, they live in a big house without paying anything. The Dominican Republic is a paradise for them, They do what they won't, work without permission, get free healthcare at the hospitals. I do not know any country in the world who treats his illegals as good as the Dominicans.
Or are i am missing something?
Or are i am missing something?
What you're missing
For years, Haitians have been encouraged to do the dirty work Dominicans don't want to do, for example, cutting sugar cane, prostitution. Under Trujillo, they were massacred to reduce their cost to the DR. Probably left a few orphans. Haitians historically have been scapegoated for crime in the DR, which may occur, since their obvious African heritage keeps them out of better paying employment. Hispaniola is an island, the poorest third of which is Haiti. The problem with the Dominican law is that it violates fundamental human rights. Humanitarians are concerned that the law will lead to witch hunting Haitians.
For years, Haitians have been encouraged to do the dirty work Dominicans don't want to do, for example, cutting sugar cane, prostitution. Under Trujillo, they were massacred to reduce their cost to the DR. Probably left a few orphans. Haitians historically have been scapegoated for crime in the DR, which may occur, since their obvious African heritage keeps them out of better paying employment. Hispaniola is an island, the poorest third of which is Haiti. The problem with the Dominican law is that it violates fundamental human rights. Humanitarians are concerned that the law will lead to witch hunting Haitians.
Really? And if it's so bad for them in the DR why are they still there, why don't they go back home? Witch hunting Haitians?!?!?! lol!
If Dominicans wanted to "hunt" Haitians do you think that a piece of paper would
stop them?
If i understand your post right are you saying that Hispaniola is one country and the Dominican Republic has no rights to enforce
their laws on his territory.
The Dominican Republic has no right to trample human rights. The Haitian-Dominicans are being persecuted. My point about Hispanola is that the countries share an island, and a fire burning on one side of the island will spread to both. Kind of like Cholera.
Well you haven't uttered anything that isn't readily available in the public consumption, in fact, you've articulated some of the principal problems - who are the benefactors and who are being exploited. Now what is the politically incorrect solution? What are the harsh measures to being semblance of order to this cascading situation?
Previously, you'd cautioned me about not being emotional about two non important countries. I think you can heed your own advice pertaining to this situation.
Your ambassador has been recalled home effective Tuesday as a protest to highlight the recent verdict by the Dominican Constitutional Court. Is this a harsh move or a politically correct one?
From as long as I can remember, the Haitians have always been exploited. Instead of continuously saying that the Dominicans can do whatever they want, it's their country. What is Haiti doing, or has done, to curb this migration? Allowing generation after generation of its people to seek refuge in another country because they're almost dying in their homeland is irresponsible and neglectful to the highest degree. The first tenet of any government is the protection and security of its citizens.
DR business elites have a need and Haiti's poor are eager to fill that void. You said they (DR) want to have it both ways but it's not going to happen. Again, what is the solution to this bluster?
All around the world, we have people who arrived in the States as infants, were grown and nurtured here, then suddenly they committed crimes and are deported to their homelands. I shriek to state that they are returned home because they spent a majority of their lives living in a culture, diametrically opposed to what they eventually return to.
Most of those countries aren't just saying,"well America has a right to deport anyone who isn't a citizen." No! You have grassroots organizations fighting this law because it's creating an upsurge in crimes, additional burden on infrastructure, etc.
My point is that we are addressing people in dire need, for the most part, and both countries have to sit at the dialogue table seeking solutions. Sealing borders, preventing education, health care, and refusing employment, are all targets, however, common sense has to supersede irrationality.
Haiti recalling its ambassador is just for show ....trust me on that one...the haitian government could not care less about these dominican born people of haitian ancestry.
Haiti has 10 million of its own to worry about and an important diaspora in the USA and Canada to exploit.
These people in DR are not on the radar.
Yes going forward Haiti needs to be more involved on the border to stop people going east and goods being dumped west.
But there is absolutly NOTHING Haiti can do for people born in DR and are claiming their dominican nationality. That is a DR internal issue.
There is no absolute rule.
It is up to each country to decide as is the case today.
If a child of two haitians born in Germany and never mind they are legal or illegal, the child will NOT be granted German nationality. Is Germany tramping human rights? Never hart they are accused for that since 1945
But that's not the case in point. You will never see Germany or any other civilized country revoking their citizenship to whole generation of germans due to a "clarification" of an article in their constitution that dates more than half a centuey back. That is the case in point.
Gwozozo,
I was contemplating not to comment on this thread again because I've read so much and heard so much. I know that you're posting in the capacity of a civilian and not as an official in government. The dilemma is that the Dominicans aren't willing to concede and naturalize these people. Whether or not you believe it or not, these people are perceived as being Haitians whether or not they were born on the DR side of the border.
There's nothing stopping the Dominican officials to just rounding them up and transporting them to the border. They would only suffer the ire of the international communities, which wouldn't be the first time at all.
Those Dom/Haitians are part of the diaspora - like those you mentioned in USA and Canada. They send remittances back to Haiti just like the others to support their families. I am not in any way suggesting their remittances even comes close to those of the aforementioned countries.
Saying those compatriots aren't on the radar speaks volumes and I hope this is a selfishly held pronouncement, and not one that is generally shared in places of government.
These are people, according to you, rejected by their compatriots and also by Dominicans. God help them!
P.S.
If you get a chance, google the crisis between Rwanda and Tanzania in regards to deportation.
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1.- That nationaly was obtained Ilegaly, the constitution of 1966 says borns of people in transit are not Dominicans, our constitution says not to those one that visit the country LEGALY and will says YES are Dominicans if you come as Ilegal?
2.- A lot countries says NO to those inmigrants borns even if they arrived to the country Legaly in the case both parents are inmigrants and only obtain the born the citizenship if one of the parents are from the Country.
3.- They says they are not Haitins but they are descendant of Haiting, so if you go back Grandspa and ma born of ilegals are haitians, borns of those grandpa and ma are also Haitians, mother and fathers also Haitians, and daughters and son also Haitians.
I'm of the opinion that the aim of Leonel (cuz' let's be honest here, those people from the court are answerable to HIM) with this sentence is the following:
a) Give Danilo another source of problems, so he can come later and become "the savior".
b) Add more people to the army of the disenfranchised (therefore, legalizing slavery in the process).
c) With that date so far back (1929), he seeks to mask the fact that the current unending exodus found the doors of the country wide open under HIS watch, from 2004 onwards.
As a possible way to solve the matter, Jos? La Luz (from the radio program "El Sol de la Ma?ana") proposes the following:
a) Aside from overturning the current sentence that mainly affect the descendants of sugar cutters, he proposes for the Central Bank to make a study to ascertain the number of Haitians this economy is capable of withstanding.
b) After finding the "magic number" (whatever this might be) give full enfranchisement to these people. The right to elect and be elected, labor benefits, etc. that a national would enjoy.
c) Have a policy of "not one more", in the sense of putting fines up to a RD$1,000,000 to any public or private portentate found employing illegal inmigrants.
d) Take control of the border away from the military, and give it to a specialized force to create, with better pay, and most importantly, whose members would be carefully selected among society.
Until any and/or all of this is done, anything else will be making a storm in a glass of water, specially since laws in this country are rarely enforced in this country more than six months, unless the law in question is used to extort money out of the constituents, like CCCCCCC mentioned earlier. Besides, the constitution here is so NOT respected that any other party that comes to power would undo anything made by the opponent, specially by this political class of Guacanagarixes/Malinches, which are willing to do anything and everything in order to make themselves agreeable (hacerse los graciosos) in the eyes of foreigners.
How can their nationaliry have been obtained illegally if they were issued by the dominican state without any bribe or any other illegal acts by the newborns?
If the state was issuing citizenships by mistake (which domunicans should be ashamed to admit), then it is the dominican state that must assume the cost, not those who for generations have been living here. It's nonsense. And that's what no civilized county would do
And that's why DR is going to pay a high price internationally if they don't start to make some sense soon
If the state was issuing citizenships by mistake (which domunicans should be ashamed to admit), then it is the dominican state that must assume the cost, not those who for generations have been living here. It's nonsense. And that's what no civilized county would do
And that's why DR is going to pay a high price internationally if they don't start to make some sense soon
We are going to pay what? I think this is the time to solve that problem, Haitians and ONG has been acusing DR that we are the Bad of the Movie, but we are the ones that are giving them free health just to say one thing, they are all over the country and no body cares. so i think this is the time for us to do something, maybe now we have the balls and do what we should do long ago.
Glass ceiling..throwing stones...pay what? Do you have any idea of how much money DR receives in the form of international donations? Take half of those donations away (including Petrocaribe, which is effectively a gift) and dominicans could be looking for work in Haiti soon.
It could be looking as that as well even without sanctions soon. I don't know if you are aware of this, but Haitians are also starting to join the yoleros here in their attempts to reach PR, so that must tell you about the levels of unemployment here. The bottomline here is that, if the international community wants the DR to carry Haiti over its shoulders, the DR is under the obligation to ask them to put forward the $$$$$$$ to do it, cuz' at it stands, the current budget here isn't enough to cover the two, or in good Dominican "no hay cama pa' tanta gente".