Manny Ramirez turns to God (converts to Religion)

[Chip]

I agree - it is more offensive if you are a genuine believer.

It would really depend on what type of believer one is.

For example, Christians have generally come to accept failure as part of the human condition and understand forgiveness is paramount. Of course some Christians never got that message and I can't speak for other religions.

 

[Chirimoya]

I understand your point about being non-judgmental and I suppose that might lead me to give people like him, Lubrano and Vantroi the benefit of the doubt - but I'd have to be extremely naive and gullible.
Seriously, though, as a believer doesn't it bother you even a teeny weeny bit that he is almost certainly using what you regard as sacred as a cynical PR exercise? Wouldn't it be more sincere and credible if it wasn't done in public?

 

[Chip]

I understand your point about being non-judgmental and I suppose that might lead me to give people like him, Lubrano and Vantroi the benefit of the doubt - but I'd have to be extremely naive and gullible.
Seriously, though, as a believer doesn't it bother you even a teeny weeny bit that he is almost certainly using what you regard as sacred as a cynical PR exercise? Wouldn't it be more sincere and credible if it wasn't done in public?

For Manny to get up there in front of everybody and badmouth himself in front of his wife and kids and more publicly state he doesn't care about the hall of fame means to me he is giving it a real go. Will it last? Who knows. Still what has Manny really done that we know of? Be selfish jerk at times and mean to an old fellow. He certainly has killed anybody or robbed millions of dollars.

 

[pedrochemical]

He certainly has killed anybody or robbed millions of dollars.

Naaa, we would have heard about it on here..... lol

 

[Chip]

For Manny to get up there in front of everybody and badmouth himself in front of his wife and kids and more publicly state he doesn't care about the hall of fame means to me he is giving it a real go. Will it last? Who knows. Still what has Manny really done that we know of? Be selfish jerk at times and mean to an old fellow. He certainly has killed anybody or robbed millions of dollars.

oops, "He certainly has not killed anybody or robbed millions of dollars"

sorry, I'm having another bad Enlgish day.

 

[windeguy]

The only problem is most of the objective realists shouldn't be pointing any fingers.

Why do you think that? We only "believe" in what is real. We require proof and "point fingers" as you say when there is something to actually be pointed at.

So if he has changed, then why does he still refer to himself in the third person......he's washed up, and a cheater, and hasn't changed and no team should take a chance on him.....

That is my guess, but it is possible he really has changed.

Maybe we should have a subforum for the atheists on this board so they can all get together and bad mouth those God believers and then sing their version of kumbaya in celebration.

Objective realists don't have to "bad mouth" anyone. The actions of people who have been misled by their one true belief system is just obvious to us and speaks for itself for the entire world to see.

This is not about whether you believe in God or not, it is about athletes (Manny) that seem to find God everytime they want forgiveness. He also did the show with another washed up player, Ronnie Belliard. Why publicize it, why not do it in private? Agent stunt? I believe so. This is not the first time Manny has " found " God and I am sure it won't be the last. Actually if you think about it, it is rather insulting to use religion in this way. Why do you think they call it, jailhouse religion.....

Agreed. It smells like 3 day old fish.

 

[windeguy]

It would really depend on what type of believer one is.

For example, Christians have generally come to accept failure as part of the human condition and understand forgiveness is paramount. Of course some Christians never got that message and I can't speak for other religions.

Agreed that we all fail, but Is Manny really allowing himself to be kept under the control mechanism of sin, guilt, contrition, forgiveness used by Christianity and doing a rinse and repeat until death or is Manny just trying yet another angle to get back in the game? Only if he gets back in the game will there be a chance to find out.

 

[bob saunders]

Why do you think that? We only "believe" in what is real. We require proof and "point fingers" as you say when there is something to actually be pointed at.



That is my guess, but it is possible he really has changed.


Objective realists don't have to "bad mouth" anyone. The actions of people who have been misled by their one true belief system is just obvious to us and speaks for itself for the entire world to see.



Agreed. It smells like 3 day old fish.

Yet you do badmouth religion and religious people. You may not think that you do but your contempt comes across loud and clear. I'm not religious nor am I agnostic but I'm more of a live and let live, and as long as it doesn't affect me and mine in a negative way I have no problem with other people's religious beliefs. Manny certainly may be using religion as a way to get back in to baseball or he may really believe, either way it doesn't matter to me.

 

[kimbjorkland]

Yet you do badmouth religion and religious people. You may not think that you do but your contempt comes across loud and clear. I'm not religious nor am I agnostic but I'm more of a live and let live, and as long as it doesn't affect me and mine in a negative way I have no problem with other people's religious beliefs. Manny certainly may be using religion as a way to get back in to baseball or he may really believe, either way it doesn't matter to me.

That sounds like wishy washy Canadian tolerance - why don't you grow a pair and have an opinion and not be afraid to express it?

Religious beliefs don't 'affect' you because you don't have ovaries, and you don't have some sexless secretly homosexual former Nazi youth officer in the Vatican telling you that you're going to hell for taking birth control, or worst that using condoms in AIDS infected Africa is a bad thing not a good thing.

And yet, when Manny prostrates himself in front of these sexist jackasses, somehow in my country he gets a 'pass'. Oh well he's now found the Lord, he's a good guy now. Utter BS. Maybe Manny should rape some alter boys to get full forgiveness?

Anybody who has no contempt for religion must not have flown on a commercial flight lately - all those TSA rules stem from some stupid religion preaching death onto another stupid religion. Oh but I know, you're so Canadian Zen and mellow that you just live and let live through the TSA crotch pat down.

 

[Frank the Tank]

That sounds like wishy washy Canadian tolerance - why don't you grow a pair and have an opinion and not be afraid to express it?

Religious beliefs don't 'affect' you because you don't have ovaries, and you don't have some sexless secretly homosexual former Nazi youth officer in the Vatican telling you that you're going to hell for taking birth control, or worst that using condoms in AIDS infected Africa is a bad thing not a good thing.

And yet, when Manny prostrates himself in front of these sexist jackasses, somehow in my country he gets a 'pass'. Oh well he's now found the Lord, he's a good guy now. Utter BS. Maybe Manny should rape some alter boys to get full forgiveness?

Anybody who has no contempt for religion must not have flown on a commercial flight lately - all those TSA rules stem from some stupid religion preaching death onto another stupid religion. Oh but I know, you're so Canadian Zen and mellow that you just live and let live through the TSA crotch pat down.

Wow, you have issues. You are one angry elf.

 

[windeguy]

Yet you do badmouth religion and religious people. You may not think that you do but your contempt comes across loud and clear. I'm not religious nor am I agnostic but I'm more of a live and let live, and as long as it doesn't affect me and mine in a negative way I have no problem with other people's religious beliefs. Manny certainly may be using religion as a way to get back in to baseball or he may really believe, either way it doesn't matter to me.

If badmouthing to you is exposing religion for the farce and fantasy it is, then yes I do badmouth it. This thread was about Manny and I don't think religion is going to help him get forgiveness from the folks in charge of MLB.

 

[Chip]

If badmouthing to you is exposing religion for the farce and fantasy it is, then yes I do badmouth it. This thread was about Manny and I don't think religion is going to help him get forgiveness from the folks in charge of MLB.

Not to mention he said he doesn't care about the HOF.

 

[Berzin]

I don't care anything about Manny Ramirez other than the fact that he can't hit a baseball like he used to, which makes him essentially useless to me as a baseball fan.

To me his public self-flogging is nothing but a pathetic publicity stunt so that his wife won't leave him and so suckers who love drowning themselves in Catholic guilt have someone to masturbate over, as if having a former Hitler Youth as Pope isn't rapturous enough.

 

[cobraboy]

If it changes his behavior, so what?

Isn't that the litmus test?

 

[kimbjorkland]

Not really. Cocaine can change his behavior too. "Cocaine's a hell of a drug" - Charlie Murphey

 

[Chip]

I don't care anything about Manny Ramirez other than the fact that he can't hit a baseball like he used to, which makes him essentially useless to me as a baseball fan.

To me his public self-flogging is nothing but a pathetic publicity stunt so that his wife won't leave him and so suckers who love drowning themselves in Catholic guilt have someone to masturbate over, as if having a former Hitler Youth as Pope isn't rapturous enough.

Maybe you ought to look at his last full season before you say he can't bat.

Also the church he is with now is anything but Catholic.

 

[Berzin]

Maybe you ought to look at his last full season before you say he can't bat.

Correction-he can't bat without steroids.

 

[bob saunders]

Correction-he can't bat without steroids.

Steroids give you power but do nother for your hand eye coordination.

 

[Berzin]

Steroids give you power but do nother for your hand eye coordination.

Please explain this in detail, because it happens to not be true.

First of all, HgH does improve eyesight. Just ask anyone who takes the stuff who has less than perfect vision.

Second of all, bat speed is an integral proponent of hand-eye coordination.

More strength, more bat speed.

This is telling in older players who lose their abilities due to diminished physical qualities. How do you think Ramirez fell off so quickly after getting busted? The Ramirez who came back after his first suspension and couldn't swing the bat anymore is proof of what those 'roids were doing for him. For how long we don't know because he won't go into any details about it, but in his natural state he couldn't play anymore.

 

[ExtremeR]

Please explain this in detail, because it happens to not be true.

First of all, HgH does improve eyesight. Just ask anyone who takes the stuff who has less than perfect vision.

Second of all, bat speed is an integral proponent of hand-eye coordination.

More strength, more bat speed.

This is telling in older players who lose their abilities due to diminished physical qualities. How do you think Ramirez fell off so quickly after getting busted? The Ramirez who came back after his first suspension and couldn't swing the bat anymore is proof of what those 'roids were doing for him. For how long we don't know because he won't go into any details about it, but in his natural state he couldn't play anymore.

Pure hogwash, HGH does not have anything to do with eyesight, where do you find these baseless allegations??

More bat speed does not mean more hand-eye coordination, more Bravo Sierra....if in fact when you work out for a while you lose a bit of your hand-eye coordination and have to train really hard to get it back...

Power?? Yes steroids does help with power only if the ballplayer has immaculate hitting mechanics before shooting up..If you don't know how to hit natural, you won't know how to hit juiced up, plain and simple.

I'd like to listen the opinion of people who have ACTUALLY played baseball..