As far as I am aware, there is some protection in law here for "squatters", provided they have been on the property more than 7 or 8 years. Anyone able to enlighten me on this? I'm not, of course, saying these people were, either knowingly or unknowingly, squatters. I simply don't know. They are certainly people.
- Thread starter Peter & Alex
- Start date
Unrest Outside Cabarete
No apologies needed. I don't take it personally and I respect everybody's right to their opinions.KrackedKris said:Who adjudicated the squatters as bad guys, who issued warrants to enter and destroy, who issued orders to fire on civilians for what reason.
Who are the owners? I thoght this swas carried out by Military police, not a civil action?
Rocky, your "logic" is very flawed
Rocky
Sorry to get "personal" with this, but you obviously beleive in the action of this Government, I take the side of civil and human rights Best we don't respond "tit for tat" I guess
I might add that I do not support Hippo's government, quite the contrary.
If what happened there a couple of days ago was Hippo in action, I would be really surprised.
My guess, for what it's worth, is that the rightful owner of the land has been trying to recover his land for a long time and finally got a court backed decision that allowed for the physical removal of the squatters.
I know some of the people who were affected, like Mick, for example, and a great guy that he is, hard working, honest, sincere... one of the good guys in our community, and I feel sorry for him. There's no way he did anything wrong.
I'm sure somebody was collecting rent from him, and obviously it was not the true owner.
Anybody who knows me well will tell you that I'm the good guy's best friend and the bad guy's worst enemy.
This is my self assigned role in life and I like to think that I play my part in improving the community spirit in Sosua.
I have learned over the years of living here that life is not so black and white as I thought it was and it's often difficult to tell who the good guys are and who are the bad guys, but once I know for sure, I don't let go.
I have a pitbull-like mentality when it comes to bad guys and I spend a lot of time, on a daily basis, assisting those who are in danger of being victimized by local scam artists.
You and I have varying opinions on squatters, as you see them as people with human rights and I see them as land thieves.
I cannot, in good conscience, support thieves. I've been on the receiving end of people stealing my things, and I don't like it.
If I own some land and somebody is stealing it from me, I will fight to my dying breath. There's no gray area in my mind about this. It is a clear case of black and white.
KrackedKris said:
You were obviously a long ways from Waco when it happenned, I wasn't. Words like "rescue" and "warrant" have nothing to do with Waco. But this is completelyu off-topic, I just couldn't ignore it.
Fact on Waco. The F.B.I. had warrants for some of the people inside the house and was trying to arrest them. The warrants were issued for ?Possession of Sawed off Shotguns?. This is when you purchase a legal shotgun and saw off the barrel. They had no other legal charges against anyone for anything else. All of these people died because the F.B.I. charged some people with sawing off the barrels of shotguns.
I Know, you were an "insider" at Waco, or your friends, friends 3rd cousin knew...
Ok Mr. Mike
Tell me there were no warrants issued by a properly elected and incorporated Government entity
tell me the ATF and FBI did not attempt to rescue any fallen men from the first abortive attempts
Resist the twisting of words and answer those specific questions
Waco is a polarizing situation, but due process, however flawed, was followed. This was hardly a situation where armed men and vehicles just showed up un announced and started firing
Again, I don't agree with Waco but there was a process, appeals, stays etc followed
Koresch and his group could have got out, they were not surprised, they chose to stay and fight for what they believed in
I don't think many of the Dominicans in Cabarete had assault rifles, Molotov cocktails, .50 rifles and the like
I guess we could make an argument for the Haitian Invasion in the 1800's being similar to Hiroshima, both sides wanted something
Makes as much sense as your post
:tired:
MrMike said:
Ok Mr. Mike
Tell me there were no warrants issued by a properly elected and incorporated Government entity
tell me the ATF and FBI did not attempt to rescue any fallen men from the first abortive attempts
Resist the twisting of words and answer those specific questions
Waco is a polarizing situation, but due process, however flawed, was followed. This was hardly a situation where armed men and vehicles just showed up un announced and started firing
Again, I don't agree with Waco but there was a process, appeals, stays etc followed
Koresch and his group could have got out, they were not surprised, they chose to stay and fight for what they believed in
I don't think many of the Dominicans in Cabarete had assault rifles, Molotov cocktails, .50 rifles and the like
I guess we could make an argument for the Haitian Invasion in the 1800's being similar to Hiroshima, both sides wanted something
Makes as much sense as your post
:tired:
Try to get a few salient facts correct before hijacking the thread
ATF, not FBI was the lead agency
Illegal firearms are a Fed crime. Fed arrest warrants can and need to be served. Everyone charged was given multiple opportunities to surrender, surrender to a lawyer, turn themselves in etc
Must be time for Ruby Ridge and Wounded Knee now
What is hell is this to do with Soldiers showing up un announced in Cabarete, crushing dwellings and firing at it;s own citizens without provocation or authority to do so?
Anyone can twist a topic to suit their wacked out dreams, stick to the issue, which is not the legality of the US ATF in Waco Texas, it is the Dominican Military in Caberete. I can draw you a map if need be
SKY said:
ATF, not FBI was the lead agency
Illegal firearms are a Fed crime. Fed arrest warrants can and need to be served. Everyone charged was given multiple opportunities to surrender, surrender to a lawyer, turn themselves in etc
Must be time for Ruby Ridge and Wounded Knee now
What is hell is this to do with Soldiers showing up un announced in Cabarete, crushing dwellings and firing at it;s own citizens without provocation or authority to do so?
Anyone can twist a topic to suit their wacked out dreams, stick to the issue, which is not the legality of the US ATF in Waco Texas, it is the Dominican Military in Caberete. I can draw you a map if need be
Wow.
Why are you guys jumping all over each other?
Sky didn't say anything about who was the lead agency going into Waco.
Just that the FBI had arrest warrants.
You're reading in between the lines for something that isn't there, and you don't know that there wasn't due process before the Cabarete event, do you?
To make matters worse, you still didn't understand that I used Waco as an example of two opposing forces with different viewpoints creating violence.
You seem to want the situations to be identical. They are not.
I never said that, didn't infer that, just stated a fact.
These things often get violent.
You ask Mr Mike to "Tell me there were no warrants issued by a properly elected and incorporated Government entity".
Can you tell me that there were no warrants issued by a properly elected and incorporated Government entity in the Cabarete situation?
Do you have the inside track or are you just guessing?
Now I really wish I hadn't even mentioned Waco.KrackedKris said:
Why are you guys jumping all over each other?
Sky didn't say anything about who was the lead agency going into Waco.
Just that the FBI had arrest warrants.
You're reading in between the lines for something that isn't there, and you don't know that there wasn't due process before the Cabarete event, do you?
To make matters worse, you still didn't understand that I used Waco as an example of two opposing forces with different viewpoints creating violence.
You seem to want the situations to be identical. They are not.
I never said that, didn't infer that, just stated a fact.
These things often get violent.
You ask Mr Mike to "Tell me there were no warrants issued by a properly elected and incorporated Government entity".
Can you tell me that there were no warrants issued by a properly elected and incorporated Government entity in the Cabarete situation?
Do you have the inside track or are you just guessing?
Kris,
You are expressing a whole lot of rightous indignation about this situation in Cabarete. I live here and don't have the facts yet and have actually been there many times from the first day forward. What are you basing all these feelings on other than first glance?
I try to have information before forming an opinion. I may give an opinion about what will or can happen here in the future by my experience watching how things happen here but you are in every thread expressing opinions based on very little info that is available.
Wouldn't it be a better idea to wait and form the opinions after the info is available instead of jumping to all sorts of conclusions regarding the rights and wrongs of what went on?
Perhaps you "Get it" and I don't and in that case how about explaining it to me?
Scott
PS> sorry, back to Ruby Ridge, Waco and all the other lunatics...
You are expressing a whole lot of rightous indignation about this situation in Cabarete. I live here and don't have the facts yet and have actually been there many times from the first day forward. What are you basing all these feelings on other than first glance?
I try to have information before forming an opinion. I may give an opinion about what will or can happen here in the future by my experience watching how things happen here but you are in every thread expressing opinions based on very little info that is available.
Wouldn't it be a better idea to wait and form the opinions after the info is available instead of jumping to all sorts of conclusions regarding the rights and wrongs of what went on?
Perhaps you "Get it" and I don't and in that case how about explaining it to me?
Scott
PS> sorry, back to Ruby Ridge, Waco and all the other lunatics...
SKY said:
Sky!
Just to set the record straight!!!
All of the people that were killed at Waco (with the exception of the Federal Agents) were terminated by their OWN people, who then proceeded to commit suicide! Those are the FACTS, plain and simple!
Many false rumors were, and have been, spread by malicious gossip about the Feds, reference the deaths.
Tank type vehicles from Ft. Hood were employed to force entry to the one building thought to be occupied by the Davidians. When these tanks commenced their actions, the Davidians set fire to the structure and commenced murdering their own people.
That's an eye witness report from one who was there and saw the whole operation, other inaccurate reports nothwithstaning!
If you have any contrary OFFICIAL evidence, then PM me, but for heaven's sake, don't repeat all the malicious, anti-Fed, retoric that floated around immediately following that tragic event.
Texas Bill
Thank you all....BUT
Athough there may be comparison between the WACO & Cabarete incidents, OR not, in theory or perception, can we please keep this on topic?
The thread has become extensively long on the 'misinterpretation' aspect.
I think it best be responded to the interest of what is merely going on in the 'here and now' in Cabarete and surrounding areas. No one I know here on this board was in WACO, but several are in the Cabarete area.
Please guys, plan a date to meet at Rocky's or something to have your debates! I'm sure you'd all have a good laugh over a few presidentes after all is said and done!
Just a request.
Thank you!
Athough there may be comparison between the WACO & Cabarete incidents, OR not, in theory or perception, can we please keep this on topic?
The thread has become extensively long on the 'misinterpretation' aspect.
I think it best be responded to the interest of what is merely going on in the 'here and now' in Cabarete and surrounding areas. No one I know here on this board was in WACO, but several are in the Cabarete area.
Please guys, plan a date to meet at Rocky's or something to have your debates! I'm sure you'd all have a good laugh over a few presidentes after all is said and done!
Just a request.
Thank you!
Why do you insist on changing the subject, it is Cabarete no the US!!
Yes SKY implied the FBI was lead when he said "FBI had warrants THEY were trying to serve, that sentence is a direct inference that the FBI was attempting to serve the warrants
I do understand why you used Waco; an attempt to make people think there is some correlation in the way the US executes disputes and the way the Dominican Government does, no relativity whatsoever
I understand you are a business owner in the area and sometimes the truth can hurt your business, sorry, not my intent but a byproduct of your Governments actions.
No I can't tell you if any proper warrants were issued, strange country where the Army shows up if there is just cause for an action.
I have enough of an "inside track" and can guess the motive of you and Mr. Mike is to try and take the heat off the Cabarete incident by referring to incidents in other countries. That dog don't hunt
Stick to the issue, try and find comparable situations if you can, the US is not a place you likely will find comparisons.
Try Tiananmen Square, Budapest, Red Square..SIMILAR incidents where Govt. Military power is used to suppress the populace
Better yet, try to clearly explain why the Dominican Army shows up armed with rifles, bulldozers etc to execute what you claim to be a "civil order,' though no order, writ or any type of official adjudication is referenced
It is very typical when a person can not sustain their argument to try and confuse the issue, you may have done so to some but I clearly see your objective
No more replies to anything with the exception of who ordered the buildings destroyed, why they were destroyed and under what authority
I don't really need your supposition either, I can guess as well as others
Rocky said:
Yes SKY implied the FBI was lead when he said "FBI had warrants THEY were trying to serve, that sentence is a direct inference that the FBI was attempting to serve the warrants
I do understand why you used Waco; an attempt to make people think there is some correlation in the way the US executes disputes and the way the Dominican Government does, no relativity whatsoever
I understand you are a business owner in the area and sometimes the truth can hurt your business, sorry, not my intent but a byproduct of your Governments actions.
No I can't tell you if any proper warrants were issued, strange country where the Army shows up if there is just cause for an action.
I have enough of an "inside track" and can guess the motive of you and Mr. Mike is to try and take the heat off the Cabarete incident by referring to incidents in other countries. That dog don't hunt
Stick to the issue, try and find comparable situations if you can, the US is not a place you likely will find comparisons.
Try Tiananmen Square, Budapest, Red Square..SIMILAR incidents where Govt. Military power is used to suppress the populace
Better yet, try to clearly explain why the Dominican Army shows up armed with rifles, bulldozers etc to execute what you claim to be a "civil order,' though no order, writ or any type of official adjudication is referenced
It is very typical when a person can not sustain their argument to try and confuse the issue, you may have done so to some but I clearly see your objective
No more replies to anything with the exception of who ordered the buildings destroyed, why they were destroyed and under what authority
I don't really need your supposition either, I can guess as well as others
As you say, it is rightous indignation, thank you
Scott
When the Govt shows up expecting armed confrontation, destroys homes and belonging with bulldozers, I see a problem
Maybe the people didn't have legal right to the property, would you be pleased if they bulldozed your condos and decided later you were "ok" to be there, so sory?
Escott said:
Scott
When the Govt shows up expecting armed confrontation, destroys homes and belonging with bulldozers, I see a problem
Maybe the people didn't have legal right to the property, would you be pleased if they bulldozed your condos and decided later you were "ok" to be there, so sory?
Real reason for reference to Waco
It is nothing but an attmept by those with vested interests in the Cabarete region to try and confuse the issue. They believ that by comparing actions in other countries people may think Cabarete was "normal"
Texas Bill said:
It is nothing but an attmept by those with vested interests in the Cabarete region to try and confuse the issue. They believ that by comparing actions in other countries people may think Cabarete was "normal"
KK
I think you're absolutely right!
Attempting to confuse the issue at debate seems to be becoming the norm by those who refuse to recognize the inequities that exist within the Dominican Society.
I have given up trying to fight fallacious reasoning with logic. It seems to be an exercise in futility to do so. Always, you get the "it ain't our fault" type answer or one that points the finger to someplace/someone else besides the real culprits regarding such incidents. If such were not so pathetic, it would be hillarious and a subject for a good stand-up comic on TV. Maybe someone should produce just such a show here in the DR to show just how these types appear to both the people of the DR and others.
Texas Bill
I think you're absolutely right!
Attempting to confuse the issue at debate seems to be becoming the norm by those who refuse to recognize the inequities that exist within the Dominican Society.
I have given up trying to fight fallacious reasoning with logic. It seems to be an exercise in futility to do so. Always, you get the "it ain't our fault" type answer or one that points the finger to someplace/someone else besides the real culprits regarding such incidents. If such were not so pathetic, it would be hillarious and a subject for a good stand-up comic on TV. Maybe someone should produce just such a show here in the DR to show just how these types appear to both the people of the DR and others.
Texas Bill
With my most sincere apologies to timelessdreams for this post after she asked for people to stay on topic I say....
I look forward to buying the beer for all that believe the USgovt is always right etc while they listen to my first hand experience of how it is to actually sue the USgovt.
Once again timelessdreams, I owe you.
I look forward to buying the beer for all that believe the USgovt is always right etc while they listen to my first hand experience of how it is to actually sue the USgovt.
Once again timelessdreams, I owe you.
AlaninDR
I agree with you 100%, lets stay on topic, who the **** cares now about Ruby Ridge and Waco, it happened and the details are and have been construed to fit what the US Gov't wants...
this is a new issue in the DR and as another poster says it is not xclusive to Cabarete,
this is a country I love to visit and have many friends like yourself I like to hookup with, but do I have to find another paradise to vacation and have some fun.
I agree with you 100%, lets stay on topic, who the **** cares now about Ruby Ridge and Waco, it happened and the details are and have been construed to fit what the US Gov't wants...
this is a new issue in the DR and as another poster says it is not xclusive to Cabarete,
this is a country I love to visit and have many friends like yourself I like to hookup with, but do I have to find another paradise to vacation and have some fun.
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Why not just wait to hear facts instead of making jumps to another planet? You don't even know what happened, why it happened nor the reasons behind it. Give it a rest until you do.KrackedKris said:
I don't have a clue what the people had or didn't have. Anytime you listen to BS rumors and start forming opinions of such you are not doing yourself a service but a disservice.
Scott
Sorry Lambada
Sorry Lambada, this guy is trying to spread panic, or something.
I just couldn't help myself. If someone doesn't shut this guy down, people might start believing him.
Dude, you've gone off the deep end. Sky implied nothing of the kind. You may be hallucinating it to serve your own motives, whatever they may be.KrackedKris said:
No you don't understand, despite me explaining it several times. It's quite obvious that you don't want to understand as you have some special agenda going on.KrackedKris said:
Get real. You overestimate my business. It's way too tiny and insignificant to be affected by world politics.KrackedKris said:
Then stop acting as if you know what's going on.KrackedKris said:
Now you've got me in bed with Mr Mike? Sheesh, Mr Mike lives in Santoago, far, far away from all of this.KrackedKris said:
I think you have some issues to resolve in your own mind.KrackedKris said:
I already explained all this in a previous post, but as usual, you weren't listening and you must have been busy just trying to read between the lines, looking to stir up some shyte.KrackedKris said:
Yes, this describes you very well.KrackedKris said:
Are you my Daddy?KrackedKris said:
I beg to differ. Your guessing leaves a lot to be desired.KrackedKris said:
Sorry Lambada, this guy is trying to spread panic, or something.
I just couldn't help myself. If someone doesn't shut this guy down, people might start believing him.
I hope we're about through with this...
OK Guys, it is out of your systems yet?????
Wait....DON'T answer that!
Please REDIRECT to 'DR Debates', if you wish to continue.
Rocky said:
OK Guys, it is out of your systems yet?????
Wait....DON'T answer that!
Please REDIRECT to 'DR Debates', if you wish to continue.