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Dominican History and heritage
No Insult to anyone
This thread is no insult to anyone, I am not sure why someone should feel insulted.
Afro,white Dominicans, mix Dominicans I like them all, its no insult I am not sure why anyone feel threaten when I mentioned African/ Dominican. But I love the culture & people but like to know more on its history.
Thanks for all the feedback & information I appreciate it. I also plan a visit next month.
I have a little more info on the readings I posted.
I will try to post as soon as I get a hold of them.
This thread is no insult to anyone, I am not sure why someone should feel insulted.
Afro,white Dominicans, mix Dominicans I like them all, its no insult I am not sure why anyone feel threaten when I mentioned African/ Dominican. But I love the culture & people but like to know more on its history.
Thanks for all the feedback & information I appreciate it. I also plan a visit next month.
I have a little more info on the readings I posted.
I will try to post as soon as I get a hold of them.
i don't know what country you have visited, but it is not the dominican republic.
color is important in the dominican republic. i have noticed it on the way people (even my own family) treat people of a darker shade. dominican women hate to wear their hair curly (since it is associated with the darker complexion), many don't even go to the beach because they are afraid to turn darker. my sister has even mentioned how she doesn't wanna marry un PRIETO, one of the many ways they call dark skin people.
i have also read numerous newspaper articles where they discuss racism in the island, and mention the racism experienced by blacks. i remember one in which a black person described one night he went to a club and was denied entry while people of a lighter complexion where allowed in.
This is everywhere in the New World and this goes back to the time of slavery. Another book for the list "Caribbean" by James A. Michener
I think it is hard to generalize whenever you are talking about a people. my experience as a dominican is the same as Swdee's. In my family there is really no distinction between light and dark, pelo bueno, pelo malo. But I also know that the "upper" class is very racist. I guess it all depends who you associate with. One thing I do know is that in school, well at least the school that I went to, they teach about all races and how we as a people are a combination. some have more some have less.
Kinky hair, broad nose, thick lips, dark skin. Of Course Africa is a big continent with lots of variety. Maybe the Dominican girl you taught doesn't have some African Heritage, how do you know, after all African looking might be something else.
Yes and no, Trujillo used the Evian conference to tilt political favor to his then falling of grace prestige within the international opinion. The conference offered a way to boost the political stance with European leaders to a point. Also he saw in this a good opportunity to whiten the population that was beginning to show the traits of Haitian-Dominican intermarriage to some degree. Nobody knows if in fact he hated his skin color, but one thing is sure, Trujillo never loathed his family one bit.
Is very simple, the box containing his bones had the engravings done at the time his remains were buried away. Why keep the box and switch bones, when you can just take the box and bones as well? The simplest answer is the logical one: He never left the DR and his box... Spain got bones of somebody else but Colon's!!!! It's like stealing gum and switching the wrappers for no practical use!!!
There are no more pure breed Tainos walking the island, as such the African traits have gained space in the population after the early 1970's...
I can bet you this 100%: There's more incidence of Taino traits than African in the entire population of the DR. The reason African traits are most common now, is simply b/c overpopulation. Haitians just learned that Condoms are to be used when having intercourse unlike before...
If you need prove (historically and factual) just take a stroll in the western side of the island and get back to me on that one...
Spaniards only got to see a small fraction of the entire Taino population of Hispaniola. As soon as the Spaniards started their killing sprees the Tainos fled to the nearby islands and met the same end as many left behind there, as the pathogens were already being carried with them...
The estimate of 2 to 3 million is based on the post-evaluation of Taino burial sites found with major incidence all over the island. The Spaniards never ventured much into the vast forests of the island. Look at the DR of today and it's easy to see how much is still wild and tree covered in our side of the island... Now go back to the mid 1500's and just imagine looking at the entire island just he same as those vast places still lush today...
Just like roaches, for every ten you can see there are thousands you don't...
It was the same when the Spaniards met the Incas and Aztecs...
You just contradicted the "findings" of two special envoys from the UN to the DR on racial issues of the DR...
According to their "facts" the elite and upper classes was where the least to none racism was ever detected...!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL!!!!!!!
Yet, when they probed around the lower economic strata (and btw most racially mixed of all) they found an active and ongoing system of racial discrimination most profoundly mixed with nationalistic tones against Haitians!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Black Dominicans being "racist" to black Haitians.....!!!!!!!!!! LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That's how of little consequence the report was found to be, since the upper and elite classes are predominately white and of lighter shades than the middle to lower class (mixed and mostly of dark complexion)...
The report was shown the trash bin in the UN...
Is was found to support the same claims by Dominican authorities that discrimination was based on nationalities and perceived economic colorism in all the strata...
LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
While there certainly is a substantial Taino component as per recent DNA results, the above statement is unsubstantiated - Pichardo - these type of statement continue to lessen your credibility. We aren't going to believe you just because you like to repeat things a hundred times - sorry.
After 500 years what do you think is the MOST probable case???
Taino or African traits in the general Dominican population % of incidence???
Either you opt to avoid the facts or truly believe that the DR population gained blacks by the ten fold after Haiti gained full independence from France and slavery driven Spaniards on the eastern side...
The train of knowledge provides ample probable evidence to strongly suggest that Taino/White incidence was prevalent during and after that time until today.
The migration impact in masse of Haitians (of African traits prevalence) to the DR was initiated less than 30 some years back...
Now do some basic calculations and tell me how wrong and deviated from a probable and well defined analysis am I...
I use strong probable as nobody can attest otherwise until at least 90% of the population is traced via DNA sampling...
Strong probable is as good as 90%, says me!
Taino or African traits in the general Dominican population % of incidence???
Either you opt to avoid the facts or truly believe that the DR population gained blacks by the ten fold after Haiti gained full independence from France and slavery driven Spaniards on the eastern side...
The train of knowledge provides ample probable evidence to strongly suggest that Taino/White incidence was prevalent during and after that time until today.
The migration impact in masse of Haitians (of African traits prevalence) to the DR was initiated less than 30 some years back...
Now do some basic calculations and tell me how wrong and deviated from a probable and well defined analysis am I...
I use strong probable as nobody can attest otherwise until at least 90% of the population is traced via DNA sampling...
Strong probable is as good as 90%, says me!
Nonsense, tonteria and basura, in no particular order. Basic Dominican (Hispaniola) history states that African slaves were introduced in the very early 1500's. The mixture began a long time ago.
Dominican Republic : Country Studies - Federal Research Division, Library of Congress Look under Racial and Ethnic Groups
History of the Dominican Republic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Slave Routes - Americas and Carabbean
Slaves were brought to "Hispaniola" in order to work on the fields where?!? In the Cibao region?!?! Where cattle was the principal and foremost industry of the time! Where did you find that cotton and other crops of interest where industrialized in the eastern part of the island at the time?!!
The western part of the island was the main concentration of African slaves that were brought into the island! That's a fact, not some garbage self serving interest made up data...
And please base your sources on the "Dominican" history of our island and not the US lib of cong... Or Wiki that has been gravely ripped off by self serving anti-slavery and black hell-bent interests groups. Just take a stroll to the Dominican Republic article to find a never ending history of add-ons and deletes by the untold numbers...
Facts are based on taking a nice and timely research on the matter, in all of the world places, you are in the DR and a quick visit to the colonial zone will provide you ample material where to educate yourself on the matter...
The eastern part saw very little from the high volume and concentration of African slaves as Tainos and their mixed descendants were moved to other slavery like and submissive serving chores in the island. The same happened to those in the western side.
The history of our country and pre-nation birth is mostly discerned from the many written statements, most collected from people that were alive and in the island at the given times their manuscripts were added as scholastic material. The facts don't change just b/c you so want them to fit what you perceived to be the reality...
Please show me here where the hell was that agricultural industry located in the eastern side that made black slaves a multitude in that part of the island; save for the old ingenios (amazingly located where?!?) the vast African hordes were concentrated in the airtibonite and at the time most exploited section of the island. Why did you think that France was hell bent of not letting its grip off the western area of the Hispaniola for so long! Did France show any interest other than to secure the deteriorating and anti-slavery riots in the eastern side, much after the Spaniards lost control there?
Do I paint a rosy picture of no blacks in the DR's population? Blacks are always an important aspect of our population racial make up, not so the ratios and prevalence people like you want to push as valid and of last word...
I stand corrected by the thousands of first eye witness’s accounts on the matter and census conducted in the island, well since those were initialed in our population.
The only people the ever have taken great pains to describe anything other than a white skin in the island as black or of black/white mixture, have been the same people today denying (like you) that Tainos were exterminated from the face of the island (that's the most absurd and ignorant piece of thing to support) without intermixing with the prevailing and most populous race after them (which happens to be the whites).:bored:
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Ladies and Gentlemen,
This started as a cordial conversation and has now degenerated into what most posts about race do: A he said/she said argument defined by personal bias and skewed information and perspective.
We've been warned about delving into race and unfortunately another good thread will be closed.
Mr. Lu
This started as a cordial conversation and has now degenerated into what most posts about race do: A he said/she said argument defined by personal bias and skewed information and perspective.
We've been warned about delving into race and unfortunately another good thread will be closed.
Mr. Lu
“The migration impact in masse of Haitians (of African traits prevalence) to the DR was initiated less than 30 some years back...”
Dear Pichardo my grandmother die about 34 years ago and was about 65 when she die… so where did she get her dark complexion from…..cause if you do the math 65 + 34 = 99 years.
So I don’t understand where you get that the mix initiated less than 30 year ago.
Dear Pichardo my grandmother die about 34 years ago and was about 65 when she die… so where did she get her dark complexion from…..cause if you do the math 65 + 34 = 99 years.
So I don’t understand where you get that the mix initiated less than 30 year ago.
Maybe we ought to implement some posting rules like OneDropRule.org, basically if one tries makes unsubstantiated claims (re w/o references noted) about history etc. their account is immediately locked for a period of time. Repeated violations increase the amount of time.
Based on this, I'm afraid Pichardo's account would have been locked hace mucho. I for one in my life have never confronted a person so consistently refuses to defend claims nor chooses to acknowledge errors or even challenges to his rubbish. One might as well be talking Chinese for all the difference it makes. Ni hao ma? :ermm:
