Let me first say that i have been getting excellent input from all of you guys... and not only from Dominicans themselves but to those Puerto Ricans who shared some of their experiiences with me and the rest of this message board... Thanx to allLesley D said:
- Thread starter kami
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Dominicans and Puerto Ricans
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Re: Dominican and Puerto Ricans
Its my belief that racism plays a significant role in the relationship between Puerto ricans and Dominicans living in the states. I am Cuban-American. Its interesting how my fellow Cubans react to my having a Dominican husband. Doesn't help that he is very educated, ambitious, and respectful young man. Unfortunately, our beloved country has pitted these people against one another. In New York, they live side by side, under the same deplorable conditions, but yet, they have a dislike for one another. Its like placing a crabs in a pot of hot water. Once in the water, they're pulling each other in.
I also believe, as someone stated in a previous post, Puerto Ricans are free to travel to and from PR to the states, and receive benefits. But yet in still, they live among people, who do not have that same priviledge. Where I live, there has been an influx of Dominicans opening businesses throughout the city, where once Puerto Ricans dominated. I hope with forums such as this, could help alleviate tension between the two groups. Besides, both Dominicans and Puerto Ricans have contributed greatly to our American Culture.
Its my belief that racism plays a significant role in the relationship between Puerto ricans and Dominicans living in the states. I am Cuban-American. Its interesting how my fellow Cubans react to my having a Dominican husband. Doesn't help that he is very educated, ambitious, and respectful young man. Unfortunately, our beloved country has pitted these people against one another. In New York, they live side by side, under the same deplorable conditions, but yet, they have a dislike for one another. Its like placing a crabs in a pot of hot water. Once in the water, they're pulling each other in.
I also believe, as someone stated in a previous post, Puerto Ricans are free to travel to and from PR to the states, and receive benefits. But yet in still, they live among people, who do not have that same priviledge. Where I live, there has been an influx of Dominicans opening businesses throughout the city, where once Puerto Ricans dominated. I hope with forums such as this, could help alleviate tension between the two groups. Besides, both Dominicans and Puerto Ricans have contributed greatly to our American Culture.
kami said:I live in MA and I am currently attending Westfield State College. I have to do a research project and i planned to do it on racism among latinos. More specifically, I am basing it on the Puerto Ricans and Dominicans... SO, i was wondering if any of ya wanna give ur opinions based on this subject... thank you
United we stand, divided we fall
Okay.... I just read through this whole thread and it's quite upsetting. I'm not Dominican nor Puerto Rican or latina from any other ethnic group/nationality. I'm an african american female from Detroit, who lived in Washington Heights New York for the last 8 years and is often mistaken for Dominican due to my skin color and hair texture.
I just want to say.... that instead of fighting each other (latino vs latino) why not come together. As you know the U.S. is a very racist country and will try their best to divide and catorgorize you, but when it comes right down to it..... they're looking at all latinos the same. Much like the way they look at all black people with the same eye. It doesn't matter if you're Jamaican, Senegalese, Haitian or African American...... YOU'RE BLACK!!!! And will be treated as such.
I realized every group has they're own issues and everyone to some degree is racist or discriminates, but when it's all said and done...... we're all the same. And we pretty much want the same things out of life.
I have dated both PR s and DRs and have many dominican friends as well as puerto rican friends and have been to both nations. As an outsider looking in, I see many similarities between the two so much so that it would be a shame to let the small differences divide you.
I don't know.... call me crazy...... Hey what do I know...... I'm not latina.
Okay.... I just read through this whole thread and it's quite upsetting. I'm not Dominican nor Puerto Rican or latina from any other ethnic group/nationality. I'm an african american female from Detroit, who lived in Washington Heights New York for the last 8 years and is often mistaken for Dominican due to my skin color and hair texture.
I just want to say.... that instead of fighting each other (latino vs latino) why not come together. As you know the U.S. is a very racist country and will try their best to divide and catorgorize you, but when it comes right down to it..... they're looking at all latinos the same. Much like the way they look at all black people with the same eye. It doesn't matter if you're Jamaican, Senegalese, Haitian or African American...... YOU'RE BLACK!!!! And will be treated as such.
I realized every group has they're own issues and everyone to some degree is racist or discriminates, but when it's all said and done...... we're all the same. And we pretty much want the same things out of life.
I have dated both PR s and DRs and have many dominican friends as well as puerto rican friends and have been to both nations. As an outsider looking in, I see many similarities between the two so much so that it would be a shame to let the small differences divide you.
I don't know.... call me crazy...... Hey what do I know...... I'm not latina.
I find it very strange that an "African American" refers to
"other" Americans as "THEY"! If we are "They",who the hell are "You"??
"other" Americans as "THEY"! If we are "They",who the hell are "You"??
Criss Colon said:
When I refer to they, I'm referring to white america. Growing up in the U.S. as an African American there has always been a they. They are the ones that started the discrimination and light skin/dark skin and wavy hair/kinky hair issue to begin with. Unfortunately.... we (meaning people of color) throughout the world continue it.
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love both
I was born in Puerto rico, my parents are dominicans and I was raised in both countries. I love both cultures, I feel 100% dominican and 100% puertorican. When I was in PR people used to make fun of my dominican accent and I was bullied at school. When I moved to Dominican Republic 5 years later the same story happens my dominican friends make fun of my accent and once again I was bullied at schoot. I would like to add that dominicans descrimiantes among themselves according to how dark they are. My dad is a black dominican and my mother is white with green eyes. I have seen how dominicans treat my mother ( la blanquita) and how my dad has been treated by his own people. so before we judged other cultures ...let's take care of our own problems first.
yansser
kami said:I live in MA and I am currently attending Westfield State College. I have to do a research project and i planned to do it on racism among latinos. More specifically, I am basing it on the Puerto Ricans and Dominicans... SO, i was wondering if any of ya wanna give ur opinions based on this subject... thank you
I was born in Puerto rico, my parents are dominicans and I was raised in both countries. I love both cultures, I feel 100% dominican and 100% puertorican. When I was in PR people used to make fun of my dominican accent and I was bullied at school. When I moved to Dominican Republic 5 years later the same story happens my dominican friends make fun of my accent and once again I was bullied at schoot. I would like to add that dominicans descrimiantes among themselves according to how dark they are. My dad is a black dominican and my mother is white with green eyes. I have seen how dominicans treat my mother ( la blanquita) and how my dad has been treated by his own people. so before we judged other cultures ...let's take care of our own problems first.
yansser
Puerto Ricans and Dominicans
As a Puerto Rican, I find a lot of what is being posted here incorrect. Puerto Ricans share many similarities as Dominicans. In a lot of ways we are closely linked. However, there are some significant differences and good reasons for making clear distinctions. As I read these posts, I am somewhat surprised by some of the blatant bias expressed towards Puerto Ricans. This is the deal.... Puerto Ricans have made MAJOR contributions to the overall social, ecpnomic, and political well-being of diverse Latino communities in NYC. From bi-lingual education to child welfare, Puero Ricans have led the way for a better life for subsequent Latino groups. Dominicans have benefited from many of the accomplishments of Puerto Ricans. I think we need to review history a bit and check the facts versus our own subjective opinions/experiences.
A good reference is a new text entitled Boricuas in Gotham. It's an excellent source of info on the significant ways in which Puerto Ricans have supported many Latinos- including Dominicans.
The Puerto Rican Legal Defense Fund will release a report today related to the lack of Latinos in Senior Leadership positions in NYC hospitals. This is directly contributing to the poor quality of healthcare many Latinos receive in NYC. Another example of how we are pushing an agenda for the betterment of Latinos in NYC. I think we should focus on commonalties and what we all need to achieve versus silly comparisons that only benefit non-Latinos.
As a Puerto Rican, I find a lot of what is being posted here incorrect. Puerto Ricans share many similarities as Dominicans. In a lot of ways we are closely linked. However, there are some significant differences and good reasons for making clear distinctions. As I read these posts, I am somewhat surprised by some of the blatant bias expressed towards Puerto Ricans. This is the deal.... Puerto Ricans have made MAJOR contributions to the overall social, ecpnomic, and political well-being of diverse Latino communities in NYC. From bi-lingual education to child welfare, Puero Ricans have led the way for a better life for subsequent Latino groups. Dominicans have benefited from many of the accomplishments of Puerto Ricans. I think we need to review history a bit and check the facts versus our own subjective opinions/experiences.
A good reference is a new text entitled Boricuas in Gotham. It's an excellent source of info on the significant ways in which Puerto Ricans have supported many Latinos- including Dominicans.
The Puerto Rican Legal Defense Fund will release a report today related to the lack of Latinos in Senior Leadership positions in NYC hospitals. This is directly contributing to the poor quality of healthcare many Latinos receive in NYC. Another example of how we are pushing an agenda for the betterment of Latinos in NYC. I think we should focus on commonalties and what we all need to achieve versus silly comparisons that only benefit non-Latinos.
PRs & DRs
This is a very broad subject; it happens in many geographical areas, not just the Caribbean. Japanese have beef with Koreans, with Chinese and every other Asian Pacific nationalities; all in turn dislike "westerners". I lived in Korea, Japan, visited many places in Asia and everywhere I've set foot in, I've encountered certain locals, who due to their lack of understanding of other cultures, tend to think of you and the rest like you as nothing but garbage;I'm not generalizing here, not all are ignorant. On the other hand, I've also encountered westerner friendlies. It seems that it's even more hostile if you share borders with some other country. Indians and Pakistanian are a prime example. They've been hating each other over a region, Kashmere. Wars between nations deepen hostile sentiments for one another. Their psyops (psychological operations), portray their enemies as "the evil empire". I remember how many ignorant people in US where bashing the heads of turban wearing shieks thinking that arabs were going to pay for 9.11. for those that don't know, these are in majority indians not Saudis, not Iraquis. We don't have to go far to see racial hostilities. I stopped visiting a family member in Kentucky because some of their neighbors were burning crosses on her lawn. There are many culture sensitivity courses out there, perhaps we should start a non lucrative org.
" Fundacion Internacional para Erradicar la Ignorancia Racial entre Platanos y boricuas " :bunny:
This is a very broad subject; it happens in many geographical areas, not just the Caribbean. Japanese have beef with Koreans, with Chinese and every other Asian Pacific nationalities; all in turn dislike "westerners". I lived in Korea, Japan, visited many places in Asia and everywhere I've set foot in, I've encountered certain locals, who due to their lack of understanding of other cultures, tend to think of you and the rest like you as nothing but garbage;I'm not generalizing here, not all are ignorant. On the other hand, I've also encountered westerner friendlies. It seems that it's even more hostile if you share borders with some other country. Indians and Pakistanian are a prime example. They've been hating each other over a region, Kashmere. Wars between nations deepen hostile sentiments for one another. Their psyops (psychological operations), portray their enemies as "the evil empire". I remember how many ignorant people in US where bashing the heads of turban wearing shieks thinking that arabs were going to pay for 9.11. for those that don't know, these are in majority indians not Saudis, not Iraquis. We don't have to go far to see racial hostilities. I stopped visiting a family member in Kentucky because some of their neighbors were burning crosses on her lawn. There are many culture sensitivity courses out there, perhaps we should start a non lucrative org.
" Fundacion Internacional para Erradicar la Ignorancia Racial entre Platanos y boricuas " :bunny:
Mario
Yes, Boricus in Gotham is an excellent reference. Angelo Falcon keeps doing a kickass job and is among the book's authors. I always love reading his work. He is also one of the leading poli. sci. thinkers without a doubt. You are right that this is more the type of work that I assume Kami is also reading to prepare his/her paper.
Most comments being made here are just general perceptions and based on their own personal experience. At the end of the day I agree that the legitimizing stereoptypes of either group is not a good thing. However, we need to recognize that hurtful, ignorant comments can be said from either side and this is an area where behavioral change will be welcomed.
Best,
D
Yes, Boricus in Gotham is an excellent reference. Angelo Falcon keeps doing a kickass job and is among the book's authors. I always love reading his work. He is also one of the leading poli. sci. thinkers without a doubt. You are right that this is more the type of work that I assume Kami is also reading to prepare his/her paper.
Most comments being made here are just general perceptions and based on their own personal experience. At the end of the day I agree that the legitimizing stereoptypes of either group is not a good thing. However, we need to recognize that hurtful, ignorant comments can be said from either side and this is an area where behavioral change will be welcomed.
Best,
D
Mario said:
Unbelievable
this is a most interesting thread my peoples, and kami i'm sorry if what i say does or does not help to your research.
My friends, I am 100% Ecuadorian. I have a 100% Dominican fiancee whom I love dearly. Now let me say this, and this is based solely on personal experience so I cannot say where these emotions/feelings between, among, against PRs and DRs people are...
I KNOW for a fact, from being south american, that our continent has a serious complex with image and race. i think it transcends racism because it is a mix of discrimination, image, and that feeling of being 'better' than one another. south americans i definately feel have that discrimination towards the caribbean. i definately feel it is because of the african presence/mix in the islands. i have seen, heard, observed my fellow south americans say derogarory things about all people from the caribbean, that includes all the islands latin and non latin american, and they say it with such vile and disgust that those people dont know how to 'speak', dress, or even act decent. it hurts me to think that we as latinos cannot get along at all...there is also this complexion issue within our own countries that the 'whiter' one is the better in the social class blah blah blah, pretty sad isnt it? i have seen my own kind ecuadorians have issues with mixing with people who look more indian. i mean, people in the cities of guayaquil or quito talk so bad about the indians in the sierra, like they are beneath them. why? i thought latinos were the result of a mestizaje and mix of cultures and people. how can we pride ourselves so much on that? mestizo? raza? when we cant even get along with our own neighbors? or even people in the caribbean. last i recall i dont think we asked to be taken over or forced to accept the spanish when they came to these lands. nor were africans freely willing to make the trip accross the ocean to live and suffer in the new world as slaves to the europeans. its sad to see this superiority issue still alive in our countries...
I know personally that my family has a hard time accepting anyone from the caribbean. actually i should say a hard time accepting anyone that isnt ecuadorian...sad really, i dont know why. i almost feel they were brought up that way. i dont know why they discriminate like that...i mean its not blatant but it is indirect...i had and still have a hard time understanding and accepting this whole beef/complex issue among ourselves. i dont know why but it seems every latino family i meet has something negative to say about PR or DR. i even see this with friends of mine that are PR and or DR. they say bad things about each other, directed towards the other....why? why is it so easy for that to slip out of one's mouth?
i mean it even surprises me to hear my fiancee say bad things about PR. and im like where did that come from? sometimes i feel she says it without even thinking. which is what i feel a lot of people's comments are like....no one thinks about what they say. like its acceptable or something....very weird.
i have so many PR and DR friends, its sad that this whole issue is still alive and kicking today. i dont know if it is or isnt dying out. i cannot say it is because of the every day things i see and hear on the streets of NYC. to me, its not dying out. its just a festering problem that is passed on from generation to generation and its a mind set that we all need to snap out of.
i very much love my fiancee and hope that in some way it lessens the animosity between our people. i have been welcomed by her family in DR, I am headed over to the island in 2 days and plan on spending xmas and new years there. maybe i can do some more research about it while i am there....but it will take a while. for now i will try to enjoy my vacation and time away. just relax and not deal with these issues even if its for a few weeks.
sorry for my blog folks, but this is a VERY interesting thread and i love reading all the responses! :beard:
this is a most interesting thread my peoples, and kami i'm sorry if what i say does or does not help to your research.
My friends, I am 100% Ecuadorian. I have a 100% Dominican fiancee whom I love dearly. Now let me say this, and this is based solely on personal experience so I cannot say where these emotions/feelings between, among, against PRs and DRs people are...
I KNOW for a fact, from being south american, that our continent has a serious complex with image and race. i think it transcends racism because it is a mix of discrimination, image, and that feeling of being 'better' than one another. south americans i definately feel have that discrimination towards the caribbean. i definately feel it is because of the african presence/mix in the islands. i have seen, heard, observed my fellow south americans say derogarory things about all people from the caribbean, that includes all the islands latin and non latin american, and they say it with such vile and disgust that those people dont know how to 'speak', dress, or even act decent. it hurts me to think that we as latinos cannot get along at all...there is also this complexion issue within our own countries that the 'whiter' one is the better in the social class blah blah blah, pretty sad isnt it? i have seen my own kind ecuadorians have issues with mixing with people who look more indian. i mean, people in the cities of guayaquil or quito talk so bad about the indians in the sierra, like they are beneath them. why? i thought latinos were the result of a mestizaje and mix of cultures and people. how can we pride ourselves so much on that? mestizo? raza? when we cant even get along with our own neighbors? or even people in the caribbean. last i recall i dont think we asked to be taken over or forced to accept the spanish when they came to these lands. nor were africans freely willing to make the trip accross the ocean to live and suffer in the new world as slaves to the europeans. its sad to see this superiority issue still alive in our countries...
I know personally that my family has a hard time accepting anyone from the caribbean. actually i should say a hard time accepting anyone that isnt ecuadorian...sad really, i dont know why. i almost feel they were brought up that way. i dont know why they discriminate like that...i mean its not blatant but it is indirect...i had and still have a hard time understanding and accepting this whole beef/complex issue among ourselves. i dont know why but it seems every latino family i meet has something negative to say about PR or DR. i even see this with friends of mine that are PR and or DR. they say bad things about each other, directed towards the other....why? why is it so easy for that to slip out of one's mouth?
i mean it even surprises me to hear my fiancee say bad things about PR. and im like where did that come from? sometimes i feel she says it without even thinking. which is what i feel a lot of people's comments are like....no one thinks about what they say. like its acceptable or something....very weird.
i have so many PR and DR friends, its sad that this whole issue is still alive and kicking today. i dont know if it is or isnt dying out. i cannot say it is because of the every day things i see and hear on the streets of NYC. to me, its not dying out. its just a festering problem that is passed on from generation to generation and its a mind set that we all need to snap out of.
i very much love my fiancee and hope that in some way it lessens the animosity between our people. i have been welcomed by her family in DR, I am headed over to the island in 2 days and plan on spending xmas and new years there. maybe i can do some more research about it while i am there....but it will take a while. for now i will try to enjoy my vacation and time away. just relax and not deal with these issues even if its for a few weeks.
sorry for my blog folks, but this is a VERY interesting thread and i love reading all the responses! :beard:
jalencastro said:
I KNOW for a fact, from being south american, that our continent has a serious complex with image and race. i think it transcends racism because it is a mix of discrimination, image, and that feeling of being 'better' than one another. south americans i definately feel have that discrimination towards the caribbean. i definately feel it is because of the african presence/mix in the islands. i have seen, heard, observed my fellow south americans say derogarory things about all people from the caribbean. that includes all the islands latin and non latin american, and they say it with such vile and disgust that those people dont know how to 'speak', dress, or even act decent.
>>>you know ih gotta female friend whos from milwaukee, wisconsins who visited (south america) argentina she said she did not like it she told me someone asked her where was she from she said america they laughed at her she told me they said no really your from brasil right and she said no america. she said she could not believe it they were so racist to her she is not all that dark but light caramel she had braids many african americans wear also, it was like the way they thought was the black americans are all poor and cannot afford to travel outside of the united states or she said they said it like there are not only but a few black people in america and the rest of the country is mainly white. one place she visited that she liked was colombia( many people even latinos in the united states think there are no afro-colombianos or people mixed of african and european parents or people that have african ancestry period!
it hurts me to think that we as latinos cannot get along at all...there is also this complexion issue within our own countries that the 'whiter' one is the better in the social class blah blah blah, pretty sad isnt it?
>>>>yeah i here brasil that some mullatos say they are white and some pretos do too due to wealth! but outside of the united states latino does not really exist in other countries just meztizo, mullata, white, negra or whatever else so how can some of these countries get along when in fact all of these latin america countries are different or the same from one another
I know personally that my family has a hard time accepting anyone from the caribbean. actually i should say a hard time accepting anyone that isnt ecuadorian...
>>>how does your dad feel about the true african presece in brasil, guyana and the other countries in south america(that don't speak spanish) that have west african heritage? or mixtures or african people? and brasil have alot of people from angola brasil current samba contains a mixture of angolas samba and they speak the same language also!
i even see this with friends of mine that are PR and or DR. they say bad things about each other, directed towards the other....why? why is it so easy for that to slip out of one's mouth?
>>> hey one thing i can't understand one say bad things about the other
puerto ricans say bad things about d.r cause they have browner skinned people even most puerto ricans don't asociate with the afro- boriccuas of loiza and these are the same puerto ricans who listen and dance to salsa and mambo play the bongos, congos, timbales, music and also reggaeton which is derived from dancehall reggae in the west indies i don't get it don't they know these things it don't take a rocket scientist to figure out why most of these countries have similar sounding rythms in their music right.
fast zouk and merengue sounds similar(just an xample)
i have been welcomed by her family in DR, I am headed over to the island in 2 days and plan on spending xmas and new years there. maybe i can do some more research about it while i am there....but it will take a while. for now i will try to enjoy my vacation and time away. just relax and not deal with these issues even if its for a few weeks.
have fun!
and ask around whats the stigma with many d.r hating to be black i think its great that a country is mostly brown colors cause many ignorant people think that hispanics/latinos are all white looking or there is a certain way hispanics are suppose to look feel me and the telvision networks in spanish are awful are those really spaniards playing latino roles in the novelas? also i can understand if d.r hate haitians cause they think they gonna take there jobs but there should not be an issue with haitians cause they may be darker and all haitians are not all dark dark brown=black many people think this i see haitians in my city everyday and they look like plenty african americans differnt color browns and high yellows.also have you ever heard of el chivi chivi-
he made a song called negros de meirda after visiting the domincan rep. it the sad thing it was a hit in many latin american countries! if he made an english version and it was played on a afro-caribbean island like jamaica by someone white there throats probably would be slit that song is sick!
and there are some made by euro-latin american towards natives too
dlstinnett said:
When I refer to they, I'm referring to white america. Growing up in the U.S. as an African American there has always been a they. They are the ones that started the discrimination and light skin/dark skin and wavy hair/kinky hair issue to begin with. Unfortunately.... we (meaning people of color) throughout the world continue it.
>>>>>very true back in the days they tried to turn people who were black and white against blacks actually that ahppened in some places but in the southern states(home of slavery on up to virgina) black and white people were refer to only as black many bi racials were able tro claim white status.
but nowadays is mullatoes just saying they're black it has nothing to do with ancestry! but immediate parents cause african americans if they were to go back can find a white, creole(louisiana) native american somewhere down the line no matter what color they are! but it was a pain growning up in this country being labeled colored, black,negroe and anything else they created for blacks here many people from other countries of african heritage don't know the struggle of african americans and what they went thru.
heritage stripped! language stripped.
Great post...but I just wanted to make a few comments about some things..If I may..
Well unfortunately, people will always have a stereotype against any particular group...This dilemma have been around since..B.C...and Im not referring to Boca Chica..LOL. Many S. American have a misconception of mulattos and blacks anywhere not just the caribbean. Actually there are more blacks and mulattos in S. America than there are in the caribbean...Even Ecuador has a large black and mulattos population in the coast..but unfortunately mestizos discriminate against them. Their own 110% Ecuadorian peoples. Its funny how most s. americans down play their mulattos and blacks as if they didn't exist. Now,that USA made up propaganda word "Latino" is all B.S. How can a people you discriminate against its own people try to unite with someone from a different country just on the basis they speak the same language....They even try to throw Brazilians into that Latino group..Some hispanics dont even realize that brazilians speak portuguese and not spanish...so that Latino crap is just a way of United States throwing all this mix people into one bucket just for the Census Bureau...And to say Latinos have surpass blacks as the largest minority group is laughable and I feel it's an insult to Black Americans who fought hard for the Civil Rights..Really the USA are basically saying "OK here is a new large group of second class citizens..stuck in limbo......Besides, each country has their own agenda and dont really care about other spanish speaking countries...Go to NY/NJ/RI and ask a dominican or a Puerto Rican about Ecuador or Argentina and they probably can't even name the capitol..Why, because its not important to them and mostly have to do with lack of Education..Its funny at work their is an Ecuadorian who swear he's white but like a little mestizo and brags about his kids having blonde hair and white skin...Well, he married a white american..Rather than telling me about his kids achievements in school he rather focus on their skin color ..I'm assuming he figured he has accomplish his dream" Mejorar la Raza". Another thing I've noticed with him is he can't get over me and another co-worker being haitian..It worse since my other co-work is white and im a what they call a criollo(light skin with pelo bueno). And the sad thing is he is very educated like me but has in inferior complex like a low class immigrant..
What I'm trying to convey is that latin american and the carib have the mentality that if you are white then you're better..this inferior complex has been embedded since the first Conquistadors landed on the island of Hispaniola..to divide and conquer...all of us...to the point that they can just lay back and have US(latin americans & caribbeans) surpress each other...BTW, you said your are one 100% Ecuadorian but are you an indegenous, mestizo or mulatto or black. Depending on what category you belong to will determine howyour family feels about your dominican fiancee and the reason for those indirect comments...which is sad like you said. Well, good luck and I wish you the best with ur marriage..
because of
Well unfortunately, people will always have a stereotype against any particular group...This dilemma have been around since..B.C...and Im not referring to Boca Chica..LOL. Many S. American have a misconception of mulattos and blacks anywhere not just the caribbean. Actually there are more blacks and mulattos in S. America than there are in the caribbean...Even Ecuador has a large black and mulattos population in the coast..but unfortunately mestizos discriminate against them. Their own 110% Ecuadorian peoples. Its funny how most s. americans down play their mulattos and blacks as if they didn't exist. Now,that USA made up propaganda word "Latino" is all B.S. How can a people you discriminate against its own people try to unite with someone from a different country just on the basis they speak the same language....They even try to throw Brazilians into that Latino group..Some hispanics dont even realize that brazilians speak portuguese and not spanish...so that Latino crap is just a way of United States throwing all this mix people into one bucket just for the Census Bureau...And to say Latinos have surpass blacks as the largest minority group is laughable and I feel it's an insult to Black Americans who fought hard for the Civil Rights..Really the USA are basically saying "OK here is a new large group of second class citizens..stuck in limbo......Besides, each country has their own agenda and dont really care about other spanish speaking countries...Go to NY/NJ/RI and ask a dominican or a Puerto Rican about Ecuador or Argentina and they probably can't even name the capitol..Why, because its not important to them and mostly have to do with lack of Education..Its funny at work their is an Ecuadorian who swear he's white but like a little mestizo and brags about his kids having blonde hair and white skin...Well, he married a white american..Rather than telling me about his kids achievements in school he rather focus on their skin color ..I'm assuming he figured he has accomplish his dream" Mejorar la Raza". Another thing I've noticed with him is he can't get over me and another co-worker being haitian..It worse since my other co-work is white and im a what they call a criollo(light skin with pelo bueno). And the sad thing is he is very educated like me but has in inferior complex like a low class immigrant..
What I'm trying to convey is that latin american and the carib have the mentality that if you are white then you're better..this inferior complex has been embedded since the first Conquistadors landed on the island of Hispaniola..to divide and conquer...all of us...to the point that they can just lay back and have US(latin americans & caribbeans) surpress each other...BTW, you said your are one 100% Ecuadorian but are you an indegenous, mestizo or mulatto or black. Depending on what category you belong to will determine howyour family feels about your dominican fiancee and the reason for those indirect comments...which is sad like you said. Well, good luck and I wish you the best with ur marriage..
because of
jalencastro said:
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wow
hey guys, by the way no offense taken at all by these comments/opinions! i feel if we are to learn anything about this issue that plagues all latinos/people of the world we need to address it and talk about it! so keep it up!
Quisqueya, i agree with you entirely with S.Americans having a misconception of mulattos and blacks worldwide. i think this problem is just a lack of education. not only thati think there is also a sense of not wanting to accept that history and or accept anything that is african. really sad if you ask me. sometimes i wonder if this problem perpetuates itself on american soil. i feel somewhat blessed and cursed to live in NYC because it is the melting pot of the world, where else can you find such a rich variety of races and people in one city? then again it is so segregated and neighborhoods and people are so mean to one another....ALL OVER! i mean what the deal? I think when there is a lack of education of history, along with this deep rooted hate of anything that is not white/eurpean doesnt help at all. what bothers me too is that parents have a huge role in this and somehow they preach this hate to their children. how many times have i heard mothers say to their children 'stay away from that black person' and thats to anyone that looks black [can be PR, DR, haitian whatever...] sad
yes ecuador has a black/mulatto city? i dont know it...unfortunately even though i was born there i came here when i was a baby and never went back. i need to know more about my country and learn! but my father did mention that place. funny how it is segregated from the rest of the population, but then again can you blame them for it? i need to ask more ecuadorians about it and see what their response/opinion on it is. do you remember the name of that town/city? its on the tip of my tongue.
NOTE one thing i do know that ecuadorians mention about that place is that the black populaiton there have these BLUE EYES! like its some weird thing! the nerve! it always makes me wonder why they stress that point out like its some weird thing...you're right lack of education breeds ignorance, sheesh!
now that ecua at your job that rants and raves about his children's physical appreance kills me. its sad, but that is the mentality with a lot of latinos. something that kills me though is that many people from the island are brought up to think this way too....so sad. one example is my fiancee's mom who is as black as can be. i swear if i didnt know she was dominican or speak spanish i would guess the woman is african [no offense to anyone]. but she is so happy for us getting together. it baffles my mind to hear her talk about us [my fiancee and me] to her friends and say that our kids will have good hair! damn...sometimes i wonder if i am not helping the situation. i would like to think i am, but sometimes i wonder....damn cant i just be happy with my future children no matter what they look like? i mean it will be my flesh and blood and i gotta think about what their hair will be like? sigh...
also sorry your co worker cant get over the fact you are haitian...hte world is pretty f-ed up...sigh...
oh and to answer your question, yes i did say i am 100% ecuadorian and i mean it since i was born there. now i think of myself as mestizo even though my parents are an odd mix. my father is pretty white/light skinned, my mom is lighter indigenous. i came out darker than both of them. my younger brother came out white...we are all MUTTS! LOL but hey thats my family and i love and accept them. now if i look at my uncles and aunts, cousins and everyone [though i dont know them personally], photos i see them look very mestizo, part indian but on the 'lighter' side. whatever. point is i accept my indian heritage, i am not shunning it or am i ashamed of it. all i do is look at my 2 grandmothers who are alive and well and i see the indian in them. and a picture of my great grandmother affirms that my family is rooted from indians so i know where i come from. i get a kick out of that....no offense, but im glad i could feel where i come from thanks to my grandmothers and their pictures, brings a smile to my face
some great posts in here! sorry i havent responded but let me see what i can add in here...Quisqueya said:
hey guys, by the way no offense taken at all by these comments/opinions! i feel if we are to learn anything about this issue that plagues all latinos/people of the world we need to address it and talk about it! so keep it up!
Quisqueya, i agree with you entirely with S.Americans having a misconception of mulattos and blacks worldwide. i think this problem is just a lack of education. not only thati think there is also a sense of not wanting to accept that history and or accept anything that is african. really sad if you ask me. sometimes i wonder if this problem perpetuates itself on american soil. i feel somewhat blessed and cursed to live in NYC because it is the melting pot of the world, where else can you find such a rich variety of races and people in one city? then again it is so segregated and neighborhoods and people are so mean to one another....ALL OVER! i mean what the deal? I think when there is a lack of education of history, along with this deep rooted hate of anything that is not white/eurpean doesnt help at all. what bothers me too is that parents have a huge role in this and somehow they preach this hate to their children. how many times have i heard mothers say to their children 'stay away from that black person' and thats to anyone that looks black [can be PR, DR, haitian whatever...] sad
yes ecuador has a black/mulatto city? i dont know it...unfortunately even though i was born there i came here when i was a baby and never went back. i need to know more about my country and learn! but my father did mention that place. funny how it is segregated from the rest of the population, but then again can you blame them for it? i need to ask more ecuadorians about it and see what their response/opinion on it is. do you remember the name of that town/city? its on the tip of my tongue.
NOTE one thing i do know that ecuadorians mention about that place is that the black populaiton there have these BLUE EYES! like its some weird thing! the nerve! it always makes me wonder why they stress that point out like its some weird thing...you're right lack of education breeds ignorance, sheesh!
now that ecua at your job that rants and raves about his children's physical appreance kills me. its sad, but that is the mentality with a lot of latinos. something that kills me though is that many people from the island are brought up to think this way too....so sad. one example is my fiancee's mom who is as black as can be. i swear if i didnt know she was dominican or speak spanish i would guess the woman is african [no offense to anyone]. but she is so happy for us getting together. it baffles my mind to hear her talk about us [my fiancee and me] to her friends and say that our kids will have good hair! damn...sometimes i wonder if i am not helping the situation. i would like to think i am, but sometimes i wonder....damn cant i just be happy with my future children no matter what they look like? i mean it will be my flesh and blood and i gotta think about what their hair will be like? sigh...
also sorry your co worker cant get over the fact you are haitian...hte world is pretty f-ed up...sigh...
oh and to answer your question, yes i did say i am 100% ecuadorian and i mean it since i was born there. now i think of myself as mestizo even though my parents are an odd mix. my father is pretty white/light skinned, my mom is lighter indigenous. i came out darker than both of them. my younger brother came out white...we are all MUTTS! LOL but hey thats my family and i love and accept them. now if i look at my uncles and aunts, cousins and everyone [though i dont know them personally], photos i see them look very mestizo, part indian but on the 'lighter' side. whatever. point is i accept my indian heritage, i am not shunning it or am i ashamed of it. all i do is look at my 2 grandmothers who are alive and well and i see the indian in them. and a picture of my great grandmother affirms that my family is rooted from indians so i know where i come from. i get a kick out of that....no offense, but im glad i could feel where i come from thanks to my grandmothers and their pictures, brings a smile to my face
by the way
brownskin, you had a lot of interesting things to say too, i will get to answering that shortly. i wasnt ignoring you!
brownskin, you had a lot of interesting things to say too, i will get to answering that shortly. i wasnt ignoring you!
Hello Jalencastro,
Again great post and I am happy to read your post...I am glad to see that your parents mis-education isn't dictating your life and preventing you from chosing the woman of your life...I agree with your post but I will drop my 2 centimes if you don't mind...Well, I think it has to do with mis-education and on top of that lack of education..its ok to have someone misguided but if he/she is misguided and blind its hard for that person to see the light at the end of the tunnel.
So your future mother-in-law brags about you....I'm sure that puts you in an akward position...Well, in her eyes your are the savior of the family...Her daughter is moving up the class ladder meaning she's bettering her race..Well, dont let that discourage you...Love has no color and no class system...Its ashame but that's the way she was brought up...and its hard to make a donkey do new tricks....For laughs you should ask her mom if the baby came out black like her what would she say...LOL..
Well, NYC is the biggest melting pot but like you said everyone is so stay away from me and ignorant its hard to learn about one another...sometimes you can even sense it walking from barrio to barrio without even getting out your car...And you would think all these immigrants would put their heads together for the sake of their community but they rather tear each other down...sad
Well, when I use to play soccer we had alot of black ecuadorians on our team and they were cool and very genuine people but unfortunately they felt outcaste by their own people....To tell you the truth some deny their hispanic background and merge with afro-american or the carib... It seemed all of them new each other and where to find other black ecuadorians...its like they had a secret society among them...Anyway, it will take the new generation and the diaspora to re-educate the misguided blind folks...
Even Dominicans are coming to grip with their culture and background whether they like it or not...because others (S. Americans) will never accept that indio oscuro or indio claro propagando and see them for what they look like....mulattre et negre..
My motto is you can say and be whatever you want to be but the mirror never lie....
Anyway, enough on this race BS and just enjoy your fiancee and make the best of your relationship and never let your family or hers dictate your home...
BTW, do you speak Quechua..whenever my co-worker gets me upset I tell him to teach me Quechua..He gets upset and says "I dont speak it and finally admits that his grandparents spoke it"...
Also if you go to El conde their is a nice little Ecuadorian shop in the middle on the left hand side that sells indegenous stuff from Ecuador...She is very nice and is fluent in Quechua...
Again great post and I am happy to read your post...I am glad to see that your parents mis-education isn't dictating your life and preventing you from chosing the woman of your life...I agree with your post but I will drop my 2 centimes if you don't mind...Well, I think it has to do with mis-education and on top of that lack of education..its ok to have someone misguided but if he/she is misguided and blind its hard for that person to see the light at the end of the tunnel.
So your future mother-in-law brags about you....I'm sure that puts you in an akward position...Well, in her eyes your are the savior of the family...Her daughter is moving up the class ladder meaning she's bettering her race..Well, dont let that discourage you...Love has no color and no class system...Its ashame but that's the way she was brought up...and its hard to make a donkey do new tricks....For laughs you should ask her mom if the baby came out black like her what would she say...LOL..
Well, NYC is the biggest melting pot but like you said everyone is so stay away from me and ignorant its hard to learn about one another...sometimes you can even sense it walking from barrio to barrio without even getting out your car...And you would think all these immigrants would put their heads together for the sake of their community but they rather tear each other down...sad
Well, when I use to play soccer we had alot of black ecuadorians on our team and they were cool and very genuine people but unfortunately they felt outcaste by their own people....To tell you the truth some deny their hispanic background and merge with afro-american or the carib... It seemed all of them new each other and where to find other black ecuadorians...its like they had a secret society among them...Anyway, it will take the new generation and the diaspora to re-educate the misguided blind folks...
Even Dominicans are coming to grip with their culture and background whether they like it or not...because others (S. Americans) will never accept that indio oscuro or indio claro propagando and see them for what they look like....mulattre et negre..
My motto is you can say and be whatever you want to be but the mirror never lie....
Anyway, enough on this race BS and just enjoy your fiancee and make the best of your relationship and never let your family or hers dictate your home...
BTW, do you speak Quechua..whenever my co-worker gets me upset I tell him to teach me Quechua..He gets upset and says "I dont speak it and finally admits that his grandparents spoke it"...
Also if you go to El conde their is a nice little Ecuadorian shop in the middle on the left hand side that sells indegenous stuff from Ecuador...She is very nice and is fluent in Quechua...
jalencastro said:some great posts in here! sorry i havent responded but let me see what i can add in here...
hey guys, by the way no offense taken at all by these comments/opinions! i feel if we are to learn anything about this issue that plagues all latinos/people of the world we need to address it and talk about it! so keep it up!
Quisqueya, i agree with you entirely with S.Americans having a misconception of mulattos and blacks worldwide. i think this problem is just a lack of education. not only thati think there is also a sense of not wanting to accept that history and or accept anything that is african. really sad if you ask me. sometimes i wonder if this problem perpetuates itself on american soil. i feel somewhat blessed and cursed to live in NYC because it is the melting pot of the world, where else can you find such a rich variety of races and people in one city? then again it is so segregated and neighborhoods and people are so mean to one another....ALL OVER! i mean what the deal? I think when there is a lack of education of history, along with this deep rooted hate of anything that is not white/eurpean doesnt help at all. what bothers me too is that parents have a huge role in this and somehow they preach this hate to their children. how many times have i heard mothers say to their children 'stay away from that black person' and thats to anyone that looks black [can be PR, DR, haitian whatever...] sad
yes ecuador has a black/mulatto city? i dont know it...unfortunately even though i was born there i came here when i was a baby and never went back. i need to know more about my country and learn! but my father did mention that place. funny how it is segregated from the rest of the population, but then again can you blame them for it? i need to ask more ecuadorians about it and see what their response/opinion on it is. do you remember the name of that town/city? its on the tip of my tongue.
NOTE one thing i do know that ecuadorians mention about that place is that the black populaiton there have these BLUE EYES! like its some weird thing! the nerve! it always makes me wonder why they stress that point out like its some weird thing...you're right lack of education breeds ignorance, sheesh!
now that ecua at your job that rants and raves about his children's physical appreance kills me. its sad, but that is the mentality with a lot of latinos. something that kills me though is that many people from the island are brought up to think this way too....so sad. one example is my fiancee's mom who is as black as can be. i swear if i didnt know she was dominican or speak spanish i would guess the woman is african [no offense to anyone]. but she is so happy for us getting together. it baffles my mind to hear her talk about us [my fiancee and me] to her friends and say that our kids will have good hair! damn...sometimes i wonder if i am not helping the situation. i would like to think i am, but sometimes i wonder....damn cant i just be happy with my future children no matter what they look like? i mean it will be my flesh and blood and i gotta think about what their hair will be like? sigh...
also sorry your co worker cant get over the fact you are haitian...hte world is pretty f-ed up...sigh...
oh and to answer your question, yes i did say i am 100% ecuadorian and i mean it since i was born there. now i think of myself as mestizo even though my parents are an odd mix. my father is pretty white/light skinned, my mom is lighter indigenous. i came out darker than both of them. my younger brother came out white...we are all MUTTS! LOL but hey thats my family and i love and accept them. now if i look at my uncles and aunts, cousins and everyone [though i dont know them personally], photos i see them look very mestizo, part indian but on the 'lighter' side. whatever. point is i accept my indian heritage, i am not shunning it or am i ashamed of it. all i do is look at my 2 grandmothers who are alive and well and i see the indian in them. and a picture of my great grandmother affirms that my family is rooted from indians so i know where i come from. i get a kick out of that....no offense, but im glad i could feel where i come from thanks to my grandmothers and their pictures, brings a smile to my face
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hey!
i have a hard time joking about race enough as it is...its a very touchy issue, though i can only imagine what my future mother in law would say if i told her i want a BLACK baby! sheesh....i'll let that one be. but in any case what i DO want is a baby girl! i dont care what my baby looks like, thats my baby! LOL
your co-worker needs to be slapped! sheesh...sometimes i am ashamed that is a fellow ecua...
you know my parents arent that bad with relations with other races or countries, but i know it does bother them. more so my mother than my father. my father is cool as hell and loves my fiancee and is very open minded! so i can talk to him about my issues, but all in due time.
sorry i cant respond too much....i need more time
but on the real, i cant wait to leave already!
15 more hours! he he! DR here i come! :beard:
thanks for the response! i dont have time to write back at all since im swamped at work....wish we could sit down and talk more about this complex issue...but i really like a lot of your points. and no i dont speak Quechua...i wish i did...but then again i have no one to talk it to? LOL maybe my great grandmothers?Quisqueya said:
i have a hard time joking about race enough as it is...its a very touchy issue, though i can only imagine what my future mother in law would say if i told her i want a BLACK baby! sheesh....i'll let that one be. but in any case what i DO want is a baby girl! i dont care what my baby looks like, thats my baby! LOL
your co-worker needs to be slapped! sheesh...sometimes i am ashamed that is a fellow ecua...
you know my parents arent that bad with relations with other races or countries, but i know it does bother them. more so my mother than my father. my father is cool as hell and loves my fiancee and is very open minded! so i can talk to him about my issues, but all in due time.
sorry i cant respond too much....i need more time
but on the real, i cant wait to leave already!
15 more hours! he he! DR here i come! :beard:
15 more hours!!!..Damn you lucky fils de ...... Wow, have fun dude..its going to be a hell of a trip and experience..you are in for a culture shock...LOL...and dont forget to hit that spot..realy nice bags there....damn, ok I'm starting to hate on you..LOL..BTW, there is a nice haitian restaurant that I would recommend to you...food is great...get a taste of haitian culture while you down there..take your creole pocket book..LOL..........
Have fun...
Have fun...
jalencastro said:
While I think this thread has been thoroughly hijacked, there are black ecuadorians in NYC. I remember reading an news article a few years back of over a black ecuadorian living in Queens it was either in the Times or Daily News. This is the same way as the the black Hondurians that hang in the Bronx during the summer that hand at that park parallel to the Bruckner...hahahaha. They feel the need to keep a low profile...yet be among their peeps.
By the way, my aunt is married to an Ecuadorian. Overall, based on what I've seen I find ecuadorian men to make much better husbands than Dominicans.
By the way, my aunt is married to an Ecuadorian. Overall, based on what I've seen I find ecuadorian men to make much better husbands than Dominicans.
Lol
hey, did i forget to mention that this is my THIRD time to DR? so im no stranger to the locale! LOL i will be on the lookout for all places of interest. and some haitian food? now that i have to try!
speaking of haitians! thats another issue i got! why does DR hate on haitians so much? i mean not only are they neighbors, but damn its the same mix of people just speaking different languages! sheesh....why all this hate?
by the way go peep my url:
http://members.migente.com/jmomo
i will definately be adding more to it after this trip!
dont hate on me! LOLQuisqueya said:
hey, did i forget to mention that this is my THIRD time to DR? so im no stranger to the locale! LOL i will be on the lookout for all places of interest. and some haitian food? now that i have to try!
speaking of haitians! thats another issue i got! why does DR hate on haitians so much? i mean not only are they neighbors, but damn its the same mix of people just speaking different languages! sheesh....why all this hate?
by the way go peep my url:
http://members.migente.com/jmomo
i will definately be adding more to it after this trip!
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