Sosua Beach Unions Want More Involvement

[ctrob]

I remember the pretty drawings.
So, does anyone know if we have any pretty drawings showing the wonderful new beach?

 

[Tamborista]

That is a very old foto, post Helpee, pre Museum of Image & Sound was completed!

 

[D'Arcy (Apostropheman)]

And if someone tries to build on that first 60 meters (or otherwise control access to it by blocking public roads), the government would remove them. Just like what finally happened at Encuentro to the beach vendors and the company that tried to block public roads that accessed that beach. All the vendors had to move back and there are only a few of those vendors left. By the way, that took YEARS and only happened after the corrupt mayors of Cabarete were gone.

The vendors who are squatters on private land behind the public 60 meter access on Sosua Beach are indeed being misled by such statements.

If they've been paying rent, and they have. are they squatters? I'll answer that for you windo, that a NO

Do you actually know about the people that manage the rent and renting, rent collection, approvals of new leases, etc...on Playa Sosua? Do you think for one second that they would not take action if someone tried to set up a business on the beach without their permission and them getting a cut?

 

[ctrob]

If they've been paying rent, and they have. are they squatters? I'll answer that for you windo, that a NO

That depends to whom they've been paying rent. If they're paying it to someone who didn't have permission to build on the that private land in the first place, then the person who built the vendor shack is a squatter and the person who rents it is a squatter. But if they have an agreement with the actual land owner, then no, they're not squatters.

The other part of this equation, is that about half the vendor shacks are currently in the 60 meter setback. So they definitely do not have permission to be there. That 60 mtr setback belongs to all Dominicans, not just a few that want to take advantage of it.

Do you think for one second that they would not take action if someone tried to set up a business on the beach without their permission and them getting a cut?

Maybe, maybe not. We all know how these things work. One person moves in and throws up a blue tarp. Is the land owner immediately aware of it? Probably not. Starts out very slow, maybe just ignored by the land owner, then over time it just grows into a village. But as of now, they're being asked to vacate.

 

[windeguy]

"I shared my opinion.
And I respect yours.
To listen to one another is another way to learn.
Always we can learn by exposing ourselves to other perspectives." - @LindseyKaufman

@LindseyKaufman shared this with and I am passing on the thought on to you @windeguy

Have a good day my man‼️

The salient point in this case is that your so-called opinion, if I understand it correctly since there were some contradictions within your posts, is not based upon reality.

 

[windeguy]

If they've been paying rent, and they have. are they squatters? I'll answer that for you windo, that a NO

If they are paying rent to those who don't own the land then they are simply squatters "once removed" . Are they still squatters? YES. And with no legal standing to get reimbursed for being displaced. D'arcy, there were dozens of houses on El Rocon Beach heading down to what is now Kite Beach. Among those houses were business built with block and rebar, an A frame chalet and many more. For MANY years. One day the owners had all of those houses removed. Why did they wait so long? I have no idea, but all of those places are long gone and nobody who was displaced was paid anything.

Do you actually know about the people that manage the rent and renting, rent collection, approvals of new leases, etc...on Playa Sosua? Do you think for one second that they would not take action if someone tried to set up a business on the beach without their permission and them getting a cut?

I have been told that current businesses sometimes pay "rent" to the former business owner. Neither the former nor current business owners, based upon all information readily available, do not own the land upon which the businesses are located. That land is owned by the family mentioned in news articles posted previously in this thread.

I have no idea what the motivations of the actual owners were in waiting for so long. You would have to ask them directly. As I mentioned the name of the family is in the news posted previously, so feel free to ask them.

 

[windeguy]

D'arcy, if you build a house or business on someone else's land, you are a squatter.
You, for some reason, insist that a person who rents that property from you, is not also a squatter.
What difference does that make if the owner wants all squatters off their land? Are the business owners you
contend are not squatters going to sue the land owner for removing them?

If you want to find out why the owners of the actual property where the beach businesses are located waited so long to do anything, and also why they didn't care that others collected rent on that land, here ya go, contact them directly:

Don Andrés Pastoriza, representing the Tavares and Pastoriza Tavares families, donated part of their land for the solution proposed by the government.

Changes in Sosua Beach and Nightlife Dominican Republic

Changes in Sosua beach and nightlife announced by DR president Luis Abinader and major Willy Olivences on a Sunday morning.

www.goldenkeymanagement.com

 

[Yourmaninvegas]

The salient point in this case is that your so-called opinion, if I understand it correctly since there were some contradictions within your posts, is not based upon reality.

The salient point in this case is that your response above is not based on the even most basic understanding of the English language.

Opinion
a view or judgement formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.

Most everything you write in response to my posts is an opinion. I rarely see you actually quoting any sources to support your statements as facts. So spend some time and learn the meaning of the words in English language that you are using before responding next time. And remember, moderators have also told me that this is not a debate forum.

Have a great day @windeguy ‼️

 

[windeguy]

That depends to whom they've been paying rent. If they're paying it to someone who didn't have permission to build on the that private land in the first place, then the person who built the vendor shack is a squatter and the person who rents it is a squatter. But if they have an agreement with the actual land owner, then no, they're not squatters.

Agreed.

The other part of this equation, is that about half the vendor shacks are currently in the 60 meter setback. So they definitely do not have permission to be there. That 60 mtr setback belongs to all Dominicans, not just a few that want to take advantage of it.

Oh my. Half of them are within the public area? Wow. Those should have been long gone. Someone will ask if you have absolute proof of this.

Maybe, maybe not. We all know how these things work. One person moves in and throws up a blue tarp. Is the land owner immediately aware of it? Probably not. Starts out very slow, maybe just ignored by the land owner, then over time it just grows into a village. But as of now, they're being asked to vacate.

Perhaps the reasons for the decades long delays will come out. Inquiring minds want to know.

 

[windeguy]

The salient point in this case is that your response above is not based on the even most basic understanding of the English language.

Opinion
a view or judgement formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.

Most everything you write in response to my posts is an opinion. I rarely see you actually quoting any sources to support your statements as facts. So spend some time and learn the meaning of the words in English language that you are using before responding next time. And remember, moderators have also told me that this is not a debate forum.

Have a great day @windeguy ‼️

Then I have NO IDEA what your point is because it has not been clearly stated by your various posts.

My point is simple. The squatters have NO rights. They have no legal say in what will be done. They can be gone in an instant with no compensation.

 

[Yourmaninvegas]

@D'Arcy,
You are your wasting your keyboard strokes on the keyboard warriors making statements about things they have no direct knowledge of.
My experience as a property owner and dealing with other property owners is very different than the actions that were taken by the owners of the Beach Front property.
My experience within the Dominican Republic as a property owner has been whenever a owner feels that somehow I have violated their property rights they are in my face within hours demanding money and with threats to bring in the controlling legal civil authorities. And I have had to refer them to my Abogada more than once.
The entire idea that these "poor" property owners at the victims continues to be a line of
That the property owner clown crew continues to proffer.
But now that they have decided to enforce their property rights, there is nothing the Beach Venders can do.
The the property rights clown crew will clap for joy while in their lawn chairs (gas masks on for sure) at the misfortune of the Beach Vendors.
A real quality group of individuals in my opinion

 

[Yourmaninvegas]

Then I have NO IDEA what your point is because it has not been clearly stated by your various posts.

My point is simple. The squatters have NO rights. They have no legal say in what will be done. They can be gone in an instant with no compensation.

"I shared my opinion.
And I respect yours.
To listen to one another is another way to learn.
Always we can learn by exposing ourselves to other perspectives." - @LindseyKaufman

Have a good day @windeguy‼️

 

[windeguy]

What difference does it make how long the owners waited based upon anyone else's previous experience? A plan for the renovation of Sosua Beach has been in the works for decades. The plan was on display at Ayumtamiento in Sosua. It has gone through some changes based upon donations of the land owners to the government. The President of the DR is reported to be coming very soon.

Property rights are based upon laws, not upon people being good or bad. Is is a shame for those paying rent that for most of them their time is up? Of course. Are the owners bad people because they are evicting them? Some people seem to think so.

I suppose the business people who will be displaced without compensation can try and sue those whom they were paying rent. Good luck with that.
The only one getting any money will be the lawyers.

(I heard that the owners collecting rent insist on being paid via their Swiss bank accounts and only in DOGECOIN - NOTE that is a joke )...

 

[ctrob]

Oh my. Half of them are within the public area? Wow. Those should have been long gone. Someone will ask if you have absolute proof of this.

You can see it on Google Earth. If you click on the "measure/ruler" icon you can measure back from what looks like the High Tide mark inward for 60 meters. Not exactly scientific but it gets you close. Depending on the Google Earth you have loaded, you can actually pick the time of day and see the High Tides. A lot of them seem to be within the 60 mtrs, especially on the Charimicos end.

This is probably why the gov't is involved in the clean up. The land owner doesn't have the authority to force evictions on the 60 meter setback. That's really the gov't's job. But the owner/developer needs the whole thing taken care of prior to construction, not just their private property portion.

 

[jd426]

D'arcy, if you build a house or business on someone else's land, you are a squatter.
You, for some reason, insist that a person who rents that property from you, is not also a squatter.
What difference does that make if the owner wants all squatters off their land? Are the business owners you
contend are not squatters going to sue the land owner for removing them?

If you want to find out why the owners of the actual property where the beach businesses are located waited so long to do anything, and also why they didn't care that others collected rent on that land, here ya go, contact them directly:

Changes in Sosua Beach and Nightlife Dominican Republic

Changes in Sosua beach and nightlife announced by DR president Luis Abinader and major Willy Olivences on a Sunday morning.

www.goldenkeymanagement.com

Pretty Amusing that D used to " Manage Property" as a Business .
makes you wonder who he was managing it for since he does not understand simple Legal terms ..

 

[JD Jones]

Many years ago there was a lot more sand on the beach there.

 

[CristoRey]

All this talk about property leases and whether or not Jose, Maria, Toronto Mike, Big Jamal or Fat Tony (from da Bronx) have a legal right to challenge any decisions made by this governmemt going forward, got me thinking...
It's not at all uncommon for other people to just assume ownership of property in and around Sosua when someone dies or goes to prison.
The 100 or so apartments located in that building directly behind Hotel Europa in El Batey are a perfect example of what I'm talking about.
From what I understand it was built with drug proceeds by two brothers. One is dead. One is in prison.

 

[zoomzx11]

As I remember it was about four years ago the sand washed out and left bare slippery rocks that made it dangerous to try and cross.
When it first happened I thought the city would come in with trucks of sand and replenish the beach since it was no longer a beach in its present condition and due to the fact that the beach is one of the nicest things about the town.
Nothing happened and it was obvious the city had no interest in making the beach better for the residents and visitors.
I thought it was disgraceful and would never have happened in a first or even second world country.
Politicians in a democracy enter politics to make things better for the people they are supposed to serve.
In the DR people enter politics to get rich.

 

[Dieguito]

From Detras del Rumor thi afternoon June 23

PUERTO PLATA,- En el de hoy el Ministerio de Turismo y Asociación de vendedores de la playa Sosúa arribaron a un acuerdo de reubicación, luego de una importante reunión que sostuvieron con el ministro David Callado.
Dentro del acuerdo se dio a conocer la construcción de otra plaza para completar la reubicación de todos los miembros, con esta nueva plaza que se agregará sumarán tres en total en el proyecto de remoción y rescate de la afanada playa del municipio turístico de Sosúa.
El ministro Collado se hizo acompañar de varios funcionarios locales donde figuran la señora Gobernadora Claritza Rochtte, el Director general del teleférico de Puerto Plata Atahualpa Paulino y el Alcalde del municipio de Sosúa Willy Olivence (El Chamo)

 

[cavok]

"Dentro del acuerdo se dio a conocer la construcción de otra plaza para completar la reubicación de todos los miembros, con esta nueva plaza que se agregará sumarán tres en total en el proyecto de remoción y rescate de la afanada playa del municipio turístico de Sosúa."

Doesn't make sense, but it sounds like there will now be three plazas(?).